Night Fighter vs. Night Fighter

[JeffroK]

ORIGINAL: Helpless

the game is using the same calculations/procedure for day & night escorts

No

Then somethings broke.

[Helpless]

Then somethings broke.

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[Rugens]

Had thought this issue had been resolved but apparently not.

Just started a two player game and ran into similar results. I’ve no desire to step through thread but my impression is that Pavel felt there might be a bug but nobody sent him a save.

My input is pretty straight forward. This is a simulation game and as such it should allow players to function in a manner roughly with the same capabilities and restrictions governing the actions of the decision makers of the period. It is of course impossible (and not desirable) to incorporate every little aspect of history but this issue is not exactly little. What the game allows are tactics without precedent in the period that yield results significantly inconsistent with the capabilities of equipment of the period.

That being said I would never attempt to dissuade my opponent from doing what he did. As players it is our job to play the game in the best way we can using all of the tools the game gives us (excepting agreed upon house rules). It is the designer’s job to develop an enjoyable game that defines parameters that will restrict player’s actions to “reasonable” historically possible play. In the current reality of our fairly small hobby, it is the job of the community to help the designers refine the game. As opposed to a couple of comments earlier in this thread, I don’t see raising these issues as complaining. I see raising these issues and the consequent discussion as a necessary part of this refinement process. WITPAE stands out to me as a great example. WITPAE is not for everybody but through the cooperation of the designers and the community, the result is probably the most thoroughly developed, bug free historical simulation to date.

Since this thread dates back to March I am curious to hear what players feel about the issue at this point in the games development 9 months later.

[loki100]

I've made some use of the new night air superiority mission. In a PPBEM its hard to gauge the effectiveness (I know its happening as my units take some losses). Vs the AI it certainly works, whether it is particularly effective compared to simply using the NFs for bomber escort is a different issue.

[Rugens]

To attach a numbers perspective, the German Night Fighter loss was 175 aircraft (most with pilots). That means nearly 1/3 of the entire German Night Fighter force is destroyed in a single one week turn by tactics and a capability that simply did not exist in the period. I'm struggling to use the term simulation in the same sentence.

[Helpless]

Feel free to share a save which can be used to replicate odd results.

[Rugens]

Glad to. Hope it helps. Here is the save file that is after the allied execution of the turn. If you need the file before the allied player executed the end of his turn I will need to see if my opponent has the file and is willing to share. Let me know if that is the file you need.

BTW, playing with 1.01.12

Save Game File

[Helpless]

Yes, we need save before the event. Thanks.

[bairdlander2]

I sent Carl my save before air execution and after air execution.

[Rugens]

Mike was able to find these two. If you need anything further along he will try to locate.

Save from Allied turn - Air Planning (About midway through Air Planning phase):
T2a



Just in case this once may be of any benefit.

Save from Allied turn - After Air Execution (Before end of turn):
T2b

[bairdlander2]

Has this issue been resolved?It is a bug in that particular server match?

[Helpless]

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