[RELEASED] USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone 1983

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mcp5500
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[RELEASED] USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone 1983

Post by mcp5500 »

USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone Updated today 5/2 This version has no active sonar and the subs do not attack you at once. Changed Weapon load-out to match Scenario 1

Major Updates added - more subs (like the real thing), added hellos, messages complete.




NATO vs. U.S.S.R.
Date/Time: September 11 1983 / 09:00 AM
Location: Norwegian Sea
Playable Sides: NATO
________________________________________
Introduction
This is Scenario 2 of USS Baltimore
USS Baltimore emerges from the Greenland Ice sheath on the sixth day of hostilities. After killing a Soviet Typhoon SSBN, TK-208, and a Victor III in the Barents Sea on the opening days of the conflict, The Soviets have taken Reykjavik Iceland and Narvik Norway. USS Baltimore must do what she can to stem the flow of Soviet subs into the North Atlantic and surpress the resupply of Reykjavik.

Notes:
Scenario 1: USS Baltimore SC1 - Typhoon Hell 1983.
This is a single sub action. Use time compression to cover the distances.

Enjoy

Scoring
Message will appear at end of Scenario



To: USS Baltimore

From: COMSUBLANT


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Welcome back captain. Let me give you an update,

The Soviets have taken Iceland and destroyed the SOSUS net to Greenland. They were also able to land forces and aircraft at Reykjavik and Narvik as well. At the same time, aircraft from the Kola Peninsula hit the Nimitz battle group. The Nimitz took a missile hit and the cruiser Arkansas and the destroyer Mitscher were lost. We have withdrawn our surface fleet as far south as the Azores where we are preparing to move north with CVN-69 and CVN-62 Battle groups along with an amphibious group lead by USS Guadalcanal and supported by HMS Ark Royal. We will retake Reykjavik and then Narvik.

We have several US and British SSNs along with Norwegian, French and Spanish SSKs approaching the choking points around Iceland to stop as many soviet SSNs and SSGNs before they get into the North Atlantic but our line is thin. We believe their SSBNs have moved into the White Sea or under the ice, but as far as we know, they are staying close to home. We believe the newer SSNs, Victor IIIs, are still protecting them; but, after the killing of TK-208, that strategy may have changed. We just don't know. If the SSNs do try to go to the open sea, and we stop them, that could open up opportunities for us in the future to move against their SSBNs to limit their nuclear options.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Captain, let’s get down to business,

We have two tasks for you.

First, we have learned that a convoy is heading southwest out of the Barents Sea and we expect the group is going to attempt to resupply Reykjavik. Satellites are attempting to locate the convoy but we must stop this group at all costs.

Second, Naval Intelligence believes, that all indications are, that the Soviet navy is about to attempt to transit as many SSNs SSGNs, SSs and SSGs as possible through the Norwegian Sea and into the North Atlantic. We believe this as well. With our surface fleet south and Iceland in Soviets hands, the Soviet navy's high command knows we can only bring limited ASW assets to bear to close the gap. Now would be their best opportunity to try to close the North Atlantic to all shipping. The transiting subs would also clear the way for the resupply convoy.


Your Orders: Conduct ASW operations as you transit south into the Norwegian Sea. Kill all enemy subs that you can without revealing your presence. Continue ASW operations until instructed to intercept the convoy. We will gather what satellite data we can to keep a track on the convoy and send you updates on the convoy’s approximate position, speed and make-up. There are No friendlies in your operational area. Nuclear weapons are NOT authorized. After ending your convoy action, proceed south out of the Norwegian Sea to be vectored to Britain for resupply and reassignment.


When the soviet subs attempt to run the Norwegian sea, they will most likely do this in large numbers and in waves. Some waves may use active sonar during their transit to clear the way.


We believe the SSN submarine make-up would be their Victor Is and IIs, Hotel IIs, Alfas, and Novembers. As mentioned earlier, be on the lookout for any Victor IIIs. As for the SSGNs, we expect the new Oscar class, Charlie Is, Charlie IIs, Echo IIs, and some SSG Julietts to hunt our carriers. ASW Aircraft can be expected over the Norwegian Sea at this time.

Good Luck











Please give me your feedback and on scoring.

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Flankerk
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RE: New Scenario for testing: USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone

Post by Flankerk »


Tried this through, the vast majority working as you'd expect.
Minor things noted, the weather isn't included which probably makes some detections a lot easier, marker side is also showing up as playable?

The only big issue I found is the scoring didn't trigger. I sank a Victor III a Victor II , two Echo II and all the convoy. This scored as zero so likely hadn't been added in.

The scenario itself is interesting and moves at a pace, however the vast majority of the action would be over in a day or so? By then I'd run out of my entire weapon load which seems right, but I think the scenario still had a few days to run until completion.
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mcp5500
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RE: New Scenario for testing: USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone

Post by mcp5500 »

Thanks you made it look to easy. I fixed Marker, added weather, had Doc at Do NOT engage opportunity targets(changed this to yes). Have not done scoring yet(tomorrow). Set the Udaloy to active sonar. I have to come up with a way to score and end based on score or have player retire to the south west into an exit zone.
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RE: New Scenario for testing: USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone

Post by Flankerk »


Don't get me wrong, it wasn't too easy by any stretch. The Udaloy was a slightly weird one. I didn't detect it, got an accurate fix (or thought I did) on the Krivak, fired four Harpoons at it, but these didn't have that good a fix. They went live very close to the Krivak and I think all missed, several then tracked into the Udaloy or were spoofed into it so it only got off some very close range shots.

Command does that very well though, and you definitely sometimes hit something that wasn't the target. On this occasion it worked for me. I had intended that stray shots would pick up the merchants.

The main threat to me were the MPA's which got in several attacks, probably often on where I had been.

The weather will make it slightly more difficult for both sides.
Most of the subs were at cruise speed, I think the hardest turned out to be the Victor II which was at 5 knots and hard to get any TMA on.
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RE: New Scenario for testing: USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone

Post by mcp5500 »

The Alfa is the toughest one. It is luck if you get a shot at one. I want to make the convoy attack a challenge to the experanced players so I am making the udaloy sonar active and I am going to put it closer to the merchants. Also add a Sovremenny destroyer with stronger missile defense.
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mcp5500
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RE: New Scenario for testing: USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone

Post by mcp5500 »

Major Updates and scoring. This is what it would be like if the Soviets wanted to hold Iceland. This is a tough scenario. It is not just a shoot-out this is exactly what the soviets would do. need help on scoring and feed back. Score card included. Release B509 when available will help great in this scenario.
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RE: New Scenario for testing: USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone

Post by Flankerk »


Definitely not easy which I think was your intention. I'd be quite surprised if anyone gets Baltimore to survive? They'd certainly have to work at it.
I nearly survived, well I say nearly but that would have been about my third attempt. The first two were complete failures, I think on one an MPA found me, on the other a Victor III did. Both were correctly scored.
I managed to navigate through the subs on the third attempt, got a Victor III, two Echo's and staggeringly missed a Hotel with an ADCAP.

I managed to get a track on the convoy and sank one normal commercial vessel, plus the tanker was on fire. However the Udaloy managed to get enough of a fix and responded with SS-N-14 for a sinking. The tanker would have sunk, and to be honest that was the plan, loiter around and finish it off had it been limping. However the torpedo hit and I think the score came out as average, something like 190 points.

Overall all seemed to go as you'd want. I thought the convoy track definitely worked, and I was quite glad to find it. There's an awful lot of submarines in it, I think when the final track came in, I was 175 NM away and had tracks on four subs having sunk another.

Only a couple of things I think need adjustment. The ASW patrol zone is locked, so its visible to the player side. Also the airbases are single unit airfields but I don't think are named. They'd perhaps look nicer to player side if named?

Its certainly a challenging scenario, but runs quickly, and is distinctly good practice.

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mcp5500
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RE: New Scenario for testing: USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone

Post by mcp5500 »

Flankerk, thanks for helping me with this scenario. I am not sure what to do about the subs to make them a little easier. If you down load the latest, I give the player the formation of the convoy late in the third marker track. At the first marker the player just gets the location, very rough location. At the second marker they get position, spd, and number of ships. Marker 1 is not as accurate on purpose so if you follow only 1 and 2 track alone you can miss the convoy. You need all three markers to be accurate. I gave the player the formation, which I though was pretty cool, to raise the players awareness. Its the 80s, we can do that type of data gathering and I think it gives a real good feal to the whole thing.
I managed to navigate through the subs on the third attempt, got a Victor III, two Echo's and staggeringly missed a Hotel with an ADCAP.

I think I am going to change the orders to manover south and take shots if possible without giving your position away. Your third attempt at getting to the convoy. I would have to look at lowering the scoring.

If you can, look at it one more time and go write to evading the subs and only taking opertunitie shots at the subs, and let me know if that plays better? Then I have to come up with the wording.

I wanted the mission to be about the convoy. SC1 Typhoon Hell was enough of a sub on sub action. The mission is more about the convoy but I wanted to show what the sub run would be like.
Only a couple of things I think need adjustment. The ASW patrol zone is locked, so its visible to the player side. Also the airbases are single unit airfields but I don't think are named. They'd perhaps look nicer to player side if named?

I made the changes you requested. Changed the way you get convoy information (more unkowns [:))]Thanks for the feedback.

there is an update coming B509 that changes the way Harpoons are fired with Bearing only attack. POL point that you select will be the missiles radar activation point, not the target point where the missile goes active 4 miles before. so that will be key in attacking the convoy. Also I will be removing the score card message. It makes it feel like a kids shoot-out. I may put it in the scenario end message. But I think more scenario designers should do more of this at the end of each scenario. It can be a key in assisting the player as to what in important in the scenario.

Thanks for letting me know what you thought. It was a great help.
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mcp5500
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RE: New Scenario for testing: USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone

Post by mcp5500 »

I believe i found an issue with detection of active sonar and convergence zones. That is why this scenario is so difficult. See Sonar Detection issue in tech support.
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mcp5500
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RE: New Scenario for testing: USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone

Post by mcp5500 »

-1 has no active sonar. Even without the convoy using active sonar it is hard to servive.
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RE: New Scenario for testing: USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone

Post by mcp5500 »

In the second USS Baltimore scenario, I want to put a LA class sub in the middle of the Soviets mad drive to the gap and into the North Atlantic. There are many scenarios out there that patray the battle at the gap. So, would the soviets drive the Norwegian Sea w/ Active Sonar or Passive? That is the question. They have to move fast to get to the gap in large numbers as soon as possible before NATO closes it completely. They expect to take a hit at the gap but they would want to get 60-70% into the Atlantic. If they want to hold Iceland, they would have to commit these forces. If they did not take Iceland, it is believed the subs would have stayed north to attack the NATO sub fleet as they drove north to attempt to clear the way for a carrier in the Norwegian sea To take back Norway. The carrier and tomahawk missiles would attempt to suppress air power that is attacking northern England and Iceland so to attack shipping from Norway and the peninsula .

The convoy attack is more about executing a harpoon attack. The normal load-out as modeled in CMANO is 10. In my first scenario, I gave Baltimore only 8. That may be proving to be a hindrance, we will see. But I now believe with the intelligence Baltimore receives is very important to her survival as well. it is a good convoy mission.

I played this scenario today, it is fun and action is continuous. I killed a Charlie II, Victor III, and hotel II. The Victor iii took me 100 miles west before I could kill it and I had to sprint and drift, which I think I got it down, back to intercept the convoy when the orders came in. I hit the 2nd destroyer and she turned south away from my position, leaving the merchants exposed. I shot 2 at the Udaloy and missed, one harpoon each for the supply ships and 2 at the tanker. I avoided the air assault and I was able to limp back around to the rear of the convoy and finish off the supply ships with torpedoes then I went south at high spread to the exit area. No cheating, 1 got a major victory. Scoring is really good.

It Is done but I need to wait for the next release 1.04 as there are advances that greatly impact this scenario.

I played the scenario with the convoy ships using active sonar. You can't get close enough to the convey to get the positions of the ships so you can shoot the harpoons with late operating radar. You ask me the sonar is to good for the Udaloy and the Sovremenny,

Any date set for these new releases?
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Gunner98
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RE: New Scenario for testing: USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone

Post by Gunner98 »

Just ran this one. Nice scenario - very tough. Got an average victory (200) before the Baltimore took a torp up the butt, the Udaloy had 2 torps inbound and all 4 merchant ships were 80% damaged or more. Had I lasted another couple min it would have been better[;)]

My only comment is that the Baltimore probably has too much ammo to start - after SC1 I think it should be down by at least 4 or 5 torps. I think its only down by 1 or 2 at the moment which assumes some sniper shooting in SC1.

Also the Soviet marker cities should be named as they are visible to the player.

Good game, I think its just about ready to role.

B

SIDE: NATO
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
1x SSN 688 Los Angeles [Flight I]


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
5x Mk48 Mod 4
6x ADC Mk2 Mod 0 Torpedo Decoy
7x UGM-84A Harpoon IP



SIDE: USSR
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
1x PLA-671 Victor I [Yorsh]
1x PLRK-651 Juliett
1x PLARK-949 Oscar I [Granit]
1x Ka-27PL Helix A


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
304x RGB-75 [Basic Search, Passive Omni]
59x RGB-25 [Track, Passive Directional]
81x RGB-55A [Track, Active/Passive]
164x RGB-15 [Refined Search, Passive Omni]
6x Generic Acoustic Decoy
1x USET-80
19x APR-2 Orlan-M
18x AT-3 [UMGT-1 Orlan, NATO E40-79A]
2x SET-65M Enot-2 [NATO ET-80A[76]]
7x SA-N-7 Gadfly [9M38]
2x SS-N-14 Silex [84R, AT-2UM]

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mcp5500
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RE: New Scenario for testing: USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone

Post by mcp5500 »

Ha, Ha, I like that, "Sniper shooting". i will remove 1 more torp (3 in all) and make the airport name changes. Thanks

Give yourself 20 more points - i had to add scoring for Julietts
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RE: New Scenario for testing: USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone

Post by Gunner98 »

[:D]That and the 40 for the Udaloy which went down about 1 min after I did [X(] racing them to the bottom! I ran the scenario for a few min after the end. I should have dived for the bottom after the first salvo of 3 HPoons, waited for the second salvo to load and shoot - not smart.

B
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mcp5500
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RE: New Scenario for testing: USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone

Post by mcp5500 »

Scoring is good Just need to fix a few messages.

Major Victory Final Score: 450 and this is with convergence zones still not working B521. I also missed with several harpoons.



If i remove any more Torp it would be tough to get 400 - 500 score

SIDE: NATO
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
11x Mk48 Mod 4
10x UGM-84A Harpoon IP



SIDE: USSR
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
1x PLA-705K Alfa [Lira]
2x PLA-671 Victor I [Yorsh]
1x PLA-671RTM Victor III [Shchuka]
1x PLA-671RT Victor II [Syomga]
1x PLARK-670M Charlie II [Skat-M]
4x Ka-27PL Helix A
1x BPK Udaloy I [Pr.1155]
1x Commercial Tanker - General Purpose [20,000t DWT]
1x PB Ugra [Pr.1886.1]


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
814x RGB-75 [Basic Search, Passive Omni]
144x RGB-55A [Track, Active/Passive]
396x RGB-15 [Refined Search, Passive Omni]
90x RGB-25 [Track, Passive Directional]
18x Generic Acoustic Decoy



SIDE: Marker
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------


EXPENDITURES:
------------------

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mcp5500
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Complete: USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone 1983

Post by mcp5500 »

USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone 1983 - is complete. I am still having issues with convergence zones not working which greatly impacts in how this scenario is played, but it is still very challenging. All subs and convoy locations are random each time scenario is played.

Enjoy
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mcp5500
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RE: Complete: USS Baltimore SC2 - Two Birds One Stone 1983

Post by mcp5500 »

Updated the scenario to reflect commands changes to how AI subs maneuver.
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