i hear pirates imitate your ship designs

[taltamir]

I hear pirates imitate your ship designs...
does that mean that if i put death ray or a racial tech on my ships then soon those would be found in pirate ships?

[Fishman]

Yes. So unless you want this to happen, resist the urge to design such ships.

[Bubblewrap]

Hmm, on that note, do pirates also have to deal with maintenance costs?

[Bloodly]

Even if they did, how much would it count for? They get the majority of their cash from deals with you or other AI, and they don't maintain large fleets anyway.

[Fishman]

ORIGINAL: Bubblewrap

Hmm, on that note, do pirates also have to deal with maintenance costs?

Nope. Pirates don't have economies, other than fuel. Maybe.

[Wicky]

I wonder if anyone has ever designed frigates with cargo bays/shipyard/production plants on purpose just to see if the pirates would imitate them?
What would be fun is, if you don't build that frigate, you just build cruisers with normal design and then have to fight un-armed frigates who bring useless industrial plants to the fight!

[Drusek]

As Im building only capital ships I didn't encounter this problem and as I read somewhere pirates don't copy capital ship designs

[BigWolfChris]

I realize that this is probably done to keep pirates a threat beyond colony stage, but surely they should making their own designs based on the average tech researched (or maybe a tiny bit less advanced)
Especially since this makes you enemy become your own design values

[JonathanStrange]

If those pirate ships are indeed "pirates" and not just hidden nationality vessels or privateers attacking your shipping. Perhaps, too,  some governments not only pay the pirates but supply 'em with more powerful ships. As for imitating ship designs, that's a puzzle to me except if our designs are being shopped around by spies.

[taltamir]

its not a problem of design but of technology jonathan... where are they getting the tech to build such designs? Because I haven't shared my deathray tech and nobody else has it.

Question... if I pay pirates for information / protection, does it cause the creation of more pirate ships / more pirate factions?

Because in the late game i tend to go in and buy all their info... last game it was just over 300,000 credits.

[Malevolence]

ORIGINAL: taltamir

its not a problem of design but of technology jonathan... where are they getting the tech to build such designs? Because I haven't shared my deathray tech and nobody else has it.

Likely from the freighters and warships they are pillaging.

[taltamir]

ORIGINAL: Malevolence

ORIGINAL: taltamir

its not a problem of design but of technology jonathan... where are they getting the tech to build such designs? Because I haven't shared my deathray tech and nobody else has it.

Likely from the freighters and warships they are pillaging.

HA! as if those pitiful pirates could pillage MY warships. And my freighters are unarmed.

[VarekRaith]

ORIGINAL: Fishman

Yes. So unless you want this to happen, resist the urge to design such ships.

Oy, I don't like the idea of having to underpower my ships for fear that a pirate faction will magically pilfer the design a technology. Perhaps this should be tied into the espionage system? Counter intel could help prevent them from obtaining your designs verbatim?
Or, heck, have them design their own ships without stealing my designs?

[&:]

[frugaldude]

ORIGINAL: taltamir

I hear pirates imitate your ship designs...

How do we know this?

[taltamir]

ORIGINAL: frugaldude

ORIGINAL: taltamir

I hear pirates imitate your ship designs...

How do we know this?

people said so on the forums. Also I never said "We know" I said "I hear"

[VarekRaith]

ORIGINAL: frugaldude

ORIGINAL: taltamir

I hear pirates imitate your ship designs...

How do we know this?

I've seen pirate vessels with my exact design name (a randomly generated Elven name) and exact load outs.

[frugaldude]

ORIGINAL: VarekRaith

ORIGINAL: frugaldude

ORIGINAL: taltamir

I hear pirates imitate your ship designs...

How do we know this?

I've seen pirate vessels with my exact design name (a randomly generated Elven name) and exact load outs.

Thanks,

I am always amazed at the amount of detail available in this game.

I did a cursory check of some of my saves. What you say is likely correct. It appears the pirate AI acquires its designs randomly from the design pool of all the active empires in a game. The chance of the player's design being used would likely be based upon the number of empires in the game. That is, if there are 10 empires in a game there may be about 10% of the pirate ships of the player's design.

Always interesting to examine game mechanics.

[Fishman]

The chance of that is actually much higher than 10%, due to natural selection: AI-designed ships are quickly destroyed. Additionally, there seems to be a bug in that mechanic that causes some designs to be duplicated repeatedly, often your designs, which greatly increases the chance they will be picke.

[frugaldude]

ORIGINAL: Fishman

The chance of that is actually much higher than 10%, due to natural selection: AI-designed ships are quickly destroyed. Additionally, there seems to be a bug in that mechanic that causes some designs to be duplicated repeatedly, often your designs, which greatly increases the chance they will be picke.

It would only be natural selection if the pirates were able to build its ships from its own design pool. Do pirates retrofit? I doubt it. And if not, the current designs of even the most powerful ships will age and fall prey to newer models. Their replacements will be randomly drawn from the galactic design pool. (admitted speculation)

I like the idea of pirates utilizing player designs on a limited basis.
I think this makes for a smarter AI. You may always start your game without pirates if you don't want to face your own designs.


I haven't seen the bug you mentioned.

[VarekRaith]

ORIGINAL: frugaldude

ORIGINAL: Fishman

The chance of that is actually much higher than 10%, due to natural selection: AI-designed ships are quickly destroyed. Additionally, there seems to be a bug in that mechanic that causes some designs to be duplicated repeatedly, often your designs, which greatly increases the chance they will be picke.

It would only be natural selection if the pirates were able to build its ships from its own design pool. Do pirates retrofit? I doubt it. And if not, the current designs of even the most powerful ships will age and fall prey to newer models. Their replacements will be randomly drawn from the galactic design pool. (admitted speculation)

I like the idea of pirates utilizing player designs on a limited basis.
I think this makes for a smarter AI. You may always start your game without pirates if you don't want to face your own designs.


I haven't seen the bug you mentioned.

Err, my issue is that the pirates get my latest designs magically. Love to see how they managed that. I don't mind them stealing the designs but, I want my intel guys to be able to counter that. Right now, it's way too gamey. Heck, I've seen them field ships of my design that I haven't even built yet.