Submarine Sims?

[KG Erwin]

Matrix hasn't delved into this, and I'm still wondering why that is. I'm aware of the Subsim forum, and the Silent Hunter series. However, I keep hearing about a discontinued sim called "Aces of the Deep", which had a campaign feature and is still talked about on Subsim. Why has Matrix not acquired the rights to "AOD" and re-released it? Has it even been considered?

That being said, I own "Silent Hunter II" and acquired many of the fan-created mods. That game is now legendary as an unfinished product which the fans finally made somewhat playable.

The modern "Silent Hunters" require modern PCs and advanced graphics features. For those of us with older PCs, there's a gap to be filled.

I periodically revisit this idea, but my question is: is anyone interested enough to lobby for a classic subsim to be brought back to life?

[oldspec4]

Yeah...remember playing 688 attack sub in the late '80s. But haven't seen anything recently that interests me; and I'm somewhat limited by my old computer specs too.

[madflava13]

Interesting you brought this up... I'm in the process of re-installing SH3 on my computer and getting it patched up. Not sure what it was that triggered the bug - I think constantly checking the WiTP board for AE updates did it... But I love sub sims. I had 688, Red Storm Rising, Silent Hunters 1, 2 and now 3... I'd love to see Matrix get involved in one...

[JagdFlanker]

i still go on a Red Storm Rising run here and there going all the way back since i had it on my C64 - nice and simple but always challenging

[Feltan]

Aces of the Deep was probably the most immersive game I have ever played -- at least at the time. Quite fun and very addicting.

The graphics on Silent Hunter IV, and its various mods, are truly stunning. However, the game is not quite as addicting as Aces of the Deep.

All great fun to play. Ideal for computer simulation/modelling -- all physics: time, velocity and vectors. Air combat is similar, but translating the human interface to a computer/joystick still creates a reality gap, while sub sims seem ideal to model via a computer interface -- it is easy to translate orders shouted from the bridge or control room into key strokes and point-and-click actions.

Regards,
Feltan

[Hertston]

ORIGINAL: KG Erwin

Matrix hasn't delved into this, and I'm still wondering why that is. I'm aware of the Subsim forum, and the Silent Hunter series. However, I keep hearing about a discontinued sim called "Aces of the Deep", which had a campaign feature and is still talked about on Subsim. Why has Matrix not acquired the rights to "AOD" and re-released it? Has it even been considered?

I honestly don't know who would buy it. It was a good game, but is now very long in tooth and would probably need a fair bit of work to bring up to scratch. Even then, most established sub-simmers would be unlikely to give up SH3/4 for it, and any new ones would pick those titles on the basis of looks alone - and in all honesty both are better games than AotD anyway, certainly in modded form. There really can't be many gamers without the horsepower to run SH3, if not SH4... certainly not enough to make the project profitable.

[KG Erwin]

Herstston, you seem to be in the minority, at the moment. The thing that guys like me would want is a random career campaign, like SPWAW's long campaigns are done. Matrix has resurrected several older games, so a "retro" game like AoTD might attract players who hadn't previously played a subsim. These types of games are also ideal for the solo players, who do in fact compromise the vast majority of wargamers.

I recently re-installed SH II, plus a few mods, but I just got sick of the "janus errors" when one mod conflicted with another and caused a game crash.

[JudgeDredd]

No way would simmers give up SHII/IV for a revamped AotD. It's just tooooooo old hat.
 
Even within the Matrix crowd, I can't imagine it would be a big seller for Matrix....nowhere near worth doing!
 
The only reason AotD is talked about on Subsim is the "reminisce" factor (and we all know what that normally turns out to feel like...a waste of money!) and the campaign. Most of those bods wouldn't go near AotD unless it was completely re-written.
 
I'm with Hertston here tbh...move along [:'(]

[Banquet]

I'll also chime in with Hertston and Judge.. AotD was a milestone release at the time and is still the only subsim to have wolfpacks as far as I know, but in all honesty, with Silent Hunter 3 and 4 available - and both having a dynamic campaign which Silent Hunter 2 lacked - I couldn't see myself going back to it, and I doubt many other people would either.

I do know of one person who still plays it more than any other subsim though, so who knows!

[Lützow]

ORIGINAL: KG Erwin

Herstston, you seem to be in the minority, at the moment. The thing that guys like me would want is a random career campaign, like SPWAW's long campaigns are done.

Actually, SH3 has a career camapaign. There also was a third-party addon in develepment called 'Seawolves' or so, which should bring SH3 to a more strategic/operational level. No idea how far they got with this.

I don't mind visuals in strategy games but for sim's they're considerable more important in order to create a realistic athmosphere. That being said, I wouldn't consider to purchase a remastered AoD or something like that.

[cantona2]

SH3 with the user made mod GWX will see you for a long while

[Ron]

I don't know, but AOtD had a lot going for it. Dynamix seemed to have a knack for making great games at that time - AOtD, Red Baron and Aces over Europe and the Pacific, were ones I had fond memories of. Whether it is nostalgia or not, Aces of the Deep was very immersive and engrossing. I think the movie Das Boot may have had something to do with it. I have SH II, III and IV, and while from a realistic and graphical standpoint, both III and IV with mods, easily surpass AOtD, imo they can't touch it for overall atmosphere and general gaming goodness. I agree with several posters, the subsim crowd is pretty limited and pretty narrow in what's a good sim, and probably unwelcoming to an updated version. That said I would definitely buy one!
 
 

[Fintilgin]

Is there such a thing as a WW1 sub-sim?  Or, more likely, a mod for one of the existing WW2 games?
 

[Hertston]

ORIGINAL: Fintilgin

Is there such a thing as a WW1 sub-sim?  Or, more likely, a mod for one of the existing WW2 games?

Yup, 1914: Shells of Fury. Never played it, but Subsim seem to like it.

[leastonh1]

A game that stops me playing SH3/4 would have to be very special indeed. I've never heard of Aces, but a revamp of an old game probably wouldn't be good enough. That's just my opinion though and stranger things do happen at sea! [;)]

[KG Erwin]

Here's the Wikipedia page on AoTD: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aces_of_th ... ideo_game)

[Greybriar]

Red Storm Rising was, I think, the first sub sim I ever played. It was a good game, although its graphics were primitive by today's standards, but then so was my old IBM clone with its CGA graphics.

The first sub sim I played a lot was Silent Service II. I also played Wolf Pack at about the same time, but it just didn't have the appeal of Silent Service II.

Then Aces of the Deep came along. In my opinion, Dynamix had the best graphics going back in those days and they certainly impressed me.

By the time the Silent Hunter series came along, I had had my fill of sub sims (StarForce on SH3 didn't help matters!). I purchased all the games in the series and played them a bit, but I never got as immersed in them as I had with Silent Service II and Aces of the Deep.

One of the last sub sims I purchased was 1914: Shells of Fury, which Hertston posted about. I think it is a great game for its price.

[KG Erwin]

In the present day, it may be a lost cause to sacrifice graphics quality for replayability, but I think there MIGHT be a niche market for this in the Matrix community.

[leastonh1]

Graphics over gameplay will never sell me anything. Eye candy is always nice to have, but I have lost count how many games I've uninstalled in disgust because they looked good, but played badly.

Fortunately, SH has both great graphics and good gameplay. If Matrix could come up with a game which rivalled the immersion of Silent Service (which was my first love) and Silent Hunter, even if the graphics were just ok or mediocre, I would switch. There's nothing on the market like SH and hasn't been for a long time, unfortunately. Sub sims have no peer for tense and stressful gameplay, with the exception of the Shalebridge Cradle!!!! 

[JudgeDredd]

No...but when you get graphics AND gameplay (SHIII and SHIV) what more is there?
 
Seriously...there is nothing more atmospheric than stalking your prey and pouncing - only to be bounced by 3 or 4 destroyers, all dropping depth charges...some close...some not so...and when you have graphics to die for on top of that??? What else is there?
 
AotD is old school and doesn't offer anything that isn't already there imo...and what it "may" offer just isn't worth the drop back to 80's graphics.
 
I think the "niche" market is more "niche" than you may think.