Questions for first time and repeat customers
Moderator: Arjuna
RE: Questions for first time customers
Banquet,
We are exploring options for just such an intro movie. Are you volunteering to help? [:)]
We are exploring options for just such an intro movie. Are you volunteering to help? [:)]
RE: Questions for first time customers
Hi, I've wrangled my way through several sesssions of HttR and now find myself learning CoTA. Your AARs are fine, but please consider forming your instructive lessons within the framework of common understanding. For example, the initial CoTA tutorial assumes knowledge of NATO symbology which may preclude Newbie-learning. Simply put, the novice player may be attemtping to learn the game system while using the "figurative" counters/icons which are NOT supported during the tutorial!?!
Moreover, when AARs are presented with the goal of generating new player interest and general player development, why use language that only experienced players will understand? Shorthand information and an assumed player-level of experience may short-circuit any public relations effort IF readers aren't familiar with the terminology used or simply don't yet have the experience with the style of gameplay on display in CoTA and HttR?
Both are great games with a strong community but to create more excitement might require making the game more accessible to the wider public with instructive training modules that also make the game experience more fun and educational.
It's ONE thing to be the commander; it's entirely another thing to know HOW to be the commander.
Moreover, when AARs are presented with the goal of generating new player interest and general player development, why use language that only experienced players will understand? Shorthand information and an assumed player-level of experience may short-circuit any public relations effort IF readers aren't familiar with the terminology used or simply don't yet have the experience with the style of gameplay on display in CoTA and HttR?
Both are great games with a strong community but to create more excitement might require making the game more accessible to the wider public with instructive training modules that also make the game experience more fun and educational.
It's ONE thing to be the commander; it's entirely another thing to know HOW to be the commander.
RE: Questions for first time customers
bugbear,
Good points. [:)]
Good points. [:)]
RE: Questions for first time customers
I tried my hand at an AAR to help proselityze.. i understand it s the only game in town to convert people.
Personally , and i m going to get blasted for this ... but i was "given" RDOA to try and had it sitting around for weeks before i got my head around the concept.
What i love most about the game is the realism , the confusion of the battlefield , the orders delay and the amazing command structure.
Personally , and i m going to get blasted for this ... but i was "given" RDOA to try and had it sitting around for weeks before i got my head around the concept.
What i love most about the game is the realism , the confusion of the battlefield , the orders delay and the amazing command structure.
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RE: Questions for first time customers
Third time costumer here (RDoA, HttR, CotA).
AAR-mini guide was awesome. I would filter out user feedback from before consolidating in a single document.
AAR-mini guide was awesome. I would filter out user feedback from before consolidating in a single document.
RE: Questions for first time and repeat customers
1) I eagerly followed COTA on the Matrix Boards
2) I've always wanted this game
3) I had HTTR (maybe I misunderstood the questionaire)
4) I did play the RDOA long ago
5) eclectic but mediterreanean
6) I've purchased a lot of Matrix Games
For marketting AARs: the more detail and good graphics the better. I find the stream-of-consciousness more convincing than precisely edited copy, though. Why not have both?
Or have one comment on the other?
The corpus of a thousand battles rises from the flood.
RE: Questions for first time customers
I finally got my brother to buy one of these and I gave a copy of HTTR to a friend.
So there are new peple coming in slowly.
The corpus of a thousand battles rises from the flood.
RE: Questions for first time customers
ORIGINAL: MengCiao
I finally got my brother to buy one of these and I gave a copy of HTTR to a friend.
So there are new peple coming in slowly.
Great to hear. Thank you.[:)]
Promoting the game
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]The game is mostly movement with pausing to give orders. As a result screen shots do not do the game justice. Only a movie can give the correct flavour.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]As to the current screen shots: When the game is zoomed right out, or zoomed in 1 notch or 2 notches, the units look all bunched together. This gives a bad impression to newbys. All screen shots should be zoomed in to medium or more.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]Also, when units are moving, often the foot print of the unit is visible. The foot prints are ugly. Screen shots used for promoting the game should never have the footprints visible.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]There is a screen shot utility called Hyper-Snap. They also have a “movie screen shot utility”.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]I would suggest using this utility to make a movie. You can edit the movie and write text on the screen.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]The movie should have no music and no voice over and no sounds because ultimately the file size would become too large. I have written the outline of a script below. Now we need a director and a producer[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]The characters would be 1 infantry battalion, 1 armoured battalion, 1 heavy MG unit and 1 artillery unit[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]And 1 “map boss” with 1 supply depot .[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]The first scene opens with the infantry deployed. The camera follows the mouse which clicks on the Inf Bn HQ and the blue and green command lines are shown. The map boss ought to be in the picture.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]The subtitle would read “Infantry battalion with it’s 4 companies”[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]The camera pans to follow the curser which now clicks on the armour Btn HQ. Command lines still visible.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]The subtitle would read “Armoured battalion with it’s 4 companies”[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]Then the MG unit is attached to the infantry battalion and the arty is attached to the armoured battalion. Together with subtitles so the audience knows what is going on.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]The camera follows the curser as “move” orders are given to the armour and then to the infantry.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]They move only a short distance as this movie is not feature length.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]The enemy is spotted and the cursor seen to click on the enemy unit and check the intel.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]As the infantry move to the FUP, the armour puts fire onto the enemy from a flank. Then the infantry assault through.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]Roll credits.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]As to the current screen shots: When the game is zoomed right out, or zoomed in 1 notch or 2 notches, the units look all bunched together. This gives a bad impression to newbys. All screen shots should be zoomed in to medium or more.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]Also, when units are moving, often the foot print of the unit is visible. The foot prints are ugly. Screen shots used for promoting the game should never have the footprints visible.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]There is a screen shot utility called Hyper-Snap. They also have a “movie screen shot utility”.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]I would suggest using this utility to make a movie. You can edit the movie and write text on the screen.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]The movie should have no music and no voice over and no sounds because ultimately the file size would become too large. I have written the outline of a script below. Now we need a director and a producer[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]The characters would be 1 infantry battalion, 1 armoured battalion, 1 heavy MG unit and 1 artillery unit[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]And 1 “map boss” with 1 supply depot .[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]The first scene opens with the infantry deployed. The camera follows the mouse which clicks on the Inf Bn HQ and the blue and green command lines are shown. The map boss ought to be in the picture.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]The subtitle would read “Infantry battalion with it’s 4 companies”[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]The camera pans to follow the curser which now clicks on the armour Btn HQ. Command lines still visible.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]The subtitle would read “Armoured battalion with it’s 4 companies”[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]Then the MG unit is attached to the infantry battalion and the arty is attached to the armoured battalion. Together with subtitles so the audience knows what is going on.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]The camera follows the curser as “move” orders are given to the armour and then to the infantry.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]They move only a short distance as this movie is not feature length.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]The enemy is spotted and the cursor seen to click on the enemy unit and check the intel.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]As the infantry move to the FUP, the armour puts fire onto the enemy from a flank. Then the infantry assault through.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"]Roll credits.[/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
[font="compatilfact lt regular"] [/font]
RE: Questions for first time and repeat customers
I assume that for the query purposes I fall into the "first time" category although I actually purchased Panther Game's Firebridgade for Mac back in 89.
(1) How did you become aware of COTA?
I always keep an eye open for military sims and onther intersting games on the net.
(2) What led to your decision to purchase COTA?
Reading Matrix' forums + Googling around the net + recently reading a book on the Mediterranean campaigns.
(3) Why hadn't you previously purchased RDOA or HTTR?
Good question. At the time the only place I had a Windows box was at work. I 'm a Mac+Unix user for reasons where Windows is not an option. Now I have and old Window box at home I'm eagerly awaiting a new Macbook Pro whcih will enable me to run my preferred Win games as well. After the release and purchase of COTA there seems contraproductive to buy HTTR (HTTR = RDOA+ rebranded under Matrix cover, right?)
(4) Prior to the purchase did you try the old RDOA demo that can still be found on the Net for download?
I think I breifly tried it out at work some years ago when I didn't have a private Windows box and was a bit fed up with Arnhem.
(5) How would you characterize your PC gaming interests?
Coming from a boardgaming background (AH (anyone old enough to guess where my nick comes from?), SPI, Victory Games etc) in the 80-ies, my preferred focus is military sims (preferrably WWI), WWx military flight sims, the occational FPS) but also management games like Civilization, Europa Universalis, Hearts of Iron etc
I bought Panther Games first (?) offering Fire Brigade for mac back in 1989 as my first "real" computer game (I was concurrently developing a basic HyperCard based WWII military sim that never got finished
)
As a general statement about the only games that have left a lasting positive impression are Civilization, TacOps, Close Combat series (I was a frustrated beta tester for CC3 on a mac running Virtual PC!) , the Combat Mission series (during the mac days), Operation Flashpoint, Red Orchestra (both as an Unreal Tournament mod and currently as Red Orchestra Ostfront) + some "normal games" (Myst etc)
Had I been a Windows guy I guess I'd added some others to the list.
(6) Prior to your purchase had you previously purchased other Matrix Games offerings?
I have considered other games but not actually purchased anything.
I believe Matrix' other games offerings up until now (the future might differ) with Panther Games as an exception are underachievements by people stuck in a board game state-of-mind which is a great turn-off for me; The ones I have seen from Matrix and others (HPPS) are just board games in a computer environment coupled with a make-shift AI.
I'm not interested in pushing virtual stacks of virtual die-cut cardboard markers around a virtual hex map turn by turn. That was great for board games in the 1960-80ies, but hey, we have computers now! Panther realized that as early as 1989 but almost nobody else in the operational mil sim industry seems to have had a clue yet - and nothing happened until the very same company finally made a modern release of the system in AA: RDOA - which surprises me.
Panther Games inventiveness rule and I'll be with you in the future. Just give me my eastfront games (all the way from Finland to Kaukasus and from Stalingrad to Berlin). Come to think of it I might even consider Western Europe as well...
-- Greup (10-3)
(1) How did you become aware of COTA?
I always keep an eye open for military sims and onther intersting games on the net.
(2) What led to your decision to purchase COTA?
Reading Matrix' forums + Googling around the net + recently reading a book on the Mediterranean campaigns.
(3) Why hadn't you previously purchased RDOA or HTTR?
Good question. At the time the only place I had a Windows box was at work. I 'm a Mac+Unix user for reasons where Windows is not an option. Now I have and old Window box at home I'm eagerly awaiting a new Macbook Pro whcih will enable me to run my preferred Win games as well. After the release and purchase of COTA there seems contraproductive to buy HTTR (HTTR = RDOA+ rebranded under Matrix cover, right?)
(4) Prior to the purchase did you try the old RDOA demo that can still be found on the Net for download?
I think I breifly tried it out at work some years ago when I didn't have a private Windows box and was a bit fed up with Arnhem.
(5) How would you characterize your PC gaming interests?
Coming from a boardgaming background (AH (anyone old enough to guess where my nick comes from?), SPI, Victory Games etc) in the 80-ies, my preferred focus is military sims (preferrably WWI), WWx military flight sims, the occational FPS) but also management games like Civilization, Europa Universalis, Hearts of Iron etc
I bought Panther Games first (?) offering Fire Brigade for mac back in 1989 as my first "real" computer game (I was concurrently developing a basic HyperCard based WWII military sim that never got finished

As a general statement about the only games that have left a lasting positive impression are Civilization, TacOps, Close Combat series (I was a frustrated beta tester for CC3 on a mac running Virtual PC!) , the Combat Mission series (during the mac days), Operation Flashpoint, Red Orchestra (both as an Unreal Tournament mod and currently as Red Orchestra Ostfront) + some "normal games" (Myst etc)
Had I been a Windows guy I guess I'd added some others to the list.
(6) Prior to your purchase had you previously purchased other Matrix Games offerings?
I have considered other games but not actually purchased anything.
I believe Matrix' other games offerings up until now (the future might differ) with Panther Games as an exception are underachievements by people stuck in a board game state-of-mind which is a great turn-off for me; The ones I have seen from Matrix and others (HPPS) are just board games in a computer environment coupled with a make-shift AI.
I'm not interested in pushing virtual stacks of virtual die-cut cardboard markers around a virtual hex map turn by turn. That was great for board games in the 1960-80ies, but hey, we have computers now! Panther realized that as early as 1989 but almost nobody else in the operational mil sim industry seems to have had a clue yet - and nothing happened until the very same company finally made a modern release of the system in AA: RDOA - which surprises me.
Panther Games inventiveness rule and I'll be with you in the future. Just give me my eastfront games (all the way from Finland to Kaukasus and from Stalingrad to Berlin). Come to think of it I might even consider Western Europe as well...

-- Greup (10-3)
RE: Questions for first time and repeat customers
Greup,
In answer to your question, HTTR wasn't simply a repackaged RDOA from a different publisher. There were quite a few enhancements to the game. One of the most significant, in my opinion, was that RDOA only modeled down to the battalion level where as HTTR modeled down to the company level.
Thanks for taking the time to answer the survey! Enjoy the game (even if you are forced to run it under Windows).
In answer to your question, HTTR wasn't simply a repackaged RDOA from a different publisher. There were quite a few enhancements to the game. One of the most significant, in my opinion, was that RDOA only modeled down to the battalion level where as HTTR modeled down to the company level.
Thanks for taking the time to answer the survey! Enjoy the game (even if you are forced to run it under Windows).

2021 - Resigned in writing as a 20+ year Matrix Beta and never looked back ...
RE: Promoting the game
ORIGINAL: Joe 98
The game is mostly movement with pausing to give orders. As a result screen shots do not do the game justice. Only a movie can give the correct flavour.
I second that.
Movements, manoeuver, delays, it's what this engine is about. No screenshot is able to render that.
And I do agree that the movie should have subtitles or any indication about what is going on.
JeF.
Rendez-vous at Loenen before 18:00.
Don't loose your wallet !
Conquest Of The Aegean Web Development Team
The Drop Zone
Don't loose your wallet !
Conquest Of The Aegean Web Development Team
The Drop Zone
RE: Questions for first time and repeat customers
ORIGINAL: MarkShot
One of the most significant, in my opinion, was that RDOA only modeled down to the battalion level where as HTTR modeled down to the company level.
Not 100% accurate : British and US arborne were modeled down to the company level. Most germans and XXXth corps were not. Some combat simulations (especially regarding big Flak Bn) were a bit odd IIRC.
HTTR gave a much better experience overall and came with scenarios covering the whole MG op.
FYI, all differences are listed in the HTTR game section on the website in my sig.
JeF.
Rendez-vous at Loenen before 18:00.
Don't loose your wallet !
Conquest Of The Aegean Web Development Team
The Drop Zone
Don't loose your wallet !
Conquest Of The Aegean Web Development Team
The Drop Zone
RE: Questions for first time and repeat customers
1) How did you become aware of COTA?
After reading the reviews and comments about HTTR, I followed the development to COTA.
(2) What led to your decision to purchase COTA?
I wasnt interested enough in the Arnhem setting but the COTA theatre just gave me an itch I had to scratch.
(3) Why hadn't you previously purchased RDOA or HTTR?
I was playing other games and dont like to have too many games going at once. I am working my way through the COTA tutorial and am hooked.
(4) Prior to the purchase did you try the old RDOA demo that can still be found on the Net for download?
No.
(5) How would you characterize your PC gaming interests?
Wargames (CMBB and CMAK, Combat Command 2: Danger Forward!, Combat Command 2: Desert Rats!, Korsun Pocket), COD, Adventure (does Sam and Max fit in that genre?)
It would be great to see more WWII theatres not covered.
Burma, New Guinea, Phillipines.
(6) Prior to your purchase had you previously purchased other Matrix Games offerings?
Korsun Pocket and Across the Dnepr, War Plan Orange
After reading the reviews and comments about HTTR, I followed the development to COTA.
(2) What led to your decision to purchase COTA?
I wasnt interested enough in the Arnhem setting but the COTA theatre just gave me an itch I had to scratch.
(3) Why hadn't you previously purchased RDOA or HTTR?
I was playing other games and dont like to have too many games going at once. I am working my way through the COTA tutorial and am hooked.
(4) Prior to the purchase did you try the old RDOA demo that can still be found on the Net for download?
No.
(5) How would you characterize your PC gaming interests?
Wargames (CMBB and CMAK, Combat Command 2: Danger Forward!, Combat Command 2: Desert Rats!, Korsun Pocket), COD, Adventure (does Sam and Max fit in that genre?)
It would be great to see more WWII theatres not covered.
Burma, New Guinea, Phillipines.
(6) Prior to your purchase had you previously purchased other Matrix Games offerings?
Korsun Pocket and Across the Dnepr, War Plan Orange
RE: Questions for first time and repeat customers
I would take the RDOA demo of the internet as I imagine it would do more harm than good.
COTA and even HTTR are so far removed from RDOA now.
COTA and even HTTR are so far removed from RDOA now.
RE: Questions for first time and repeat customers
The Internet is not a BBS. Once something reaches it, it never truly dissappears. The RDOA demo is no longer available from Battlefront or Panther Games, but it can easily be found.
Personally, I don't believe the RDOA demo has much of an impact one way or another. Although it does seem clear that the development resources needed to make an up to date COTA demo would not be justified.
Personally, I don't believe the RDOA demo has much of an impact one way or another. Although it does seem clear that the development resources needed to make an up to date COTA demo would not be justified.
2021 - Resigned in writing as a 20+ year Matrix Beta and never looked back ...
- HansBolter
- Posts: 7374
- Joined: Thu Jul 06, 2006 12:30 pm
- Location: United States
RE: Questions for first time and repeat customers
If COTA is the first Panther Games product which you have purchased, then would you please be so kind as to respond to the following questions. (If you have yet to purchase COTA but are waiting for the boxed version or intend to purchase it soon, then feel free to respond.)
(1) How did you become aware of COTA?
Coming Soon advertisements on the Matrix site.
(2) What led to your decision to purchase COTA?
Fell in love with the game mechanics system in HTTR
(3) Why hadn't you previously purchased RDOA or HTTR?
I own HTTR but this is the first I have even heard of RDOA...what is it?
(4) Prior to the purchase did you try the old RDOA demo that can still be found on the Net for download?
(5) How would you characterize your PC gaming interests?
75% WWII wargames and 25% fantasy role playing
(it's a long story but basically in order to be able to wargame one night a week when my best friend got married we had to agree to participate in something his wife enjoyed as well so we all became table top D&D players one night a week as well and my interest in that genre has stuck)
(6) Prior to your purchase had you previously purchased other Matrix Games offerings?
Yes. I own Korsun Pocket, Across the Dnepr (best depiction of that portion of Barbarossa since Panzer Gruppe Guderian), Battles in Normandy, HTTR, Uncommon Valor and World at War.
Thank you for your time.
(1) How did you become aware of COTA?
Coming Soon advertisements on the Matrix site.
(2) What led to your decision to purchase COTA?
Fell in love with the game mechanics system in HTTR
(3) Why hadn't you previously purchased RDOA or HTTR?
I own HTTR but this is the first I have even heard of RDOA...what is it?
(4) Prior to the purchase did you try the old RDOA demo that can still be found on the Net for download?
(5) How would you characterize your PC gaming interests?
75% WWII wargames and 25% fantasy role playing
(it's a long story but basically in order to be able to wargame one night a week when my best friend got married we had to agree to participate in something his wife enjoyed as well so we all became table top D&D players one night a week as well and my interest in that genre has stuck)
(6) Prior to your purchase had you previously purchased other Matrix Games offerings?
Yes. I own Korsun Pocket, Across the Dnepr (best depiction of that portion of Barbarossa since Panzer Gruppe Guderian), Battles in Normandy, HTTR, Uncommon Valor and World at War.
Thank you for your time.
Hans
-
- Posts: 899
- Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2001 8:00 am
- Location: England
RE: Questions for first time and repeat customers
(1) How did you become aware of COTA?
Via Matrix coming soon announcements
(2) What led to your decision to purchase COTA?
It seemed an innovative approach, especially the vector graphics idea
(3) Why hadn't you previously purchased RDOA or HTTR?
Hadn't heard of them
(4) Prior to the purchase did you try the old RDOA demo that can still be found on the Net for download?
No
(5) How would you characterize your PC gaming interests?
Strategic/operational/tactical - and historical rather than games
(6) Prior to your purchase had you previously purchased other Matrix Games offerings?
Yes laods, but don't have time to play them as I'm addicted to WITP
Thank you for your time.
Via Matrix coming soon announcements
(2) What led to your decision to purchase COTA?
It seemed an innovative approach, especially the vector graphics idea
(3) Why hadn't you previously purchased RDOA or HTTR?
Hadn't heard of them
(4) Prior to the purchase did you try the old RDOA demo that can still be found on the Net for download?
No
(5) How would you characterize your PC gaming interests?
Strategic/operational/tactical - and historical rather than games
(6) Prior to your purchase had you previously purchased other Matrix Games offerings?
Yes laods, but don't have time to play them as I'm addicted to WITP
Thank you for your time.
RE: Questions for first time and repeat customers
RDOA = Red Devils Over Arnhem
This was actually the first game of the series (published by Battlefront in 2001).
This was actually the first game of the series (published by Battlefront in 2001).
2021 - Resigned in writing as a 20+ year Matrix Beta and never looked back ...
- HansBolter
- Posts: 7374
- Joined: Thu Jul 06, 2006 12:30 pm
- Location: United States
RE: Questions for first time and repeat customers
Ahh, I gues I missed that one.
There is an old AH area movement board game called Storm Over Arnhem. It is a fast paced highly playable and fun game. They carried the area movement mechanics system into two other games, one on Cassino and one on Stalingrad. I have all three on the shelf
There is an old AH area movement board game called Storm Over Arnhem. It is a fast paced highly playable and fun game. They carried the area movement mechanics system into two other games, one on Cassino and one on Stalingrad. I have all three on the shelf
Hans