Making the last Beta Official

[Nomad]

Both Xargun and I installed the 1127 beta in a new folder and then moved the exe only to our game folders. We did not use any of the new art work, map files, or scenario files.

You need to understand how all this works.

1. The map data is stored in three files, pwhexe.dat, pwzlink.dat, and pwzone.dat.
1a. pwehexe.dat contains the data on every hex in the game pertaining to roads, railroads, terrain, malaria, weather zone, etc.
1b. pwzlink.dat I think has the links for the off map movement and movement to and from the main map.
1c. pwzone.dat has the data for the entry zones you see along the edge of the main map.

2. The art work, all the bit map files for the map have no effect on the game at all, that is why you can use different art work with no problems.

3. The scenario file defines the bases present and the data for them. A base will only show up if it is in the scenario file.

4. The exe file only uses the data present in the files above and of course the current game file, it does not define any data on its own.

[MarkShot]

TruGrit,

I am only able to find the 27.1 and not the 27.2 beta in the members area. Where does one find 27.2? Thanks.

Nomad,

I will probably do as you have done to just get behavior fixes, but keep my map and the scenarios which have been developed through the years.

[Trugrit]

TruGrit,

I am only able to find the 27.1 and not the 27.2 beta in the members area. Where does one find 27.2? Thanks.

Nomad,

I will probably do as you have done to just get behavior fixes, but keep my map and the scenarios which have been developed through the years.

I get it from the store page…..Halfway down.
https://www.matrixgames.com/game/war-in ... ls-edition

This is the product version and should be the most current new beta version
unless Matrix has thrown us a curve ball.

The below files are what is included in the update.

Note….You can’t install the new Beta without it overwriting
any existing map and data files. As far as I know.

That is because it is a game update, not the full game.

[Trugrit]

Nomad,

I understand how it all works.

What I don’t understand completely is what you have done.
I’m not sure I want to try walking through that.

Let’s just leave it here before you go hostile.

I’ll go back to working on my reading comprehension.

[Zovs]

It looks me that Nomad Jerry rigged it. If you take a clean install of the latest beta and then try to use an old graphics mod on top of that it won’t work. You’ll have incompatible data with old art that won’t jive. Unless you Jerry rigged it by only moving certain files to a certain location to possibly make the old art work with old data otherwise the old art won’t work with the new data (I.e., the new beta).

So yes with the new beta you can’t get old data and old art to work they are not compatible with the new data and thus are broken unless you Jerry rig your beta install with an old install.

[MarkShot]

TruGrit,

I am taking my download from the member page but the EXE in the details tab says 27.1. Can you confirm that Matrix Member space didn't revert to an older file or link? I did try the comprehensive update to test, and not what I describe below. It shows up the wrong version on the EXE properties, main menu, and that example you gave of new map islands. Thanks!

Zovs,

This is what I have been doing. Just pulling these files out of the update. The result is that I only get new executable code, but the map data, graphics, and scenarios reflect the to stuff that I assembled myself and the scenarios explained by Kull.

20230307 213737.jpg (24.53 KiB) Viewed 1305 times

[MarkShot]

Okay, I found the problem.

The update is the defaulting to a difference path than where my game is installed (but different only by a single letter). I failed to notice that.

The comprehensive installer is good.

Thanks for your patience.

[MarkShot]

Nomad,

Here is what I did so that I can easily choose:

* Any game version (mechanics). Has EXE, DLLs, and Whatsnews.

* Stacking limits or no stacking limits for the original release map.

* Swap between Bella Pacifica map and original map (with data).

I created a series of self extracting zips for these which operate in the main directory. You can see them in my WITP-AE group here:

SNAG-0000.jpg (265.94 KiB) Viewed 1286 times

I have another series of these based on the dissertation written by Kull of available scenarios for the standard game. These extractors operate in the scenario directory.

SNAG-0001.jpg (116.07 KiB) Viewed 1286 times

This is just a more flexible version of what you did. It could have been more standard by using something like the JSGME (Jonesoft Generic Mod Enabler) which was came out of the work which was done for SH3 (Silent Hunter 3).

So, I have a corrected game without forfeiting any legacy mapping or scenarios. Although I am probably so tied up playing WITW and WITE-2 that I may never get to The Pacific.

[Nomad]

It looks me that Nomad Jerry rigged it. If you take a clean install of the latest beta and then try to use an old graphics mod on top of that it won’t work. You’ll have incompatible data with old art that won’t jive. Unless you Jerry rigged it by only moving certain files to a certain location to possibly make the old art work with old data otherwise the old art won’t work with the new data (I.e., the new beta).

So yes with the new beta you can’t get old data and old art to work they are not compatible with the new data and thus are broken unless you Jerry rig your beta install with an old install.

I do not understand what you mean by jerry rigging. We just simply made a new installation of the game using the 1127.2 patch. Then we moved the exe and the exe only to our current PBEM game folders.
this is the same as just doing an exe patch, one which michaelmau75 provided earlier. You can not update an existing game with new map art and data files, you will end up with a mess if you try.

There is nothing to prevent you from making as many installations on your computer as you need or want. I have at least 12 different ones for different reasons.

If you are trying to play multiple games using one single installation you are looking to have serious problems.

[RangerJoe]

It looks me that Nomad Jerry rigged it. If you take a clean install of the latest beta and then try to use an old graphics mod on top of that it won’t work. You’ll have incompatible data with old art that won’t jive. Unless you Jerry rigged it by only moving certain files to a certain location to possibly make the old art work with old data otherwise the old art won’t work with the new data (I.e., the new beta).

So yes with the new beta you can’t get old data and old art to work they are not compatible with the new data and thus are broken unless you Jerry rig your beta install with an old install.

I do not understand what you mean by jerry rigging. We just simply made a new installation of the game using the 1127.2 patch. Then we moved the exe and the exe only to our current PBEM game folders.
this is the same as just doing an exe patch, one which michaelmau75 provided earlier. You can not update an existing game with new map art and data files, you will end up with a mess if you try.

There is nothing to prevent you from making as many installations on your computer as you need or want. I have at least 12 different ones for different reasons.

If you are trying to play multiple games using one single installation you are looking to have serious problems.

He is a DAT, they need to have things explained to them very slowly . . .

Zovs, take your existing .exe file in your regular game and change it to a .exe.bak so it will not be used but you will have it there just in case you need or want to go back to it.

Take your .exe from the new Beta that you have installed in a separate folder as a new installation by copying it, then move over to your old folder where you want to use the newest beta .exe, then past it there. Copy your target information from your shortcut, such as mine which is ""D:\games\WITPAE\WITPAE beta SeeBee installed\War in the Pacific Admiral Edition.exe" -wd -dd_sw -SingleCpuOrders -deepColor -archive -AltFont -pxf1368 -pyf768", make a new shortcut for your new .exe file, then copy the target information to the new shortcut. Delete your old shortcut since it probably won't work anymore.

[Nomad]

I did not change my shortcut, the name of the file is the same, so no problem, no changing needed.

[Zovs]

It looks me that Nomad Jerry rigged it. If you take a clean install of the latest beta and then try to use an old graphics mod on top of that it won’t work. You’ll have incompatible data with old art that won’t jive. Unless you Jerry rigged it by only moving certain files to a certain location to possibly make the old art work with old data otherwise the old art won’t work with the new data (I.e., the new beta).

So yes with the new beta you can’t get old data and old art to work they are not compatible with the new data and thus are broken unless you Jerry rig your beta install with an old install.

I do not understand what you mean by jerry rigging. We just simply made a new installation of the game using the 1127.2 patch. Then we moved the exe and the exe only to our current PBEM game folders.
this is the same as just doing an exe patch, one which michaelmau75 provided earlier. You can not update an existing game with new map art and data files, you will end up with a mess if you try.

There is nothing to prevent you from making as many installations on your computer as you need or want. I have at least 12 different ones for different reasons.

If you are trying to play multiple games using one single installation you are looking to have serious problems.

He is a DAT, they need to have things explained to them very slowly . . .

Zovs, take your existing .exe file in your regular game and change it to a .exe.bak so it will not be used but you will have it there just in case you need or want to go back to it.

Take your .exe from the new Beta that you have installed in a separate folder as a new installation by copying it, then move over to your old folder where you want to use the newest beta .exe, then past it there. Copy your target information from your shortcut, such as mine which is ""D:\games\WITPAE\WITPAE beta SeeBee installed\War in the Pacific Admiral Edition.exe" -wd -dd_sw -SingleCpuOrders -deepColor -archive -AltFont -pxf1368 -pyf768", make a new shortcut for your new .exe file, then copy the target information to the new shortcut. Delete your old shortcut since it probably won't work anymore.

Now that makes sense. Thanks.

[RangerJoe]

I did not change my shortcut, the name of the file is the same, so no problem, no changing needed.

True, but it is better safe than sorry.

[MarkShot]

Of course, an EXE could be incompatible with scenarios and/or save games. The heart of the issue is whether the engine's mechanics change or the data format of its input files change.

As best I know, only engine mechanics are being altered in EXE.

I like my map. I like stacking limits option. I like the scenarios done through the years. I don't see any way to keep this stuff; other than doing simple EXE swapping.

For me, the above is more important than correcting small inaccuracies on the map. Such things do not impact the larger game experience. (and it is not like new scenarios are going to coming out once a week for WITP-AE) GGs games are very complex, and developing a scenario is a major undertaking. Only the hardcore players will do so.

[Trugrit]

I’ve never seen this method…..but I suspected that it could be done but I thought
it would move in an opposite direction.

A player can create a new folder on the desktop and install the new Beta into it.
(Like I have done in my above post)

That would show the files and folders included in the new Beta.
Then take an older game install and import the required data and maps into it.

That would require knowing which data would be needed to import
which I don’t know….because I don’t know where all the game code
elements are located…. but it might be done by trial and error.
I’m still not sure it would work that way.

Note...there is not very many hard core changes made by the new Beta.
The change history just shows 9 code changes (As below).

The reason there are so few, as most experienced players know, is because
Michael McFarland (michaelm 75au) spent years perfecting what could be done to the
game code, removing bugs and adding features and click saving options for the players.

Before the new beta was released the game code was already as near perfect as it
could be within the existing game engine. The hard code changes that can be made are
limited in the new Beta because of the existing game engine….which has not changed.

I’m patient and willing to wait for the player base to create new mods and modify
existing scenarios….I’m willing to do some of that myself but I’m not going to
go that route until the new Beta is closer to the final version.

In fact I found a free program that modders could use:
https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/view ... 0#p5056380
The map I modified is not useful because it is not anywhere near complete.

What this thread has shown is that many players want Matrix to split out
the game code changes from the new map info.

New Beta Code Changes.jpg (148.31 KiB) Viewed 1144 times

[Moltrey]

So thinking a bit ahead here guys-

Has anybody made the effort to try to contact the map modders that are still (relatively) active? I only ask because as a newb I don't know how much you regulars stay in touch with modders anymore.

I believe Skacee is still around but being in Czechoslovakia he doesn't hang around here much. Might be waiting for the update to finish for all I know. He did come back last year to update based on Andrew Brown's work.
Obviously ChemKid is a no-go, but perhaps someone could reverse engineer his work in Photoshop and add the new bases, etc.?
I don't believe MakeeLearn is around either, but maybe I am wrong.

[rook749]

It seems I have another Divide by Zero error, causing a crash mid-turn.

I think it is TF 247, but I could be wrong. I tried the same trick as I used last time (setting the Base and Deistion to the Same Location). As the TF is heading away from the Base, it did not resolve the issue.

Does anyone have any ideas on how to work around the issue?

[Tanaka]

So thinking a bit ahead here guys-

Has anybody made the effort to try to contact the map modders that are still (relatively) active? I only ask because as a newb I don't know how much you regulars stay in touch with modders anymore.

I believe Skacee is still around but being in Czechoslovakia he doesn't hang around here much. Might be waiting for the update to finish for all I know. He did come back last year to update based on Andrew Brown's work.
Obviously ChemKid is a no-go, but perhaps someone could reverse engineer his work in Photoshop and add the new bases, etc.?
I don't believe MakeeLearn is around either, but maybe I am wrong.

Yes I messaged MakeeLearn in December 2021 to see if he would be able to update his amazing map artwork to the new patches but never got a response. He was last active on the forums in January 2022. I think others have tried to contact him as well but I do not know if he ever responded...

I just saw that Skacee responded to the jwilkerson update post below:

https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/view ... 3&t=391954

[wtwelder]

I have a question regarding the Guadalcanal Scenario for the latest Beta. I'm a long time player who has only played the Allied side up until now. With the new beta and upcoming new game release, I decided to try and learn the Japanese side. I'm playing a PBEM Guadalcanal game and see something like this for the Japanese Ship Reinforcement Availability and Arrival Schedule screen:

NewGuadShipAvail.jpg (51.49 KiB) Viewed 684 times

I've noticed that ships with an ETA of 1 day just sit there and never arrive. As an inexperienced Japanese player, I assumed this had something to do with building the ships and didn't worry about it too much. Then, I brought up a head to head Guadalcanal game using the last "old" beta version (1.8.11.26b) and saw this different version of the same screen.

OldGuadShipAvail.jpg (44.02 KiB) Viewed 684 times

The older version of the game did not have anything related to ship building on the Reinforcement Availability screen.

Is the Reinforcement Availability screen for the latest release working as intended (with the ship building info on the screen) or should the screen look like the older game versions (without the ship building info) since this is a scenario and not the full campaign?

[GrosserKreuzer]

I would guess that this has to do with production being turned off for this scenario since ship building is part of the production system (shipyard points are also at 0). Taking a quick look I also noticed that ships with a further away arrival date dont come closer to arrival. Interestingly, some of the ships without a build rate (looking at the CV TF) came closer, others didnt.
I think that the old version should work better, but I dont know for sure.