Eurofighter DASS Defensive DECM not operating

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jason oates
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Eurofighter DASS Defensive DECM not operating

Post by jason oates »

Hi everyone, Im playing the Kingdom Come scenario (again) and getting massacred by Rafale fighters using the Same Meteor missile as me. Doh!

The bit i don't get is that the DASS DECM remains inactive throughout the engagements which if active might give me a fighting chance of disrupting these missile inbound.
I guess that if turned on it might interfere with my own munitions but that has to better than have multi million £ aircraft blown away.

Any help would be appreciated cause my morale is sinking against these Rafale fighters that should be an even match.
Dimitris
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RE: Eurofighter DASS Defensive DECM not operating

Post by Dimitris »

Hi,

DECM equipment doesn't need to be activated by the player, it gets used automatically on weapon endgame calculations.

OECM systems (noise jammers) on the other hand must be explicitly activated.
jason oates
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RE: Eurofighter DASS Defensive DECM not operating

Post by jason oates »

Thanks for that. Do you mean they activate when the enemy missile get to within a mile or so?
They need updating on my aircraft i think. There not working very well!
Dimitris
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RE: Eurofighter DASS Defensive DECM not operating

Post by Dimitris »

"They are not working very well" is a bit vague...

DECM systems are not an automagic "I laugh at your missiles" kit. And you are being attacked by a bleeding-edge weapon.

There is more to BVR combat than simply hoping your DECM system will outwit the missile coming at you.
Dimitris
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RE: Eurofighter DASS Defensive DECM not operating

Post by Dimitris »

Moving this to the "War Room" forum, perhaps someone can offer a refresher on BVR tactics.
Kobu
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RE: Eurofighter DASS Defensive DECM not operating

Post by Kobu »

In short i think that the primary role of the DECM system is deny the lock or launch from the enemy planes or SAM. At the beginning of the engagement you turn on the DECM system to avoid a lock and launch until the enemy radar is able to "burn" the jammer and is capable to lock and launch you a missile, when this happen the DECM should be turn off to avoid HOJ.

Regards
jason oates
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RE: Eurofighter DASS Defensive DECM not operating

Post by jason oates »

Sorry Dimitris My Irony was a little too subtle it seems.

"Not Working very well" was meant to be a reflection on my skills etc.
10 out of 10 for your diligence though.

Skydancer
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RE: Eurofighter DASS Defensive DECM not operating

Post by Skydancer »


Hi,
If I may, that would then pose the follow up question, as to how to ‘turn on’ the DECM.

Thoughts, as I for sure don’t know how to turn it on,. Yet one of the earlier replies indicated this happens automatically.

Hoping someone can clear this up a bit for me.

Thanks,
Mike
Rain08
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RE: Eurofighter DASS Defensive DECM not operating

Post by Rain08 »

ORIGINAL: Skydancer


Hi,
If I may, that would then pose the follow up question, as to how to ‘turn on’ the DECM.

Thoughts, as I for sure don’t know how to turn it on,. Yet one of the earlier replies indicated this happens automatically.

Hoping someone can clear this up a bit for me.

Thanks,
Mike

DECMs on any unit will be automatically applied in the weapon hit calculation phase. The game handles DECMs on its own.
stww2
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RE: Eurofighter DASS Defensive DECM not operating

Post by stww2 »

In my experience in Command DECM generally cannot be relied upon to spoof an incoming missile. It's certainly better to have DECM than not have it, as it is an extra potential hurdle for the missile, but usually one that is easily jumped. If you check the weapon endgame logs, you'll see the DECM in action.

The exception is the scenario "Battle of Latakia," where the DECM on the Israeli boats is practically god-tier (in that specific scenario, anyway...I'm sure if you pitted them against more advanced ASMs the DECM wouldn't work as well). But if you want to see the potential power of DECM, that's a great scenario to check out (it is one of the standalone scenarios that comes with the base game).
thewood1
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RE: Eurofighter DASS Defensive DECM not operating

Post by thewood1 »

This was also discussed in this thread.

https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=5001844
You are like puss filled boil on nice of ass of bikini model. You are nasty to everybody but then try to sweeten things up with a nice post somewhere else. That's nice but you're still a boil on a beautiful thing! - BDukes
thewood1
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RE: Eurofighter DASS Defensive DECM not operating

Post by thewood1 »

ORIGINAL: stww2

In my experience in Command DECM generally cannot be relied upon to spoof an incoming missile. It's certainly better to have DECM than not have it, as it is an extra potential hurdle for the missile, but usually one that is easily jumped. If you check the weapon endgame logs, you'll see the DECM in action.

The exception is the scenario "Battle of Latakia," where the DECM on the Israeli boats is practically god-tier (in that specific scenario, anyway...I'm sure if you pitted them against more advanced ASMs the DECM wouldn't work as well). But if you want to see the potential power of DECM, that's a great scenario to check out (it is one of the standalone scenarios that comes with the base game).

I don't agree with this conclusion. ECM/DECM is all about matchups. The Latakia scenario works because ECM was new and the missiles being fired weren't prepared for that. That is real life right out of the "Boats of Cherbourg". DECM can have a insurmountable impact on older missiles or bad shots. Firing an AIM-120D at a Mig-23, and any DECM is going to be woefully outclassed. Fire an AIM-7D at an Su-35 and it pretty much won't have any impact on a good shot. I think this is very well reflected in CMO.
You are like puss filled boil on nice of ass of bikini model. You are nasty to everybody but then try to sweeten things up with a nice post somewhere else. That's nice but you're still a boil on a beautiful thing! - BDukes
jason oates
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Re: Eurofighter DASS Defensive DECM not operating

Post by jason oates »

If that follows, outdated DECM equipped aircraft might as well not bother taking off.
My original post that sparked this quite pleasing debate was about Eurofighter Typhoons armed with Meteor against Rafaele fighters armed with Meteors. The Rafaele seems to be able to detect the Typhoons much earlier and burn through and launch at a greater distance. Given the equality of the weapons the Rafaele must have very good DECM.

Has anyone posted a definitive tactical analysis on how to carry out BVR engagements?
At the present time 2 Typhoons approach with a WRA of 3 missiles per target and engage as soon as they are in detection/missile range. They are likely to be already engaged by the Rafaele and need that DECM. Usual result is 1 or both of the Typhoons lost to 1 Rafaele or maybe to kill at all. After 1 engagement they make a run for home and their SAM cover.
Has anyone got any tactical hints as to how to meet this threat on better terms?
thewood1
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Re: Eurofighter DASS Defensive DECM not operating

Post by thewood1 »

DECM isn't some miracle weapon against every missile. It can be saturated. It can even be adjusted if you know the enemy and its capabilities. But in a sense, you are right. Having an ECM hardened missile attacking you with your 40 year out of date electronic suite puts you at a severe disadvantage.

As to your situation, I'm no AAW expert, but I would create some separation and approach from multiple directions as a start. Its how I set up most of my modern peer-to-peer AAW combat.
You are like puss filled boil on nice of ass of bikini model. You are nasty to everybody but then try to sweeten things up with a nice post somewhere else. That's nice but you're still a boil on a beautiful thing! - BDukes
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