Matrix Games Forums

Hi - I'm new the WITE franchise, am prepared to invest some time into learning how to play the beast, but the amount of stuff to learn is pretty intimidating. I already own WITE (got it with a large Matrix Anniversary discount some time ago) and don't currently own WITE2, but is WITE2 easier to learn (or the contrary, as WITE2 seems to have more complex air systems?)? Am I right in thinking WITE2 has a better AI? I've also updated the map in WITE to use the beautiful "Rainy Day in Russia" one, which I have to say I think looks better than the WITE2 map, so aesthetically I think prefer WITE a little....

Alternatively, I guess there is War in the West, which uses the new air system, but presumably has a lower density of units, which may be easier to grapple with? I'm less interested in that theatre, though, especially as it doesn't include the 1940-1942 campaigns in Egypt and Libya (which I would have been interested in - hope they cover these soon, as well as the early Campaigns, like Case Yellow...)

A) if you have experience with WITE 1 you just need to unlearn and relearn a few things.
B) there is a section in the manual for WITE players, a condensed guide that may help in your transition.

Personally I think WITE 2 is easier to learn, but I came from a WITE background and did a deep dive into WITW to get the hang of the Air War, but also have been a play tester for both WITE 1 and WITE 2.

So I am biased.

Get them all, you'll have endless hours of fun, challenges and frustrations in the sense of learning from your mistakes.

IMHO

Thanks, I've only just started trying to learn WITE, so am basically starting from scratch.

One question - is the manual for WITE2 better - i.e. more readable / helpful?

Also is the AI much better in WITE2 or not much difference? I will likely only be playing vs. the AI, due to time constraints

Matrix and 2by3 Games allowed to download the full manual before the game release, for free.

https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/view ... 9#p4801339


The updated though not beautiful version of the manual is in this thread.

https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/view ... 6&t=370624

WiTE2 is the better game it is also more complex and less newbie friendly I'd say.

AI works but probably need 110-120+ depending on how much of a fight you want and how much you want to exploit the AI poorer decision making.

Air and Depots are the big changes I'd say. Air is fiddly and is basically high effort low effect. Both can be managed by the AI for the first games.

Also weather is a big one and I think it is significantly more random in its effect. Which is an annoyance but it also makes each game a bit more unique.

Also combat preparation points but those are considerably better now than a few patches ago, still a bit strange when units go from 30-40cv to 10 or less in a single turn of offensive operations but its just the way it is.

Get WITE2 and start learning how to play and you will never look back. So yes. Get WITE2! It's a lot better than WITE.

exalted wrote: ↑Tue Mar 28, 2023 2:23 pm WiTE2 is the better game it is also more complex and less newbie friendly I'd say.

...

Air and Depots are the big changes I'd say. Air is fiddly and is basically high effort low effect. Both can be managed by the AI for the first games.

But if I let the AI manage Air initially, then is it no more complex than WITE?

exalted wrote: ↑Tue Mar 28, 2023 2:23 pm AI works but probably need 110-120+ depending on how much of a fight you want and how much you want to exploit the AI poorer decision making.

Is the AI any better than the original WITE, though? Thanks

Nazcatraz wrote: ↑Tue Mar 28, 2023 3:16 pm Get WITE2 and start learning how to play and you will never look back. So yes. Get WITE2! It's a lot better than WITE.

Thanks, it's a little pricey, though, so may have to wait for a sale or discount coupon from Matrix to purchase it

OxfordGuy3 wrote: ↑Tue Mar 28, 2023 5:24 pm

Nazcatraz wrote: ↑Tue Mar 28, 2023 3:16 pm Get WITE2 and start learning how to play and you will never look back. So yes. Get WITE2! It's a lot better than WITE.

Thanks, it's a little pricey, though, so may have to wait for a sale or discount coupon from Matrix to purchase it

on a per hour basis, this is the cheapest game I've ever bought

The two cheapest yet long lasting games I have are:

Steel Panthers WW2 (Shrapnel's version of course)/Steel Panthers MBT (again Shrapnel's version)

GG WITE 2

When I say cheapest I mean for example I paid $39.95 for SPWW2 and SPMBT (each) and have played endless hours in those two games. I have some games where I paid the same price and only have played them under 20 hours.

No idea how many hours I have logged on SPWW2 and MBT, but I have almost 4k logged hours in WITE2 (via Steam), and that does not include the pre-Steam release and all the countless hours play testing WITE2.

So $79 may seem steep, the hours spent will soon pay off ten or twenty fold.

Zovs wrote: ↑Tue Mar 28, 2023 5:45 pm When I say cheapest I mean for example I paid $39.95 for SPWW2 and SPMBT (each) and have played endless hours in those two games. I have some games where I paid the same price and only have played them under 20 hours.

No idea how many hours I have logged on SPWW2 and MBT, but I have almost 4k logged hours in WITE2 (via Steam), and that does not include the pre-Steam release and all the countless hours play testing WITE2So $79 may seem steep, the hours spent will soon pay off ten or twenty fold.

Oh I know what you mean, the game I've spent the most money on is Paradox's Europa Universalis IV, but in terms of pounds sterling per hours spent playing, it's been by far the best value! I didn't like their Hearts of Iron IV game, though, for World War 2 grand strategy I much prefer Strategic Command: War in Europe, especially when played PBEM. I'm aware WITE/WITE 2 are very different beasts from those games, though. I have played some other more traditional hex-based wargames, but nothing as complex. It's just a lot of money (£68.99 in the UK via Matrix, which is about $85) to pay for something I'm not 100% sure I'm going to be able to get my head around, so maybe I should see how I get on with WITE first, which I already own.

OxfordGuy3 wrote: ↑Tue Mar 28, 2023 8:07 pm

Zovs wrote: ↑Tue Mar 28, 2023 5:45 pm When I say cheapest I mean for example I paid $39.95 for SPWW2 and SPMBT (each) and have played endless hours in those two games. I have some games where I paid the same price and only have played them under 20 hours.

No idea how many hours I have logged on SPWW2 and MBT, but I have almost 4k logged hours in WITE2 (via Steam), and that does not include the pre-Steam release and all the countless hours play testing WITE2So $79 may seem steep, the hours spent will soon pay off ten or twenty fold.

Oh I know what you mean, the game I've spent the most money on is Paradox's Europa Universalis IV, but in terms of pounds sterling per hours spent playing, it's been by far the best value! I didn't like their Hearts of Iron IV game, though, for World War 2 grand strategy I much prefer Strategic Command: War in Europe, especially when played PBEM. I'm aware WITE/WITE 2 are very different beasts from those games, though. I have played some other more traditional hex-based wargames, but nothing as complex. It's just a lot of money (£68.99 in the UK via Matrix, which is about $85) to pay for something I'm not 100% sure I'm going to be able to get my head around, so maybe I should see how I get on with WITE first, which I already own.

I think that is a wise decision. Since you already have WITE 1, mostly the UI is the same as WITE 2, so if you get the hang of WITE 1 with the UI and the game mechanics its "mostly" the same concept in WITE 2. If you like the game mechanics in WITE 1 (not sure if you have WITW but its mechanics are generally the same as WITE, sans the Air, but they lifted the Air from WITW and strapped it onto WITE 2) then you'll understand or like WITE 2. So when the next sale rolls around you can then decide if you want to proceed.

No I don't have WITW (I'm only really interested in the Eastern Front, '40-'42 North Africa and '39/'40 Blitzkrieg campaigns for WW2 games - not really interested in Torch either, which is the only North Africa action WITW gives AFAIK). Think I'll stick with WITE for now, have already added some graphic mods to make it prettier to look at

1. For me, not having any experience with WiTW, the biggest initial difference was the Air System. Wish I could say "... but don't worry about it, because the new air system is so much better, cooler, awesomer, ....", but the jury is still out.

2. Logistics is very much changed. For the most part, I feel this change is better and makes the game more interesting and involved.

Following is a rather verbose list of key changes (from the manual) between WiTE1 vs WiTE2.

Items in blue, I felt were an improvement. The one item in red, really introduces a level of weirdness when playing PvP, IMO. (won't spoil it for you and let you experience it for yourself....)

The rest, I am either neutral, or awaiting for them to be fully implemented.

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