Colonization and territorial claims

[martok]

Apologies if I'm bringing up issues that have already been addressed, but I didn't see a reference to them while digging through the last few pages here. Anyway, here are my questions....


1.) Is it going to be possible for multiple empires to have colonies in the same star system? Or does each star system have only one "owner" (presumably whichever empire is the first to establish a station or colony there)?

2.) Similar to question #1: Can more than one empire construct space stations in the same star system? And if so, can multiple empires construct space stations at the same planet/moon?

3.) If you have only a station but not a colony in a star system, does that system still count as part of your territory? Or is it considered "unclaimed" unless/until a colony is established (either by you or another empire)?

4.) Are there "borders" as such? And if there are, are there practical consequences to crossing another empire's border without their permission?

[elliotg]

ORIGINAL: martok
1.) Is it going to be possible for multiple empires to have colonies in the same star system? Or does each star system have only one "owner" (presumably whichever empire is the first to establish a colony there)?

Yes, if there's multiple colonizable planets/moons, then they can be colonized by different empires. However attempting this is a major source of contention. The empire with the larger presence will be offended by the encroachment from the other empire(s).

This scenario is actually a very common and interesting dynamic in the game, and often leads to conflict.

Another twist: small, newly-established colonies are very likely to rebel and join the empire of nearby large well-established colonies. So you can't easily spam your way into a well-established system.

2.) Similar to question #1: Can more than one empire construct space stations in the same star system? And if so, can multiple empires construct space stations at the same planet/moon?

Yes, mining stations, research stations, etc, can be built by multiple empires in the same system. But only one base per planet or moon.

3.) If you have only a station but not a colony in a star system, does that system still count as part of your territory? Or is it considered "unclaimed" unless/until a colony is established (by you or another empire)?

No, you need to have colony in the system before it's considered yours. Having bases in another empire's system is also considered bad form, though not as much as attempting to establish a new colony in their system.

4.) Are there "borders" as such? And if there are, are there any practical consequences to crossing another empire's border without their permission?

The borders are really an empire's claimed systems. But having colonies/systems in close proximity to another empire also leads to friction and conflict. If you attempt to station military forces in another empire's system, they will definitely notice, and may decide to drive you out - though the polite ones might warn you first [:)]

[Sarissofoi]

BTW I remeber that I see some sort of vasssal/subjucated states plicy.
If it is you must conquest them for conquest victory condition this nations who already see you as supreme ruler?
(ofcoze if you take conquest victory condition?)?

[martok]

As usual, my thanks to elliotg for your quick response! [8D]


To just follow up: So you say that strictly speaking, other empires could construct stations, establish colonies, etc., in your own backyard.

My question is, how likely are they to actually do so? Is the AI going to be constantly doing this sort of thing (which would be incredibly irritating), or is it usually going to have the good sense to know better?

[impact]

Well, I assume to construct a colony or station in your "backyard", the AI would need to cloak it so it doesn't show up on your long-range scans. I am going to assume further that building up a supply line to such a position, getting a construction ship there and actually building and maintaining said station without being detected would be expensive and not an easy thing to do. I will certainly give it a try myself once I can get my hands on DW =)

[Xmudder]

I know you can auto queue colony ships to colonize certain planets. I also seem to recall that some colonies with certain races can colonize planets you may be otherwise unable to colonize. Is the automation smart enough to build a ship at, say, an ice world with an ice dwelling population to colonize another ice world?

[elliotg]

ORIGINAL: martok
To just follow up: So you say that strictly speaking, other empires could construct stations, establish colonies, etc., in your own backyard.

My question is, how likely are they to actually do so? Is the AI going to be constantly doing this sort of thing (which would be incredibly irritating), or is it usually going to have the good sense to know better?

The computer empires will evaluate each situation and decide whether they'll attempt anything in your systems - they won't blindly do this. Each race roleplays their personality too, so more aggressive, less cautious races will be more willing to try it.

Establishing colonies in other empire's systems is a high-risk action: you could lose your new colony to the better-established empire (defects), and the other empire will take offense and may attack you. So computer players consider these factors. But if your empire has just established a new colony in a system, other empires won't feel so concerned about honoring your territory. Whereas they are quite unlikely to attempt colonization in your well-established home system.

Also, multiple empires will often have mining stations in an unowned system that is then subsequently colonized by an empire. The other empires will not happily give up their mining stations.

These points of contention (colonies or mining stations in another empires system) show up in diplomatic trades. Empires may offer to trade these contentious colonies/bases in exchange for other things.

[elliotg]

ORIGINAL: Xmudder
I know you can auto queue colony ships to colonize certain planets. I also seem to recall that some colonies with certain races can colonize planets you may be otherwise unable to colonize. Is the automation smart enough to build a ship at, say, an ice world with an ice dwelling population to colonize another ice world?

Yes. The Expansion Planner screen also accounts for all of these variations when it builds colony ships for you.

[PDiFolco]

Thanks elliotg, but please release the game rather than squatting the forum [:D] ! (just kidding of course!)

[Sarissofoi]

Yeah relese the game or we will glass Australia.

[PDiFolco]

Isn't it already mostly a desert ?

[drillerman]

Good Job he is from New Zealand!!!!

[martok]

ORIGINAL: elliotg

The computer empires will evaluate each situation and decide whether they'll attempt anything in your systems - they won't blindly do this. Each race roleplays their personality too, so more aggressive, less cautious races will be more willing to try it.

Establishing colonies in other empire's systems is a high-risk action: you could lose your new colony to the better-established empire (defects), and the other empire will take offense and may attack you. So computer players consider these factors. But if your empire has just established a new colony in a system, other empires won't feel so concerned about honoring your territory. Whereas they are quite unlikely to attempt colonization in your well-established home system.

Okay. Well that makes me feel a little better. I would definitely not have been happy about someone establishing a colony in my home system; anyone who did so would receive a very sharp "lesson", current treaties be damned. [;)]

ORIGINAL: elliotg

Also, multiple empires will often have mining stations in an unowned system that is then subsequently colonized by an empire. The other empires will not happily give up their mining stations.

These points of contention (colonies or mining stations in another empires system) show up in diplomatic trades. Empires may offer to trade these contentious colonies/bases in exchange for other things.

Good to know. I was wondering/hoping that such things could/would be subject to negotiation.


A follow-up question: I seem to recall from another thread that you automatically lose your space stations in a system that's colonized by another empire (if you haven't already colonized it yourself, that is). Is this not the case, and/or perhaps I misunderstood something?

[putzinator]

If you have a mining base on a planet and another race colonizes that planet then you lose the base there.

[ASHBERY76]

ORIGINAL: putzinator

If you have a mining base on a planet and another race colonizes that planet then you lose the base there.

Mining bases are not on planets.

[Webbco]

Did you just call Elliot an Australian? You're in deep doo doo now!! [:-]

Bit of a random question regarding colonisation - Does building a starbase next to a colony that is quite remote from the rest of your empire influence the AI's decision to invade it? I.e. Can defensive structures act as AI colonisation deterrents?

I ask this because if a player finds a planet rich in resources during an exploration mission, they might want to conquer it immediately despite it possibly being quite a distance away from the main growth of the empire . This of course could have a major strategic influence.

[putzinator]

i meant in orbit

[elliotg]

ORIGINAL: Webbco
Bit of a random question regarding colonisation - Does building a starbase next to a colony that is quite remote from the rest of your empire influence the AI's decision to invade it? I.e. Can defensive structures act as AI colonisation deterrents?

Definitely - the AI will consider any defenses at a colony before deciding to invade (as long as it knows about them). Of course, they might decide they just need to send a bigger fleet and invade anyway... [:)]

[Sarissofoi]

I know that drillman. That they have HQ in Auckland.
Then if we glass New Zeland then this game will be never realesed.
My threat is more subtle.
Where do you suppose all this Aussie will be evacuated?
And do you think that Kivi would be happy whene they arrived in mass? I mean in MASS.

[drillerman]