8MP Team Game - The Axis team

[Telemecus]

Wonderful -welcome aboard. We are a team of two matrix heroes which me makes tremble in awe - but not as much as the Soviets will!

Any preferences? Timmeh originally signed up for South and lowsugar North, and has covered Centre for turn 1. I guess the easiest would be to take on Centre from when we get turn 2 back - but does this suit you? Later in the game it might be worth reallocating if it becomes a quiet North and active South, especially if Army Group South splits. But that is a long way away.

When you get to the dropbox you will be able to see our turn 1 files. I also drew up a guide to co-ordinating a multiplayer team game [Edit:see post 12 above]- it is not as easy as people think and previous multiplayer games in the AAR ended spectacularly because of it. It is a work in progress so you may have things you can add, and of course it is just a mental fallback and not replacement for commonsense, communication and fun. I will also condense things discussed in PMs and put them in our dropbox - so, at your option, you can know all team planning and discussion from when we started.

I am also taking the chance of being less operational to look at the game in different ways and am putting some of my own analysis in dropbox. Laugh, ignore or comment on as you prefer. I wanted to create an AAR which was more than just a screenshot of each turn, and thought of using that analysis for it, but do not have any firm ideas on the AAR.

I posted a spoof video of our first Generals meetup - see post 12! You will have to tell us which one are you. I guess beautiful women and classical music go with the French wine? [:D]

The teams are not looking at each others thread. But our signals intelligence analysis unit can identify when posts are made and reports intense activity in the last 24hrs. Also our agent in Helsinki reports intercepted enemy communication here. Not content with the German led counter-invasion international coalition it seems those Soviets now want to bomb neutral Finland - I suspect Finland will be joining us in a couple of weeks. Whatever will they do next, invade neutral Persia?

[Stelteck]

I'am ready to fullfill any task the high command set to me !! (Of course if i have necessary forces to do so, or expect me to complain a lot. Probably expect me to complain anyway).

Center will be perfect. It is probably better not too swap generals too much in order we got attached to our minions.

Of course i'am not really aware of the objective of army group center. Maybe i could stay idle with my troops while others army group do all the hard work ? Is there something interesting to take in the center ?

[Telemecus]

ORIGINAL: Stelteck
(Of course if i have necessary forces to do so, or expect me to complain a lot. Probably expect me to complain anyway).

Guderian would be proud of you!

Not much to do in centre - I believe there is a village called Moscow or something we might go for.

The houserule 4 that we cannot advance when isolated (100+ MPs) in the signup thread could be very significant, and inspite of what the signup thread said it is full blizzard. (Our agents believe Soviet agents interfered with the Geneva oversight committee on that one.) It does mean a broad front strategy and hard constraints on breakthrough movements during the summer. I posted a suggested rail repair map in the dropbox, but there are important weaknesses as well as strengths of it given this rule. There is not an overall strategy statement (yet?) beyond what we know from experience of the game. But I do not think the historical Germans did really either! Comments and advice welcome.

[Stelteck]

Ok got it.
I just read the turn sequence. Very detailed. Thank you.

As army group center commander, i take responsability of all troops and planes of units attached to army group center. Please do not touch these units, whatever their position in the map. Or transfert them to OKH for reallocation using AP.
We are currently waiting soviet turn ?

[Telemecus]

We have finished turn 1 and are waiting for Soviets to do their turn. Our last save game file that you can look at to see our turn end is "EightMP-Axis 1.4 SupComEnd." The file with 1.5 is after I hit the turn end button, so needs Soviet password to see map. I renamed the previous turns by each player so they are consistent and you can see them too.

As SubCommander you have the option to use the troops and planes in your command as you wish with the constraints of
i) Allocations finalised at the start of each turn
ii) Other team rules as in the guide such as not doing auto night missions

You can see the final allocations for turn 1 in the dropbox. Note the difference between control (move and attack) and command which includes the right to reassign, change leaders as well as control (unless allocations say otherwise). So you will see in turn 1 some units in 2Pz are in your command but under South control. Control outside command is meant to be temporary. Similarly there may be some air units on an airbase in your command that allocations say is not in your control. For instance there may be a transport unit kept in reserve for all commanders, and this means the airbase cannot be moved until/unless the transport control is released by the other Commander or they transfer it out of the airbase. Again this should be occassional, temporary and rare. In general planes and ground units in your command are yours to use.

As Supreme Commander I may use or transfer planes at the beginning before Subcommanders take their turn. Commanders should conduct air operations that are best done with their land operations e.g. after ground combats involving fighter interdiction or moving staging airbases into previously enemy controlled hexes and then bombing units before attacking or displacing them etc. Air operations best done after land operations (e.g. long range recon and bombing) can be done by you at your option, or left to Supreme Commander at the turn end.

Other than these exceptions above anything in your command will only be touched or moved by you.

The allocations give you your own budget of points. You can reassign within your own command. And you can assign to OKH. You can only reassign from OKH if you assigned to OKH that turn, or if allocations gave you that unit. You can only assign to or from another command if allocations say so.

During your turn you can temporarily control the OKH HQ unit if you move it generally in the same direction (North to South, or South to North) as the team plays. So you can use it to help in 2 stage reassignments of units. Sometimes it will be cheaper in points that way (not so much with recent versions), and for transfering SUs a long way that may be the only way. But use of the OKH HQ is there as a help, it is not obligatory.

At least that is the theory - I imagine there will be many rough edges and we will still need to talk to each other and use commonsense, in particular at the beginning.

[STEF78]

ORIGINAL: Stelteck
.../...

I'am currently in command of a security division securing french vital asset in the southwest of France (See picture of asset below).
.../...

C'est un Bordeaux! 1945 will be an awesome year for Bordeaux wine but not sur that you will still be there to appreciate it [:D]

[Stelteck]

ORIGINAL: STEF78
C'est un Bordeaux! 1945 will be an awesome year for Bordeaux wine but not sur that you will still be there to appreciate it [:D]

So true. According to this totally 200% accurate world map of the future, in 1945 i will probably be in the great America Reich subduing some sort of native rebellion....

[Stelteck]

So much victories this turn !!!

The soviet union have no troops left !! Soon they will have to surrender.


In the south, soviet troops falled in the trap and tried to encercle a german panzer division !!! They are doomed now !!!


As a professionnal officer, i have to respectfully protest against the fact that my fellow generals from north and south army groups use the fact that i was on holidays in France for...hem. important reason... to strip my beloved and most important central front of all its ressources. I have no more panzer, construction units, reserves. I have nothing !!!!

How can i expect to achieve any objectives with such low ressources !!! It is impossible. Nein nein nein nein !!

Our Führer surely will not approve this, and will heard of this !!! I'am writing a letter right now !!!

[Telemecus]

ORIGINAL: Stelteck
I'am writing a letter right now !!!

Perhaps a cold shoulder and organise a petition too? [:D]

I offer my fellow generals a choice - the pistol or the poison pill. Much more persuasive. But I can be persuaded by some of that buildup of wine, sorry, military supplies in SW France?

[Telemecus]

At Guderian's insistence Timmeh received a court-martial. Apparently he marched into the HQs of 1st cavalry division and 255 infantry division and commandeered them at gunpoint. The court martial was dropped on the basis of battlefield circumstances and exigencies of war justiying the action. But Timmeh is becoming the badboy general of the Wehrmacht. 😛

[Timmeh]

Listen, Das Reich wanted to come with us. We told them, No! Go home, but they followed anyway. Das Reich does what it wants.

As far as the Cav unit... AGS directive #7E states: Permission? Ain't nobody got time for that.


We blame the miscommunication on some new hires due to excessive furloughs in AGC.

Our new man. A Col.Clink? Yes, that's it. He says his men saw nothing, NOTHING!

[Stelteck]

AGN north general was too drunk, after... party... to sent proper order so i replace it this turn. We are waiting now supreme general to stamp the turn and it will be ready.

[Telemecus]

ORIGINAL: Timmeh
AGS directive #7E states: Permission? Ain't nobody got time for that.

Timmeh is wrong - I looked it up in the regulations book.

ORIGINAL: AGS directive #7E
No officer above the rank of Mess Sergeant is permitted to go into combat with pierced nipples

[Hermann]

oh Timmeh for shame =)

[Telemecus]

Strategic choices

Our 8 multiplayer team game is the 1941-5 bitter end campaign game with
-full winter (not what the sign up thread seemed to indicate!)
-fog of war
-non-random weather
-no Soviet combat bonus

With additional house rules
1. No soviet resupply of partisans before turn 10.
2. Naval invasions and paradrops ARE allowed.
As for paradrops, there are two limits.
a) May only drop within 10 hexes from an in-supply soviet unit
b) Only one target (which may consist of several units dropping in several connected hexes) per 3-month period.
Basically the idea is not to exploit this feature, while at the same time forcing the German player to take the threat of paradrops into consideration when it comes to rear-area security units.
3. No Finnish units may move outside the no-attack-zone unless Leningrad has been captured by Germany. Soviets have indicated they nevertheless will garrison the no-attack line.
4. No unit may deliberately move forward into isolated status (defined as being more than 99 MPs from a railhead). Units that are isolated due to being surrounded may only move towards supply. The only exception to this rule is air-landed units which may move in any way. This may have the common sense interpretation that it applies only to clear weather and not from partisans cutting rail lines.
5. The game is supposed to be fun and historically plausible, they players agree to play accordingly and not try to exploit the game engine or do ”gamey” stuff.
6. If one side feels there is a violation of rule 5, the issue will be discussed and decided on a case-by-case basis by the two commanders.

These house rules have implications for strategy.

House rule 4 in particular necessitates a broad front strategy - probably best for a team game. This also has been described as the "no Leningrad capture on turn 6" rule. It reduces the potential, and so use, of HQ Buildups, air fuel drops etc. Potentially it could see a successful Axis advance stop dead 100 mps from the railhead facing empty space even with fuel tanks full. But this does not necessarily improve supply/truck use and so on. Being isolated means no trucks for supply at all, and no replacements. Being always in supply means trucks are used at the longest distances always and replacements are only choked by setting maximum ToEs. And in 1942 it means concentrating in one sector is less effective, and deep thrusts to Baku or Astrakhan impossible.

House rule 4 has an important interplay with choices on rail repair. A favoured rail repair strategy is to use the protrusions in the far North (the Baltic repair zone) and far South (Rumania) to jump start the Axis rail network. This coincides with big targets like Leningrad, Moscow and the Don industry, but leaves North and South unconnected. With house rule 4 Kursk and the centre of the Pripet marshes could be unreachable in 1941. By the winter of 1941 having the Soviets with a central salient from Kursk, well that would be history two years early.....

Finally house rule 4 interplays with house rule 3. The Soviets could be confident there will be no "right hook" at Lake Ilmen while it is too far for supply. And even if the Germans could get to the Svir this alone would not activate the Finns, German panzers would be on their own there. And winter would be close. With no "right hook" the Soviets can concentrate just on defending Leningrad proper - and "no Leningrad on turn 6" means they will have plenty of time. Leningrad in particular looks more difficult in 1941.

On the other hand it does reduce the risk for the Axis. A "spectacular" for the Soviets in the winter of 1941 would not be as catastrophic as they would hit the same hard constraints, as would the later war Soviet steamroller.

It may also increase the importance of rail lines and rail repair later in war, especially where they are sparse in the East. Strategic cutting of rail lines could be as important as manpower or industry.

So the choices in 1941 - Leningrad, Moscow, Kursk, Ukraine - and the rail repair and force dispositions needed to make them may differ from other games. Similarly in 1942. And in...

We hope to do a retrospective after Barbarossa on the choices we made, and what were the consequences.

[Post 35 and 36 have been moved to post 12 - this was post 37]

[Telemecus]

Turn 1 25-June-1941 Axis Centre

Twenty nine units in Bialystock pocket including at least five motorised divisions. Nine further units pocketed west of Minsk including at least two motorised divisions.

Centre was covered by our North commander lowsugar this turn.



[Post 35 and 36 have been moved to post 12 - this was post 50]

[Telemecus]

Turn 1 25-June-1941 Axis South

A large pocket between Lvov and Kremenets with 21 units including 10 motorised. Eight units in the Kovel pocket including three motorised and five more south of Brest-Litovsk. A further ten are in a salient on the Hungarian border including two mountain divisions. Armies on the Rumanian border will remain frozen next turn.



[Previous post 37 has been moved to 35 - this was post 51]

[Telemecus]

I have invited the Soviets temporarily to our AAR. It was to discuss our team protocol, and tut at Timmehs shameless behaviour with Das Reich. There will be a delay before their arrival, so any objections say so before then. I thought this better than reposting elsewhere, and all our screenshots, secrets etc are still in dropbox. But if wrong I am to blame.

[Stelteck]

No problem !!! They can admire an envy our rightfull and efficient organisation as they want.

[EwaldvonKleist]

Impressive planning so far, it will be interesting to which extent you can use it in praxis. Obviously the Soviet team which hasn't collected experience in Poland, Norway and France isn't that well organised, but we will improve. The small pocket south of Pskov was a result of lacking communication between the Soviet northern and the central front.
Despite this, the Red Army was the first in the world to use the revolutionary "dropbox" system, which got copied by many armies.