Shannon V. OKeets
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
ORIGINAL: brian brian
for me it is a hard decision. I also like considering some saving for the Marine Corps, or perhaps the Marine division. I also like to get the Aquila CV started for joint operations with the Japanese in the Indian Ocean in 1942. It is also nice to get some lift started. In my current game I didn't draw the range 6 FTR at start, another wrinkle to the decision. Sometimes I am grateful for the CW starting the war for me so the German loans can start rolling in.
Here is the summary of this thread in regards to Italian production. There are still a few scatterred comments that I haven't yet integrated into the AIO Italy strategic plan. But this is 95+% of the comments about Italian production.
1.1.5 Areas of conflict and type of combat: land, naval, air, and/or convoys.
1939 - neutral - build major naval if desired plus ARM & FTR & NAV
1940 - maybe France, but definitely in Africa against the British - ARM & FTR & NAV & INF & SUB
1941 - more against the British but beware of the tide turning. - Build INF & SUB & NAV
1942 - start preparing defensive positions. Redeploy Fleet to react to enemy AMPH
1943 - Be prepared to sacrifice your fleet to stop enemy invasions. If you can destroy the first landing you will set their schedule back by six months.
1944/1945 - Hunker down and make him pay for every footstep. Build INF.
1.1.6 Master production plan (MC)
18.104.22.168 Resources and Convoys
Italy starts with 11 factories, 5 resources, and 7 convoys. The factories are all in Italy proper. The resources are located:
∙ 2 RP in Italy.
∙ 1 RP that has to either come by rail through Yugoslavia or by convoy (Italian Coast).
∙ 1 in Sardinia the has to be convoyed (Italian Coast).
∙ Italy gets one of Rumania’s oil points by trade agreement.
This only uses 1 convoy while Italy is at peace and generates 5 PP, which become 3 BP with Italy’s 1939 production multiple of 0.5. In 1940, Italy produces 4 BP, in 1941 - 5 BP, in 1942 - 7 BP, 1943 - 8 BP.
The convoy(s) in the Italian Coast are quite vulnerable to attack.
22.214.171.124 Build Points and Trade Agreements
∙ Italy’s only trade agreement is for the 1 oil point from Rumania each turn.
∙ Once Barbarossa starts, max out Italian production with German loans, but before then loans will probably depend on if the Russians are trying to delay a 1941 Barbarossa.
126.96.36.199 Force Pool, Lend-Lease, and Building Ahead
Italy is an integral part of the EuroAxis. It must not be played independently from Germany, there should be but one strategy and one operational command. In practice, that means that the German player, with advice from the Italian player, should make strategic decisions, decide what and how much Italy builds, decide where Italian units are deployed and decide what action type Italy takes each impulse.
Italy can be a highly valuable partner of the EuroAxis. Germany will take a lot of land impulses with an occasional combined. Italy, on the other hand, can take a mix of combined, naval or air impulses as required. That makes Italian ships and planes more mobile than the German ones, and so Navy and Air Force are what Italy should focus on.
What should be built, and when depends only slightly on the Axis strategy. Certainly the question how many AMPHs (if any) Italy should build does. But most units listed below should be built (or not built) regardless of the Axis strategy.
Building for Italy requires German Lend Lease. What to build early is sufficiently valuable to delay German ARM production. Decide at the start of each turn what Italy should build that turn, and then send lend lease accordingly. Small adjustments may be necessary at the end of the turn in case of losses suffered.
188.8.131.52 Production Priorities
∙ Build all HQs. Badoglio in time for Barbarossa, Cavallero for Summer 1943. The EuroAxis needs a number of HQs for supply in the West. At least 2 are needed in France to watch the coast, and it`s much better using Italians for this than having to leave German HQs behind during Barbarossa. Also, Italian HQs can be useful for reorganizing planes in air impulses. I like to use Balbo in Russia and leave the others in the west.
∙ Keep the MTN and INF divisions on the map, split up corps or rebuild them whenever they are lost. They are useful both for invasions, and as second or third units for places like Malta or Sardinia.
∙ Build the elite GARS from 1940 and 1941. They are very useful to defend places which are liable to be put out of supply like Malta, Sardinia, Copenhagen or Frederickshaven. Germany has not enough bad elite units for these places, and you don`t want to leave a German 7-3 elite INF on garrison duty when you can have an Italian 5-1 elite GAR instead.
∙ Other land units should be built later (1942/1943+) only after the corresponding German units are built. At some time, the Axis wants every land unit, but the German units are both better and less restricted by action limits. However, for late game, the Italian MIL, INF and ENG are a must, and a rich Axis may find value in the MOT, MECH and ARM as well, after Germany has emptied their land force pools.
∙ Do not build the Italian MAR or PARA, since the German ones are better. Only build them if you build the Germans as well and still want more, for a strategy like Sealion or Gibraltar by invasion.
∙ When on the defensive build maximum ground units.
∙ Build INF.
∙ From Mar/Apr 1941, Italy starts producing some land units (mil+gar) to help bolster the defenses, which start arriving in the autumn.
∙ Build and rebuild the FROGs whenever they are in the Force Pool. They are cheap, and can sometimes be used to good effect against Allied AMPHs preparing to invade.
∙ Build all SUBs, whether you build the Germans or not. The Italians have better action limits, so if you build the German SUBs as well they can search for them in a German land impulse. If you don`t build the Germans, the Italians should still be built as a mobile threat which forces the Allies to at least guard their convoys.
∙ You may or may not want to build one or more AMPH or TRS, depending on your strategy. Building one is prudent though not required with any strategy in case the British nail one with a good search roll. Building more can be interesting in conjunction with a strategy other than Barbarossa 1941, in order to increase transport and invasion capacity in the med (and outside, if you take Gibraltar or Suez). However, if you decide to build any, start them as early as possible to get the most out of them.
∙ Build convoys only when necessary. Try to make the 7 you start with last as long as possible, but if you might run out, rebuild early enough. Having to keep supply with TRS is both embarrassing and costly.
∙ Do not build or repair SCS early, the build points can be spent much better on planes (or German panzers). In 1942/1943, after most of the more important stuff has been built, it may become interesting to repair ships and complete the Impero and Roma to help defend the Italian Coast (or play in the Atlantic if you have Gibraltar), particularly when playing with DSB (?). Again, a judgment call depending on the situation. You may well decide that the BPs can be used better in other ways.
∙ Do not build CVs, they are not worth the expense.
∙ Lay down carriers and new battleships in 1939/early1940 or not at all. Since it takes those units 2 years to get operational then there's no point leaving it any longer.
∙ The Aquila CV sometimes though to have fun with in the mid-game as part of a Mid-East or Gibraltar strategy but it is an expensive investment.
∙ Build all FTRs, every year. Germany never has enough fighters. The Italians are slightly worse than the Germans, but their increased mobility due to the possibility of Italian air impulses makes up for that. In 1943, Italy should advance build the 1944 and 1945 FTRs as well, even before Germany does so.
∙ Build enough NAVs to form a credible threat to invasion fleets. Build points permitting, build most or all Italian NAVs every year until the EuroAxis is losing the air battle in the west.
∙ Build the Stuka in Jan/Feb 1941. It is the most valuable plane the Axis has, as it can be reorganized by Italian ATRs and HQs and fly many times in a summer turn.
∙ Build both ATRs. Italian ATRs are great both for dropping German PARAs and for reorganizing the above mentioned Stuka in an air impulse.
∙ The Piaggios and LND-3 are very nice if you can afford them, which you probably can`t before 1942. Build Italian LND-3 before building German ones. They are slightly worse, but Italy will have less problems with action limits than Germany.
∙ When on the defensive build maximum fighters.
∙ Build all the Italian LND as soon as possible.
∙ Germany's favorite units in Barbarossa are Italian airplanes.
∙ Build the Italian 'Stuka' the LND-2 they start with but without a Pilot in. It's as good as an extra INF corps if trying to break into the French Alps on the surprise impulse. Later it is good to help protect the Italian CPs from CW SUB raids.
Italy, especially if the Allies are going to come after her first, and the med is not closed, needs Nav and FTRs's to survive. It is all very well saying it should commit a large number of air units to Russia but if the Allies have Gib then you can expect Sardina to be under threat very early.
To avoid this Italy needs' to build Nav and it needs them sooner rather than later closely followed by FTRs's.
If the Germans have gone for a 41 Barb Italy should request the long range FW 190's to protect the Med sea zones.
If Germany goes after Gib then all the Nav are very useful in clearing the Brits out of Cape St Vincent and then the Bay.
If the German is planning a 1941Gibraltar, Italy builds accordingly: AMPH, ATR, PARA & MAR if possible.
< Message edited by Shannon V. OKeets -- 7/13/2007 10:43:00 PM >
Perfection is an elusive goal.