What's new for TOAW 3.4

Norm Koger's The Operational Art of War III is the next game in the award-winning Operational Art of War game series. TOAW3 is updated and enhanced version of the TOAW: Century of Warfare game series. TOAW3 is a turn based game covering operational warfare from 1850-2015. Game scale is from 2.5km to 50km and half day to full week turns. TOAW3 scenarios have been designed by over 70 designers and included over 130 scenarios. TOAW3 comes complete with a full game editor.

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Curtis Lemay
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by Curtis Lemay »

ORIGINAL: JAMiAM

ORIGINAL: Panama


[:D] Is it really that simple? Perhaps I'm misunderstanding something but, it seems as though I'm being told that I should always attack at 1 to 1 or better with only raw unit strengths being the qualifier. Supply, readiness and proficiency are thrown out. If I don't do this I stand to suffer penalties. Is that an incorrect assumption?

To answer the bolded portion of your questions. This is incorrect. Supply, readiness and proficiency direct affect the attack and defense strengths of units. So, these still factor into the AR ratios and calculations. What is essentially happening is that a test is being made between the relative *effective* strengths of the active equipment and the outcome of that test is determining multiple effects regarding the bombardment strengths involved in the combat. Poor AR ratios will result in supported bombardments being much less effective than previously, in terms of losses taken, as well as supply usage.

In other words, we're spoiling the spoiling attacks that players became spoiled using...[:D]

Jam is correct. But note that terrain and deployment defense multipliers are thrown out. As are all passive equipment. Finally, the attack strength used is a combination of the attacker's AP and AT strengths in proportion to the fractions of the defense strength attributable to armored and unarmored defense strengths (this is the same process used for RBCs).

But, more important is that this is just to determine the AR and thereby what set of benefits are received. When combat is then actually resolved, all equipment and factors are employed as before.
ORIGINAL: Panama


As a side note, much of the fighting in the East in 1941 was pretty much regiments vs divisions. Would that be a problem? [&:]
Not necessarily. Keep in mind, again, that the effective strengths of units are essentially determined by equipment modified by readiness, proficiency, and supply. The exact combat strength formula is in the manual's appendices. So, in cases where smaller, well supplied, highly proficient, high readiness units are in combat with a larger poorly supplied, low proficiency, low readiness unit, then you're often dealing with fairly equal effective combat strengths.

Hope that helps.

Exactly. Strengths are what matters.
My TOAW web site:

Bob Cross's TOAW Site
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Curtis Lemay
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by Curtis Lemay »

ORIGINAL: Champagne

Please excuse if this is an elementary or repetitive question:

Not all of the existing scenarios have been recently tweaked with a view to be working with TOAW 3.4. This is no problem. I'm please to see that so many have been tweaked.

How will 3.4 affect those existing scenarios that have not been tweaked? Will these scenarios be very different under 3.4 then are now?

Thanks.

There's no question that terrain will be more effective than before. No scenario, including those included with the update have been "tweaked" for that.

Somewhat countering that, tiny defenses will be easier to overcome.

We'll just have to see how things work out. Regardless, both changes are for the better in the long run.
My TOAW web site:

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Telumar
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by Telumar »

ORIGINAL: Curtis Lemay
ORIGINAL: Telumar

.. another question about the new combined terrain/deployment defensive strength multiplier. In the What's new document there's a chart about infantry and vehicle defense strength.
But this also applies to defensive AP and AT strengths, doesn't it?

Hmm. I don't know about AT strengths. Good question.

Edit: I think armored vehicles benefit from the vehicle defense multiplier only. The statement in the manual about anti-armor defense strength multipliers is incorrect, if I remember correctly. But my memory is kind of vague about it.

[X(]

Bob, that's a non-trivial matter. So, you say there are no defence multipliers for AT strengths or are those from the manual just incorrect? Defnsive AP strehgths are applied and correctly documented by the manual and subject to the new combined deploym./terrain rules?

Maybe James can answer that question though it seems that he's been (willingly ;) ) missing the question...[:D]
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by Champagne »

ORIGINAL: JAMiAM

ORIGINAL: Champagne

How will 3.4 affect those existing scenarios that have not been tweaked? Will these scenarios be very different under 3.4 then are now?

My favorite answer..."it depends"...[;)]

The changes are evolutionary - not revolutionary. The difference will vary depending not only upon the nature of the scenario units TO&E, but also, in no small part, on the play styles of the people playing the game.

If you're the type of person who previously took a great deal of effort in 'gaming the system', then you may find that your ant-bombardment tactics are not very effective anymore, leading to a wastage of your play time, not to mention potentially combat rounds, too.

If you're the type of person who used less labor-intensive, but more generally 'standard' tactics, of putting the right numbers of equipment types against a certain number and type of defenders, took into account terrain, support levels, et cetera, then you will likely see some improvement in your results.


Thank you, James. I'm very, very excited about this new version. I bought the original 1998 version of TOAW when it first came out, but, I never became a regular player. I intend to change that now, especially in light of the fact that the game is still being lovingly developed and refined.
Only the dead have seen the end of War.

-- Plato
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stone10
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by stone10 »

Is the new patch available for us to download now?
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by Jeff Norton »

Stone,

No, not yet. But, soon....
-Jeff
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Curtis Lemay
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by Curtis Lemay »

ORIGINAL: Telumar

[X(]

Bob, that's a non-trivial matter. So, you say there are no defence multipliers for AT strengths or are those from the manual just incorrect?

I'm working from memory here, so take that into consideration. But, I think my source was Ralph. I suggested reducing those factors (per the wishlist) and he said he checked the code and there were no such multipliers of AT strengths - that the manual was wrong.

That's not the same as a test, of course. And that gets the final say.
Defnsive AP strehgths are applied and correctly documented by the manual and subject to the new combined deploym./terrain rules

I think it's just defense strengths that are affected by the new rule. And I can't say one way or the other about the AP strength multipliers rule in the manual.
My TOAW web site:

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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by Menschenfresser »

On the surface, it sounds like a net gain for defenders between the ant countermeasures and the P1/P2 equalizations (given that most scenarios put the overall defender as P2). Which, if so, should be a plus for most scenarios out there. But only time will tell.

Excellent work to all involved. Tip of the hat.
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by LOK_32MK »

Than you to everyone involved. No matter how many other games I have tried, TOAW is the one game I always come back to. I have been playing it since TOAW I came out.
Thanks again to Ralph, Curtis, Jamiam and everyone else who made this a reality.

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shunwick
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by shunwick »

ORIGINAL: JAMiAM

Hi all,

I know it's been forever in coming, but patch 3.4 is right around the bend

James,

I used to have a car like that.

Best wishes,
Steve
I love the smell of TOAW in the morning...
Maddoc06
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by Maddoc06 »

Fantastic.

Obviously some very clever people have worked very hard on behalf of us all.

How long is around the bend?
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Jo van der Pluym
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by Jo van der Pluym »

ORIGINAL: Maddoc06

Fantastic.

Obviously some very clever people have worked very hard on behalf of us all.

How long is around the bend?

1 hour and 25 minutes. [:D]

http://movies.yahoo.com/movie/1808580394/info
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Panama
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by Panama »

ORIGINAL: Maddoc06

Fantastic.

Obviously some very clever people have worked very hard on behalf of us all.

How long is around the bend?

A tad longer than 'soon' and somewhat shorter than 'when it's here'. Hope that cleared things up. [;)]
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by mbar »

I want to hear Bagdad Bob's opinion.
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by Silvanski »

Here's BB's latest tweet

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The TOAW Redux Dude
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by Jo van der Pluym »

ORIGINAL: mbar

I want to hear Bagdad Bob's opinion.

Feldwebel Schultz comment about the TOAW 3.4 release date [:D]

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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by mbar »

Thanks guys! You'll get me through to the release date. [:)]
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Curtis Lemay
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by Curtis Lemay »

I wanted to highlight one 3.4 feature that can easily be overlooked, since it may seem innocuous: Variable Supply Points.

Note that they will allow different sections of the map to more or less have different Force Supply Levels. And those levels can be varied independently by event.

So, for an ETO scenario the Allies can have separate FSLs in England, France, Italy, Norway, USSR, Africa, etc. The Axis can have ones for Europe, Norway, and Africa, etc. Each can be adjusted independently.

Also, it's a powerful building block for further supply enhancements - see my physical supply suggestion on the Wishlist thread. Concentrations of physical supply would act as variable supply points.


Some other seemingly minor items will have major impact as well:

Adjacent ranged units will now bombard when assigned to an attack. Note that this will improve naval combat.

Engineer effects are now scaled by the fraction of movement allowance the unit has left.

The designer is now armed with an expanded suite of game parameters that he can adjust.
My TOAW web site:

Bob Cross's TOAW Site
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Telumar
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by Telumar »

ORIGINAL: Curtis Lemay

I wanted to highlight one 3.4 feature that can easily be overlooked, since it may seem innocuous: Variable Supply Points.

Note that they will allow different sections of the map to more or less have different Force Supply Levels. And those levels can be varied independently by event.

So, for an ETO scenario the Allies can have separate FSLs in England, France, Italy, Norway, USSR, Africa, etc. The Axis can have ones for Europe, Norway, and Africa, etc. Each can be adjusted independently.

Also, it's a powerful building block for further supply enhancements - see my physical supply suggestion on the Wishlist thread. Concentrations of physical supply would act as variable supply points.


Some other seemingly minor items will have major impact as well:

Adjacent ranged units will now bombard when assigned to an attack. Note that this will improve naval combat.

Engineer effects are now scaled by the fraction of movement allowance the unit has left.

The designer is now armed with an expanded suite of game parameters that he can adjust.


How will it be handeled if two SPs with different levels of supply are on a railway hex? Say i have one with 30 in Berlin and one with 20 in Rome on a Europe Map. Both SPs are on a railline and connected through this railline. Does the 30 supply SP overwrite the 20 supply SP throughout the whole net?
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RE: What's new for TOAW 3.4

Post by sPzAbt653 »

Found it in the What's New -

If the line connects to multiple supply points of variable values then the strongest one is broadcast over the line.
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