Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

3D version of Close Combat
Nomada_Firefox
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by Nomada_Firefox »

ORIGINAL: PipFromSlitherine

The time is to take good screens and ensure they represent the quality we want. Not the posting [:)]

Cheers

Pip
You have been selling us it for 4 years...........we are tired.......

Do you go to blind our eyes when we play the game? because it looks as if you need show the game only at a exact point.........
Jugger
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by Jugger »

[&:]Yes the promise of screenshots has been requested for sometime now back in September I believe to turn around and tell us that you need more time for good screenshots that accurately represent the quality of the game just reflects that the game is far from ready to show at its current stage. I believe a Beta was also mentioned for a possible release in January well you might as well put your cards on the table and tell us where you are in relation with this happening also as people would rather be disappointed than kept in the dark?[&:]
stoker77
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by stoker77 »

I've been playing since the dial up days on the CC2 ladders. Still play CC every week. I understand the PR and marketing restrictions you must have but this is a fan forum! You'll only get good feedback and appreciation. You have to give me something before another year rolls by. Anything!
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FroBodine
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by FroBodine »

It takes months to decide on the perfect screenshot? Do they have to be photoshopped or something? Is there an actual game anywhere?

If it takes so long just to make a screenshot that is presentable, then this game is nowhere near complete.

I will be very surprised if this game is released in 2017. Perhaps we'll see a screenshot by then. Maybe.

Hoopla.
macroparasite
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by macroparasite »

“Recently we have all been busy re-assessing the requirements for Close Combat “ Re-assessing, in July 2016, something once earmarked to come out in 2014?

Matrix should have done some very serious ‘re-assessing’ when Gateway to Caen came out and was found wanting: tank speeds half what they should be, troops pointlessly re-positioning etc. Faults that were there from the outset of CC1 and never addressed. There was always a problem with AI but as computers became more powerful, when errors could finally be ironed out and the game improved immeasurably, what was the big solution? 3D!

Gateway should have literally been the Gateway. Matrix had an award winning game; one that saw the reality of human fallibility in battle conditions. One that played in real time, not turn or hex based. One that was getting better looking by the year. One that had a devoted following of map makers and modders (I, under various names, was one).

If Gateway had been reassessed and the next game born from it had a new engine, AI sorted etc then we would have no need for the ugly, turn/hex based Battle Academy (I hated it so much still not got past bootcamp!) and its ilk. The money pumped into that pointless nightmare would have turned CC round years ago. Those types of games should be history. Turn based? Why?

Close Combat does not need 3D it simply needs to work. How much reassessment does that simple want/need require?

This morning, playing Panthers in the Fog, I was astounded by an aggressive AI that made short work of my pathetic defence. Yes, a rare event, but it shows there is a world-leading game, a benchmark for others to follow, in the basics and they should have been rebuilt, not just tweaked, back then.

Seeing the team on BF is small it appears Matrix does not, and has sadly never seen, just what a massive game Close Combat could be, but I fear BF is just going to be GtC again – headless-chicken troops, wandering tanks going at half-speed, but, hey, guys, it will be in 3D!!!!! Yawn, wake me up in 2019 when it finally comes out, will ya?
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Platoon_Michael
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by Platoon_Michael »

At this point screenshots would be useless to me.

Anything short of a VIDEO! from the GAME (Being Played).......Not Intro videos.or Cut Scenes
Would be another slap in the face INMHO
STIENER
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by STIENER »

macroparasite makes some good points.
Nomada_Firefox
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by Nomada_Firefox »

ORIGINAL: STIENER

macroparasite makes some good points.
I do not agree with any of them. He should think better what is he saying.

By these reasons.
Matrix should have done some very serious ‘re-assessing’ when Gateway to Caen came out and was found wanting: tank speeds half what they should be, troops pointlessly re-positioning etc. Faults that were there from the outset of CC1 and never addressed. There was always a problem with AI but as computers became more powerful, when errors could finally be ironed out and the game improved immeasurably, what was the big solution? 3D!
Exactly 3D. The 99,9% from the engines at these days are 3D. 2D engines are old and poor. The engine from GTC is the same engine from CC1 with some edits. By these reasons the amount of errors after many edits probably was higher. In fact, it was not thought for to run at modern computers, it is one thing from the previus century.
Gateway should have literally been the Gateway. Matrix had an award winning game; one that saw the reality of human fallibility in battle conditions. One that played in real time, not turn or hex based. One that was getting better looking by the year. One that had a devoted following of map makers and modders (I, under various names, was one).

GTC is exactly FOG with few changes. When it was released, there were not too modders or people making new maps. I do not know who you are.........perhaps because you hide your name with different names. But clearly you are dreaming. How many mods from FOG or GTC can we find?
If Gateway had been reassessed and the next game born from it had a new engine, AI sorted etc then we would have no need for the ugly, turn/hex based Battle Academy (I hated it so much still not got past bootcamp!) and its ilk. The money pumped into that pointless nightmare would have turned CC round years ago. Those types of games should be history. Turn based? Why
Very probably Steve will agree with me at this, you are dreaming. A game born from GTC? impossible. Imagine a program which you were improving with new features each day for more of 20 years and each year, you added 5 hidden holes at it. Now you have 100 hidden holes in the program and nobody can find them. A complete mess. Work with the old engine had not sense.
Close Combat does not need 3D it simply needs to work. How much reassessment does that simple want/need require?
Continue dreaming in the paradise where everything is too easy..........[:-]

At the end, the old engine had a very poor AI and a lot of problems playing multiplayer games. The code was a big headache. Start with a new engine was the best and easier option. If you can not see it, it is not my problem. [8|]

Now, I am sure how they could code Archon as a 2D game but if they could make a 3D, was it a bad idea? for me it was great. I do not see it as a problem.[8D]
mickxe5
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by mickxe5 »

3D is both a convenient marketing hook but also a big fix for one of CC's glaring shortfalls - beneath those pretty map graphics lurked an opaque 10x10 pixel grid, mechanically almost as clunky as an Avalon Hill hex map, and all too prone to terrain coding errors.

I dont grasp the proposition that 3D and a 'new, improved' CC are somehow mutually exclusive. After 6 dev cycles (CCM AT/JTAC->GTC), why bother starting BF from scratch if not to do CC right, freed from the limitations of a 20 year-old code base. It's surely not because a programmer of The Blood's caliber needs a Matrix paycheck. 3D is a non-issue as far as Im concerned, and a foregone conclusion for a real-time tactical wargame these days. The belated but better question is about changing scale in PITF-GTC from 5pix/m to 8pix/m. Improved graphics at the expense of a claustrophobic, 60% reduced view of the battlefield on my old 1368x768 monitor. Less width-wise when you factor in the newly vertical Teams list.

Im finding the AI in GTC (which I only bought last month :) to be pleasantly refined, all things considered. Given the more open, tank-friendly terrain in GTC, IMO the tweak was toward caution. Units deploy in better terrain, AI infantry follows covered approaches where it can, its tanks rarely get exposed in front of the dismounts, and it sites & sits still better on defense. On offense the GTC AI generally wont overwhelm with aggression but also will less wantonly impale itself on the player's better deployed sword. On defense the AI is noticeably harder to defeat simply because it is more cautious, and moderately better deployed.

The half-speed GTC vehicles have previously been explained as a conscious design decision to limit the effect of tanks in battle. Easily modded to full speed if one cares to recreate blitzkrieg tactics. Using a combination of small PITF maps, single-man player teams and a spoofed unit structure with 21 slots available for a forcepool of ~45 soldiers, Ive been able to mod GTC into a challenging platoon scale game for solo play as the Germans.

If it takes until '19 before BF ships, or even if it doesnt, so be it. CC, and all involved in keeping it alive, dont owe me nothing.
Nomada_Firefox
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by Nomada_Firefox »

Everybody forget or ignore the great advantage from the new 3D engine. The map editor. For years to create a new map was a big limitation for CC games. In fact I believe how the strategic map was added by this limitation. Because it adds a lot more of maps per game. But now at BF, we will be able to create our own maps with a small amount of difficulty, mostly the free time.;)
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IainMcNeil
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by IainMcNeil »

The way 3D works you cant take screenshots until its pretty much complete. Until the shaders are finished no screenshots can be done. Tweaking the shader effects everything and we're not happy yet. They're still being worked on, as is the UI so anything we show now would not be how the final game would look. We are still months away from completion so don't want to show something until we are happy. I'm sorry if that means you have to wait a bit longer, but we're not going to compromise on the look and feel of the game. Thanks for your patience!
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Nomada_Firefox
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by Nomada_Firefox »

You should have told us before about the work with shaders. I can easily accept it. Shaders are everything at 3D graphics.

For all the people, I recomend you ignore it temporaly, to think at other things, other games, by example Bliztkrieg 3, it has a very good early access version. Yes, it is not a CC game but it is fun. Enough for me while I wait the BF.
easternhellbender
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by easternhellbender »

There's a hell of a lot I'd love to write regarding frustration with the way things have been communicated (and sometimes not communicated) during the ongoing development of TBF, but there's little I could add that others haven't already expressed in their own words.

Most of us clearly understand how absurdly challenging game development can be. It takes as long as it takes.

Please keep communicating with us regarding progress (or setbacks). We support you, keep throwing us bones! [&o]
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Hexagon
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by Hexagon »

Is not like you need show in battle screenshots... you can show the "company manegement" system... i dont imagine you need perfect shaders to show how you control your company resources... you can do copy paste from combat of unit panel to show details about units and how players receive info about units... you can show the scen pre battle screen... post action informs... there are a lot of things to show without need shaders.

If you want you can, but looks like after 2 years give players "wait tomorrow" as answer become the rule.

I can say you that game now is not in the list of many guys i know, to much years with out show something to mantein interest and well is not like last years and 2017 is going to offer only CCBF.
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IckieStickie
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by IckieStickie »

Well january 2017 is finally here and wheres this beta or any INFO on this would be great please Matrix?now is the time...are we getting this beta this month?were notbothered about a few shaders etc,we are used to playing betas etcand we know what to expect after how many years?.so please enlighten us...
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IckieStickie
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by IckieStickie »

Well said Nomada_Firefox.I have all CC games apart from CC,1+2,and None have any form of Mod attached,why?because i can't find any!Certainly nobody on here as mentioned anything about any decent mods regarding any CC game in my library.Now that is something ive always wanted to see,why hasn't this happened?i'm not a mod'er so i wouldn't know these things,i have to get a friend to install all my mods for me,but to be able to Mod CC like they have done with games like winSPWaW i would have thought they would have done this by now?.Guess its not as easy as some of us think.[:-]
Nomada_Firefox
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by Nomada_Firefox »

Well said Nomada_Firefox.I have all CC games apart from CC,1+2,and None have any form of Mod attached,why?because i can't find any!Certainly nobody on here as mentioned anything about any decent mods regarding any CC game in my library.
If you do not try........you will not find them [;)]....and do not tell us how you have tried because you have not made even a small search at google[:'(]. All my mods can be found at my place http://firefoxccmods.com/ , some of them at Moddb http://www.moddb.com/company/firefoxccmods and easily you can find the mods from other people here at these forums.

Now try or do not try, but how difficult it is, it is not a excuse.[;)]
mickxe5
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by mickxe5 »

Theere are dozens of 'decent' CC mods available from the CSO and CCS sites, including full installs of versions 1 - 5 and the CC Marines training sims. The earlier versions were extensively modded but the CC mod (and player) community has grown considerably smaller in recent years so the later releases have fewer mods.

Fear not, many mods are self-installing.
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CGGrognard
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by CGGrognard »

From previous posts, I know a release date is out of the question, but can you offer the fans here some indication by production if it will be completed this year or next?
"The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting." - Sun Tzu
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IckieStickie
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RE: Close Combat - The Bloody First, dates update

Post by IckieStickie »

Really?thankyou for the info anyways regarding weather ive tried in the past or not dont make assumptions ok,your not very good at it it seems.I should have mentioned also that i hadnt looked for mods in the last few years!.I notice alot of your stuff on that site you kindly sent me is quite recent and that explains why i gave up a few years back,way before i even came across Matrix![:)]Oops i just noticed says "in reply to you Mickxe5 this was actually meant for the other guy Nomada firefox above,please ignore:)
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