Main/Port Supply

[MattFL]

Simple question (i think)

Japan can only ever be on main supply in Japan. Otherwise, always on Port Supply. True?

Assuming true, and seems to be from what I've seen, why isn't Bangkok a main supply source? I've read on here about people talking about Rangoon being a main supply source for the allies (thread on flipping back and forth between main/port supply). Why would Rangoon be a Main supply source and Bangkok not?

"....minor capitals in a home country hex that is owned and controlled by a country which has not surrendered is a main supply source."

Seems Bangkok fits this description. Thoughts?

[stjeand]

True.

Rangoon should NOT be main supply for the Allies and should never be. The Allies have no rail connection to India.
That is something broken in the code. I have never seen it be a main supply so what I have read is odd. Then again I don't play the Allies often enough that late in the game...

Bangkok is not a main supply due to the fact it could likely only supply the Bangkok army...not the entire Imperial Japanese army. Just does not have the resources as a country to do that. That is why they have a specific logistics value. For me that is what they are able to supply max. Once they hit that they just do not have the resources beyond.

Honestly I don't think India should be able to fully supply the entire Indian army, UK army and US army IF they were all there. They do not have the resources for that. But the game does not track those things.
The limit should be Logistics plus port supply, UNLESS that country has a rail connection to their major ally.
But I suspect that is difficult to code.

[MattFL]

Ok thanks, that's what i thought. It's just the manual says differently. I agree that Thailand should not be main supply for the Japanese, but it would be nice if it was for Thai Troops. Would give the Japanese reason to send resources to Thailand other than to be a Truck Factory.

Speaking of India, in one of my 3 ongoing games i had Delhi surrounded by 3 armies/3 Divisions for at least 6 months, probably longer, and just could never take it despite bombing and attacking it turn after turn from 6 hexes. The reason - my guys were on basic supply most of time due to the raging war around Bombay (also "surrounded" down to around 4-5 hexes at one point) never getting replacements and the Corps in there rebuilding literally every turn despite being surround on all sides due to Dehli being main supply. Seems a bit off that India can supply everyone (i.e. it was primarily US/UK Troops fighting in the defense of India) and Bombay doesn't act like a "Port" but rather just infinite supply to all Allies. Seems also off that a surrounded city has unlimited supply forever....Or maybe that's how it's supposed to work and i'm just bitter and cloaked in failure.

Last but not least, anyone else notice that Thailand starts the game with rebuild/replace at 1 i think. But if you change it, you can only change it to 0 or 10. I don't think it's possible to put it back to 1, 2, 3 etc.... At least that what i've noticed.

[stjeand]

I agree there should be some limit is a city that is a supply source is surrounded. After some time, it should no longer be a supply source OR at least it should be basic supply.

Correct regarding Thailand. Not sure why...maybe a % of starting economy.

1 point can't do anything ever so it is silly.

[Bo Rearguard]

I'm intrigued that the infamous railroad built with POW labor that linked Bangkok and Burma is already in place at the game's 1941 start. It wasn't actually completed by the Japanese until December 1943. But I suppose with no provision for building railroads in the game it had to be that way.

Completion of the railway probably influenced the Japanese decision to finally execute their disastrous 1944 offensive into India. However, the railway only marginally improved Japanese logistics in Burma, which fell to pieces during the offensive.

[stjeand]

Actually events could be put in place to slowly create the rail link if desired.

Basically and event could be created on specific dates to add a link, sort of like building.

[Bo Rearguard]

Actually events could be put in place to slowly create the rail link if desired.

Basically and event could be created on specific dates to add a link, sort of like building.

Sounds like a good solution, if possible. Hopefully, not having a railroad to begin with it wouldn't cripple the Japanese advance into Burma too badly.

[MattFL]

Will go on record here to say that Main supply in cities totally surrounded and still pulling max supply is a huge flaw. Just sayin'. It's silly.

[AlvaroSousa]

Will go on record here to say that Main supply in cities totally surrounded and still pulling max supply is a huge flaw. Just sayin'. It's silly.

I have to keep the supply system simple. Otherwise it gets abused in a variety of ways.
Then there is CPU time. Unless you want to spend 1-2m waiting for supply to calc out like in WitE.....

Most players won't.

[stjeand]

I would be fine if it took longer for supply if it did it correctly.

But that would have to be determined.

For example...if you have surrounded Stalingrad, how many supplies are stored there before it starts to affect the troops?

Should not be infinite...there should be an end point.

[MattFL]

Will go on record here to say that Main supply in cities totally surrounded and still pulling max supply is a huge flaw. Just sayin'. It's silly.

I have to keep the supply system simple. Otherwise it gets abused in a variety of ways.
Then there is CPU time. Unless you want to spend 1-2m waiting for supply to calc out like in WitE.....

Most players won't.

Well I can’t really see it taking 1-2 minutes to run a check on the main supply cities on the map to see if they are surrounded on all 6 sides (i.e. all land hexes) by enemy units/control. The more complex part would be going from infinite to something else. Even just putting the city on “basic supply” would in large part solve the issue because the defending unit would never get replacements when surrounded. It’s the turn after turn rebuilding of surrounded units that’s the problem.

DISCLAIMER; I have no clue how the game is coded, so maybe this isn’t possible. But if it can already calculate supply for basically every hex/unit on the map, I don’t see it as a stretch. The blockade system already does something more complex….

[AlvaroSousa]

Supply complexity will be increase in WP2 but not calculating enough water to make pasta level.

And, of course, I will keep it all under the hood.

[MattFL]

Bounce.

Just want to reiterate how stupid this is. Surrounded cities getting endless supply is literally stupid. S T U P I D. It's a huge flaw.

Peace.

[AlvaroSousa]

As a game developer I have to weigh CPU processing time with game mechanics. I'm sure you don't want to wait 3m for a turn to go through just to make sure a city has enough supply.

What I wanted to do is trace everything... resources to factories... factories produce supply.... supply distributed. But that would mean a very long turn.

As is WitE takes how long to process a turn? Those kind of wargamers might like that but my game targets everyone. The average player doesn't want to wait 3m for a turn to resolve.

But I learn new processes as I go and test them. I am a one man show. I have no team of experts.

[ncc1701e]

I'm intrigued that the infamous railroad built with POW labor that linked Bangkok and Burma is already in place at the game's 1941 start. It wasn't actually completed by the Japanese until December 1943. But I suppose with no provision for building railroads in the game it had to be that way.

Completion of the railway probably influenced the Japanese decision to finally execute their disastrous 1944 offensive into India. However, the railway only marginally improved Japanese logistics in Burma, which fell to pieces during the offensive.

I have just read your post. Actually I was thinking the same thing but after you. I have proposed an event here:
https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/view ... 5#p5154275

However, in my proposal, the event is triggered in October 1943 not December. Maybe the wrong source, feel free to comment.