Strategic Movement (Naval)

lenin · Post by **lenin** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 2:06 pm

Sorry for the noobish question.

In the 1803 scenario, my British fleet outside the large French Fleet in Brest wishes to run away before it is rapidly eaten up. Now, IIRC, the British fleet has an initiative of 85 against the French 75. However, the French fleet seems to always emerge instantly, engaging the British fleet before it has a chance to move even the one zone away that would ensure its survival. Now I don't want to set it to evade combat, or the French Fleet will sail happily up the channel, defeating the much smaller British fleets in detail before dropping a large army in the UK. I was hoping the British fleet could retreat a zone or two (and be in range of support of other British fleets) before turning to fight. As it is, it seems to be badly mauled every time (at least in pbem / instant combat), leaving the French with immediate naval and land superiority over the British.

Is this working as intended, or have I just been consistently unlucky with rolls etc?

lenin · Post by **lenin** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 2:27 pm

Never mind, this is a non-question. Worked out what I was doing wrong!

Hard Sarge · Post by **Hard Sarge** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 2:45 pm

Kewl, normally, it is the French who are worried about running into the English fleets when the pull out of breast

lenin · Post by **lenin** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 3:20 pm

In 1803, the British fleet outside Brest is outnumbered 2-1 by the French Fleet. In instant combat, it might be best to move away?

Mraah · Post by **Mraah** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 4:16 pm

ORIGINAL: lenin

Never mind, this is a non-question. Worked out what I was doing wrong!

[&:] ... What did you do wrong?

Rob <-- noob as well.

Hard Sarge · Post by **Hard Sarge** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 4:37 pm

2-1, but what kind of ships, what kind of morale, leadership, upgrades ?

of course, in Quick Combat, bad things can happen to good people

1803 ?, let me look around

lenin · Post by **lenin** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 4:39 pm

I just misread the manual. Don't think initiative has any relation to the order that units move on the strategic screen, just the liklihood they complete their moves.I think the actual move order is random. Think I have managed to work out how to avoid half the home fleet being wiped out on the first turn, I hope. Just a shame some of it is all down to the luck of the dice.....

lenin · Post by **lenin** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 4:49 pm

ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge

2-1, but what kind of ships, what kind of morale, leadership, upgrades ?

of course, in Quick Combat, bad things can happen to good people

1803 ?, let me look around

The French have 1 Frigate, 24 3rd class and 4 1st class, morale of 5.

The British fleet has 11 3rd class and 4 1st, morale of 6.

The British also need to beware of the Dutch fleet - 12 3rd and 1 1st, morale 6. This is easily blockaded.

The British have numerical superiority in the theatre, but their fleets are spread out. Many of the "extra" ships are 4th class, and not much use in a stand-up fight.

The trick for the British is to find a way to concentrate their fleets without them being defeated in detail in instant battle, particularly if on turn 1 the French get the wind gauge (which eliminates the British morale advantage - 66% chance for attacker.

Interesting operational problem on turn 1, eh?

Russian Guard · Post by **Russian Guard** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 4:51 pm

"breast"? that qualifies as a Freudian slip, I'd say [:D]

Hard Sarge · Post by **Hard Sarge** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 5:16 pm

not for me it don't

Dutch Fleet ? nothing to worry about there, other then a going up vs a fleet of frigates, the Dutch Fleet is a lot seaweed waiting to happen, you want that Fleet at sea, what you don't want is Nappy getting his hands on the Dane Fleet

in 1803, you only have the French to worry about, you don't Need Nelson or Keith in the south, bring them up, the Dutch have to go north, before they can reach the channel, be waiting for them, shift one of the channel fleets to help out in Breast

it is going to be 15 to 29 (I thought I counted 5 SOLs ? for the English ??)

now instand or quick combat is going to be pretty much numbers vs numbers, HW will bring some skill to it

you may want to let that blocking fleet, evade, the French get out, they get out, just have the routes covered, let Nelson or Cornwallis be the heroes

the French Fleet isn't really going to go anywhere, it heads towards the channel, it got to run into Cornwallis, it heads towards the Med it is going to run into Nelson

you get all the bad rolls, you may get spanked alittle, you get some rolls, you will cripple the French navy

Hard Sarge · Post by **Hard Sarge** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 5:47 pm

ahh your right, it is 4 SOLs, I must of miscounted

LOL, lady luck don't like me, get the battle, and am the attackers, and get the wind in my face, start to get close, and start to shift my line of sail, and the wind changes and again is in my face

Hard Sarge · Post by **Hard Sarge** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 5:49 pm

okay lets see

here are where my fleets should be

Hard Sarge · Post by **Hard Sarge** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 5:50 pm

and the north

Hard Sarge · Post by **Hard Sarge** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 5:51 pm

ahhhh, 15 to 29, oh boy, if nothing else, got to do some damage, let Nelson or Cornwallis finish them off

hehe yea right

Hard Sarge · Post by **Hard Sarge** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 5:52 pm

and the wind changes

ahhh, and that was going to be so pretty

Hard Sarge · Post by **Hard Sarge** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 6:10 pm

well this is not good, not seen this happen often, my fleet is becalmed, almost nothing can move, and the wind is not blowing the smoke away, I really need a wind shift

Hard Sarge · Post by **Hard Sarge** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 6:12 pm

and while I can't bragg about my gunnery, one of my SOL got a lucky shot off and blew up one of the French ships, another put one on fire

so, I am doing a little damage, there morale is taking a good hit

Hard Sarge · Post by **Hard Sarge** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 6:16 pm

LOL

what a pain in the butt, I had one ship able to move one hex, and that is the one in the back of the fleet, who turned the wrong way early on, and only 3 ships were able to see the enemy to fire

I wonder if Nelson ever had days like this ?

oh, but the French lost another point of WTF

so from 21 to 20, it is 18 to 20

Hard Sarge · Post by **Hard Sarge** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 6:41 pm

been a slow battle, still got the wrong wind, but slowing am hurting the French, they are stuck as much as I am, but what I can hit, I can hurt

one that helped had one ship get 3 crit hit in a row

4 ships have stuck and 1 has exploded, WTF is starting to fall on both sides, but faster on there side then mine (Better Morale helps)

(not getting pounded helps too)

lenin · Post by **lenin** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 7:12 pm

You are right. 2-1 in detailed combat is no problem - just cross the "T" and sinks a couple of them. But what about instant combat? Your fleet can't always move, outnumbered 2-1. It loses, despite more morale, better upgrades, leaders etc. Try some instant combat. That is pbem. What happens then? You lose?

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