Substitutions (Even Within Type) Not Working in TB

[ImperatorAugustus]

Substitutions (Even Within Type) Not Working in TB

https://imgur.com/a/xbCkeit

Also results in nonsense like having permanently empty units in TB because they can't equip the named piece.

[ImperatorAugustus]

Save from custom scenario for testing.
Do you need the Scen?

[Joel Billings]

I don't know what can be done, but can you give me info on a unit (or set of similar units) and describe exactly what you expect to happen and what is not happening (what ground element is not getting a substitution). If I have that, and ideally have a save from the prior player turn then we could look at it. So if it's a Soviet unit that is the problem, we'd like a save from the German turn (ideally German pre-log save, but it could be the start of German turn save as well if it's something in the TB and not impacted by the German move). Thanks.

[ImperatorAugustus]

Any of the Soviet Artillery brigades I added.

As you can see in the screenshots they will substitute out the named guns in the toe for the others ONLY on the map.

You also cant send depleted units to the map. So anything that you are short of that has only 1 combat element is unable to be deployed. In cases with multiple combat elements, but you are short only some of them, then you need to send it to the map to substitute, then back to the reserves to train up.

[Wiedrock]

If it would instantly substitude all, then you could build the "best" Artillery SU and this unit would then instead of getting 150mm get 200mm+ guns without the support elements/manpower those bigger guns usually require in their TOEs.

[M60A3TTS]

Substitutions (Even Within Type) Not Working in TB

https://imgur.com/a/xbCkeit

Also results in nonsense like having permanently empty units in TB because they can't equip the named piece.

In what scenario are you allowed to build 90 howitzer brigades? I thought the build limit was like 20-something.

[Joel Billings]

It's very possible that substitutions were ruled out from the reserve box. The reserve box gets first priority on replacements, especially when on refit. It may be assumed that these units are only going to get the equipment that the OB calls for, and is not going to substitute in other equipment. I don't know that to be the case, just thinking it might have been intended. Even the non-reserve TBs have certain rules around their getting replacements that are different from the map. What I do know is the substitution system is complicated enough, and there would be many unintended side effects in trying to change it for both the on-map and TB situations. At this point, we're not prepared to open up that can of worms.

[ImperatorAugustus]

If it would instantly substitude all, then you could build the "best" Artillery SU and this unit would then instead of getting 150mm get 200mm+ guns without the support elements/manpower those bigger guns usually require in their TOEs.

Except instead it put in shitty WW1 guns.
This is also an extreme case.

M60 this was just for testing substitutions I could of done the same thing with 20.

Joel. This seems to apply to other TBs as well.

[56ajax]

It's very possible that substitutions were ruled out from the reserve box. The reserve box gets first priority on replacements, especially when on refit. It may be assumed that these units are only going to get the equipment that the OB calls for, and is not going to substitute in other equipment. I don't know that to be the case, just thinking it might have been intended. Even the non-reserve TBs have certain rules around their getting replacements that are different from the map. What I do know is the substitution system is complicated enough, and there would be many unintended side effects in trying to change it for both the on-map and TB situations. At this point, we're not prepared to open up that can of worms.

Slightly off topic but in my experience as a Soviet replacements go to Non Reserve TBs, Reserve and then the map in that order. Never place too many units on refit in the Reserve otherwise nothing gets to full strength. The only units not at full strength in non Reserve TBs are those whose TOE has items that are yet to be in production eg T60s, AT rifles etc

[Joel Billings]

Yes, it was an early design decision to take over control of the TB replacements and prioritize them. The game is about the East, so we had to have a certain amount of control regarding the TBs. I'm not surprised the substitutions are done the same in the other TBs. After our last work on the substitutions we've concluded that there is no code change we can put in now that would make things better without making other things worse. So it's not something we're looking at changing via code changes.