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Historical Project - Reboot - 7/27/2021 5:01:46 PM   
stjeand


Posts: 1204
Joined: 1/10/2021
From: Aurora, NC
Status: offline
So with the new version is it time to take some of the good...the bad...and the ugly and rebuild...

First off thanks to the few that helped with the testing. Your services are invaluable.

Below are thoughts...


1) Japan early invasions...
Still a huge issue. They can take India pretty easily...
DEI falls turn 1 80%+ of the time in testing.

So because of this I will keep:


The changes kept:

All units at sea become 5/10 not 10/10.
Continue to phase in the LCs...not just start with 200. The phasing in really slows down the invasions in a way that I really liked. Can't speak for the testers.
Will phase in transports like the Allies have. Basically they will start with 60 - 80 and get 10 per month in 1942.
3 locations must be taken for the DEI to surrender, Surabaya, Batvia and Palembang.
DEI Port supply does not work until the Axis control all 4 ports in Borneo and Singapore. In testing it takes Japan until Feb to take the DEI.
DEI manpower was changed to a starting of 1...so that the UK does not send all their PP their and the DEA can just repair all their units fully.
This aligns perfectly with history which is the desire.
ONCE the DEI surrenders Japan will no longer need to control all 4 ports on Borneo to keep it in supply, that stipulation will be lifted...BUT they must continue to control Singapore.

India is the big issue. Japan has to take Ceylon before they are able to invade the West coast and Rangoon before they can invade the East.
Rangoon is easy so then they are able to invade the port on the east coast. Ceylon is not that difficult either to be honest.
So a minor change...
1) Japan must own Rangoon.
2) Japan must own Singapore
3) DEI must have surrendered.
4) Japan must own Calcutta.

A minor change to that area of the map...the port Chittagong creates a dilema. Both Axis and Allies had major supply issues passing through Burma.
Due to this port that issue does not exist...so I thought to change that.

1) Chittagong will be suppressed to the Axis if the Allies own either Rangoon or Calcutta.
2) Chittagong will be suppressed to the Allies if the Axis own either Rangoon or Calcutta.

So in essence you must own both Calcutta and Rangoon to gain supply at this port.

This heavily limits supplies to the Allies and to the Axis moving through Burma which is historically accurate.

Will have to see how this affects the Japanese attack on India in testing.

Australia / NZ
Still easy to take but not a good return for the Japanese. It does slow the Allies down which is fine.
Currently the Axis have to take about 10 ports before Australia ports will be allowed supplies. I plan to change that a bit...they will be required to take one port within an island grouping and some of the major ports...
Basically the Axis must take, Lae, Rabaul, Port Moresby and 3 other ports...then supply can occur. Like the US island hopping below they must own 1 of group is islands...the more the safer from supply being cut (see Island Hopping below).
The port chain is impossible for the Japanese to keep garrisoned. BUT have to still make it take time so that they are not invading Aus with multiple armies and basically taking the entire East Coast and New Zealand before the Allies can react.


Al nicely took care of Japan receiving garrison units. Have not seen what they are yet since I tried to play but it is pretty broken. I will test it shortly though.
Al added a reason for the Allies to not just randomly invade Japan, a homeguard.


New thoughts...

New Caladonia, Fiji, Port Moresby and Truk seems FAR to easy to take if you own the seas.
Japan just blockades them an they fall in less than 2 months.
I am thinking that for this test they will be made into supply sources so that the Japanese can't starve them out so easily.
I will see if there is a way to turn that off after say Jan 1 of 1943.
THOUGH the carrier change below might resolve this issue since the US will be able to do something naval wise. Again will require testing.

Carrier stacking...well 6 carriers make is such that the US carriers are useless until 1943 which is FAR from accurate. The Japanese will just keep the 6 together and be basically unbeatable.
I am thinking to change the stacking to 4. NOW the Japanese will still get their 6 to attack on turn 1, but then the stack will have to be 4.
This will though make the US stack stronger than the Japanese so to counter an early US victory I will lower the starting experience of their carriers by 5% and raise the Japanese by 5%...
JUST on the carriers. I will need to run some 4 vs 4 tests....BUT this should make it such that the Japanese don't completely rule the seas and there is some actually battles occurring.
This may be too much against the Japanese but it will need to be tested.
But to be honest...the naval battles are extremely boring and this should spice the up as well as give the US the ability to break blockades. Right now if they try every ship just gets sunk and that is far from historically accurate.

US island hopping. Sadly with the current rules they have no reason too...when they have more naval units they can just head to Japan and invade...SO to counter this, they will be required to island hop.
The US will have to capture 1 island in each of 3 rings and HOLD it in order to supply units on mainland Japan.
SO to start.
For the US to supply any islands from Truk west and from Borneo north they must control one of, Henderson Field, Buin, Ndeni, Kwajalein, Wotje, Pago Pago, Fiji or New Caledonia.
For the US to supply the Phillipines, Guam, Siapan and the islands in this area they control one of, Truk, Manus, Jayapora, Lae, Rabual, Enewetak.
For the US to supply Main land Japane they must control one of, Aparri, Yap, Paulu Islan, Manilla, Siapan, or Guam
Now they can just take one island or multiple...because there is always the chance that the Japanese can retake the one port the US took and knock them out of supply.
So it is highly suggested that the US take a couple ports in each grouping to be safe and not cut by a rouge Japanese invasion.
I will give all the exact island names in the near future...but all the ports in the grouping are level 3 or higher.

Armor...I will be making the units armored divisions, which fits more to the Pacific.

Mech...will be removed. No one used mech in the Pacific...the unit will be converted to an Island Garrison unit, though not sure it will be needed. Will need to test.

China, might become a bit to easy...since Japan won't be invading India and not sure about Aus...so they may just send all their armies into China.
Perhaps their ports will need to be made a little smaller so that they can not support to many more units there.
For the moment this will not change but will need to be monitored.

Post #: 1
RE: Historical Project - Reboot - 7/30/2021 1:12:12 PM   
stjeand


Posts: 1204
Joined: 1/10/2021
From: Aurora, NC
Status: offline
Another added thought...

Moved the Allied convoy routes to make it harder for the Japanese surface fleet to intercept.
Basically to the edge of the map.

BUT this could be changed back with the CV change in testing. Figured to get this out of the way for the time being and test...
Easily can put back.

Made a change to India for testing...all ports other than Calcutta no longer provide supply for the Axis and will not until India surrenders.
Again this is just a test. Simple change to convert back but the IJN stated clearly they could not supply India. BUT if they are able to capture Calcutta they will be able to supply a campaign against India from there.

(in reply to stjeand)
Post #: 2
RE: Historical Project - Reboot - 8/5/2021 5:31:59 PM   
stjeand


Posts: 1204
Joined: 1/10/2021
From: Aurora, NC
Status: offline
Latest add...

US island hopping...

So the US armed forces clearly understood you could not just invade Japan and supply that invasion from Hawaii / US Coast.
Just too far for supplies to flow adiquitely.


I have set up multiple "rings" that the US must island hop through in order to move their supply forward.
This pushes naval port supply into more like land supply. You must control a leve 3+ port within a reasonable range before being able to supply your continued advance.


Below is the flow / list:

US Ring:

Ports that allow supply to the Distant Ring

Honolulu, Lahaina, Hilo

Hawaii is the key to supplying the "Distant" Ring. (yes I need better names)
So long as the Allies control one port in Hawaii, the ports in the Distant Ring will be suppied.

Other ports:
Johnson Isle, Midway



Distant Ring:

Ports that allow supply to the Outer Ring

Wotje, Kwajalein, Buan, Henderson Field, Ndeni, Espirito Santo

AT least ONE of the above ports will need to be controlled by the Allies to supply ports in the Outer Ring.
The Allies can control multiple which is suggested so that they do not lose the port and all supply capability moving forward.

Other ports:
Namuga, Munda, Nauru, Tarawa, Maloelap, Canton Isle

Outer Ring:

Ports that allow supply to the Middle Ring

Truk, Maus, Jayapura, Lae, Kavieng, Rabaul, Enewetok

AT least ONE of the above ports will need to be controlled by the Allies to supply ports in the Middle Ring.
The Allies can control multiple which is suggested so that they do not lose the port and all supply capability moving forward.

Other ports:
Wake, Ponape, Wekak, Manando, Makasser

Middle Ring:

Ports that allow supply to the Inner Ring

Aparri, Lingayen, Manilla, Davao, Yap, Palau, Guam, Saipan

AT least ONE of the above ports will need to be controlled by the Allies to supply ports in the Inner Ring.
The Allies can control multiple which is suggested so that they do not lose the port and all supply capability moving forward.

Other ports:
Pagan, Baybay, Cebu, Legaspi

Inner Ring:

Ports that allow supply to the Japanese island and China

Taihoku, Okinawa, Iwo Jima, Chichi Jima, Tainan

AT least ONE of the above ports will need to be controlled by the Allies to supply ports in Japan and China.
The Allies can control multiple which is suggested so that they do not lose the port and all supply capability moving forward.

Other ports:
Naha




While this may sound complex in reality it is basically making the US take a level 3+ port in an area and then they can move to the next area.

I feel that there is little reason to take many islands except that you feel you are "supposed" to as they did so in history.
This gives the Allies a reason and is more realistic.

KEEP IN MIND...if you lose control of all the "suppy" ports in a ring you supply to forward ports will be cut. That is why you should take multiple ports or protect them well.

Hopefully this makese sense.

Waiting to fully test this as the editor is currently experiencing difficulties.



(in reply to stjeand)
Post #: 3
Historical Project - Reboot --- Status update - 8/12/2021 1:14:55 PM   
stjeand


Posts: 1204
Joined: 1/10/2021
From: Aurora, NC
Status: offline
I am on the final leg of getting this ready for Beta.
Only have 2 outstanding issues waiting for answers.

1) That Japanese used to have 8 Supply oilers in the deployment queue...they were removed with the update. Not sure if this was intentional or by mistake.
2) The DEI oil. There is an issue regarding what happens with all that oil since the Japanese can not capture the DEI until late Jan / Feb of 42. I tried to turn OFF trade but that does not appear to work. So I converted one of the rail hexes to road so the 30 oil from Palembang does not "transfer" to the UK. When I try to convert the road back to rail it does not appear to work. So waiting for an answer on how to resolve this.
One other possibility would be to reduce the UK and US MS until Feb and then provide them enough to start transferring resources. But I will wait to see if I can get road to rail work.

UPDATED Change log:

Special Rules

Japanese landing craft are received at a rate of 20 per turn until 3/29/42. This simulates the limited amphibious capacity that the IJN had. Yes landing craft can be saved over turns to be able to land an army

CV stacking limit is set to 4. After the attack on Pearl Harbor the IJN rarely if at all operated all 6 CVs together. This will now allow there to be actual naval battles rather that complete Japanese domination. But to reflect their earlier better training the US CVs experience will be decreased by 10%. Over time this will increase due to combat and repairs. (This will need some decent testing to see if it makes naval battles actually matter early, other options...Japanese exp +5 US exp -5, Japanese +10% and US not changed...Not sure if a 10% boost will make a big difference but will have to see)

US to Australia convoy route was moved due to it being to easy for the Japanese to interdict and sink mass amounts of merchants with their surface fleet. In turn the US MS starting capacity was reduced and they receive more in phases during 1942

UK to India convoy route was moved due to it being to easy for the Japanese to interdict and sink mass amounts of merchants with their surface fleet. In turn the UK MS starting capacity was reduced and they receive more in phases during 1942. (This may be able to be moved back depending upon testing)

New Zealand - The Japanese player may not draw supply to any port if the Allies control Rabaul, Lae, Port Moresby, New Caledonia, Sydney or Brisbane.

Dutch East Indies - The Japanese IJN stated that they can not provide adequate supply resources for the invasion of Sumatra and Java unless they had full control of Borneo and Singapore.
The Axis may not draw supply in any DEI port unless they control Singapore and all 4 ports in Borneo.
Additionally the Japanese must capture 3 locations for the DEI to surrender. Those locations are Batvia, Surabaya and Palembang.
Once the DEI has surrendered the Japanese must just hold Singapore and a single port on the island of Borneo.

India - The IJN understood that they did not have enough supply ships to support an invasion of India. Their supplies lines were stretched just reaching Rangoon and in Burma. With this the Axis may not draw any port supply from ports in India unless they have surrendered. Calcutta is the sole exception. IF the Japanese are able to capture Calcutta they will receive port supply there so long as they control Rangoon, Singapore and the Dutch East Indies has surrendered.

Chittagong - Burma supply lines were extremely difficult to maintain via land and the port of Chittagong was difficult for either side to access if they did not control both Calcutta and Rangoon. To this extent neither the Allies or the Axis can use Chittagong as a supply source unless they control both Rangoon and Calcutta.

US / Allies Island Hopping - Supplying invasions in the Pacific was difficult. Lines were extremely long and difficult to protect. The US opted a methond of island hopping to create supply depots in order to supply further and further from the US West Coast.
In order to maintain the supply lines the Allies would need to capture a port a specific distance from Hawaii and create a supply depot.
Then they would move close to the Japanese mainland and take another island and create a supply depot there. That way they could move supplies via shorter distances.
To accomplish this the Allies must do the following:

US Ring: So long as the Allies hold one port listed below they can supply islands /ports in the Distant Ring.
This includes the ports of Honalulu, Hilo and Lahaina.
Other ports in the ring that can be taken but do not provide supply moving forward Midway and Johnson Isle.

Distant Ring: So long as the Allies hold one port listed below they can supply islands /ports in the Outer Ring.
This includes the ports of Wotje, Kwajalein, Buan, Henderson Field, Ndeni and Espirito Santo.
Other ports in the ring that can be taken but do not provide supply moving forward Namuga, Munda, Nauru, Tarawa, Maloelap and Canton Isle.

Outer Ring: So long as the Allies hold one port listed below they can supply islands / ports in the Middle Ring.
This includes the ports of Truk, Manus, Jayapura, Lae, Kavieng, Rabual and Enewetok.
Other ports in the ring that can be taken but do not provide supply moving forward Wake, Ponape, Wekak, Manando and Makasser.

Middle Ring: So long as the Allies hold one port listed below they can supply islands / ports in the Inner Ring.
This includes the ports of Aparri, Lingayen, Manilla, Davao, Yap, Palau, Guam or Saipan.
Other ports in the ring that can be taken but do not provide supply moving forward Pagan, Baybay, Cebu and Legaspi.

Inner Ring: So long as the Allies hold one port listed below they can supply islands / ports in the Japanese home island and China.
This includes the ports of Taihoku, Okinawa, Iwo Jima, Chichi Jima and Tainan Formosa.
Other ports in the ring that can be taken but do not provide supply moving forward Naha.

North American West Coast - The Japanese player may not draw supply to any port on the North American West Coast if Allies control Midway, Johnson Island, Kwajalein, Wake, Truk, or any port in the Hawaiian Islands.

Armored units in the game are divisions not corps since no armored corps existed in the Pacific Theater

Mech units have been removed from the game since they were not used in the Pacific Theater

Japan garrison reinforcements - Japan will get free small, 5 strength, island naval garrison units on the following size 1 port locations once they are Axis controlled and the hex is unoccupied: Dumai, Dili, Makassar, Manando, Wedo, Ambon, Sorong, Nauru, Milne Bay, Munda, and Namuga.

Japanese Island Garrison unit. The Mech unit was replaced by a 5 strength Island Garrison unit. It has a lower attack than the standard inf and a higher defense. Unit requires double landing craft if used in an amphibious invasion.






Things requiring testing:

Japanese vs US early naval battles...now that they will be able to fight, 4 CV vs 4 CV, need to be sure that the US is not able to just wipe out the Japanese fleet early and swing things too quickly.

With the mass invasion of India stopped what will happen with all the Japanese armies? If they "focus" on China will that fall to easy, or if they focus on Australia will that have the same issue?

Port Moresby, New Caledonia and Fiji are to easy for the Japanese to capture. They were never able too historically...how to address this?

(in reply to stjeand)
Post #: 4
RE: Historical Project - Reboot --- Status update - 8/13/2021 12:30:04 PM   
stjeand


Posts: 1204
Joined: 1/10/2021
From: Aurora, NC
Status: offline
Alright...FINALLY this is set for testing.

IF anyone wishes to test / help let me know. I can provide the scenario or I can set up a game and we can play mirror or not. Your choice.
You could play against the AI but I have not made changes to it. Doubt it will handle all of the changes well.

Things that I tried to address...

1) India. Japan just can run over it before they can really get defenses set up. I am not a fan of sending 4 / 5 armies against them but if you do you can cripple if not take India out of the game.
2) DEI. There were a few complaints early on that the DEI should not fall until Feb of 42. Well I was able to make that happen, and provided the Japanese with more oil. This has the added benefit of slowing down the Japanese advance into Australia and India.
3) Burma supply lines were horrible for both sides. Made some changes to create that affect.
4) Port Moresby, New Caledonia and Fiji were far to easy to take.
5) US and UK (though I may return the convoy lane to its original location) convoy lanes were to easy to interdict with Japanese surface ships. I always sent the Kido Butai against it and would routinely sink 10+ MM...as they should but that is just not what happened.
6) Armor and Mech. Not used much in the Pacific BUT...armor was changed to a division size. Mech was converted to an island garrison for the Japanese that requires double landing craft so that they are not used for that purpose.
7) Japanese LC are phased in, 20 per turn which is more realistic, rather than a mass invasion of everywhere in 3 turns.
8) Naval battles do not really happen in 42...the US try everything to avoid that Japanese because they are sailing around with 6CVs and are able to sink anything the US can do...So the US sit back and wait which is not what they did. Hopefully the change keeps the Japanese fleet honest and in the Rabaul / Truk area as it normally was.
9) US island hopping. Put in changes so that the US must island hop rather than just build 200 LC and land their entire army in Japan as soon as they own the seas.


Things to remember.
1) There is a lot of port suppression. IF a port is suppressed you can not use transports in and out of it. If you land be prepared to keep ships supplies close or expect to lose the unit.
2) PLEASE DO NOT stack transports with surface ships. That is currently a bug and in my eyes a cheat as you can move away and prevent the attacker from being able to pursue.
3) Any changes I made can be easily undone. If there is something you do not like let me know and it can be discussed.
4) Have fun...that is why we are here.
5) Thanks to all that wish to help.


Still under consideration
1) Forced Garrisons in the home areas. Does not make sense that the US would empty out the entire country of all defenses to attack Japan, just because they know that Japan can't invade because of supply and homeguard. Same for India, Australia and Japan. This garrison could increase of decrease over time...for example as time progresses the US may have less required garrison in the US because they have more forces and should be winning where as the Japanese may need to increase their garrison for the same reason.
2) CV stacking changes. Not sure about this...but want to have some interesting battles prior to late 43. Upped the Japanese experience just so that they can survive the battles as their CVs are inferior, if they occur. Not sure it will work but this is why we test. I dislike the US having to hide because there are stacks of 6 CVs around which are pretty much overpowering. NOT always...I did lose a battle with the US with them but that is once out of a dozen times. But the US did not shy away. In the current game it is likely if they venture out there is a decent chance they could lose their entire CV fleet.
3) Australia. Not worth much but with the Japanese not dumping their massed armies to remove India from the game will they hit here. If so will need to rethink their defenses and the Japanese ability to invade which to be honest, they could not.
4) China. Need to be sure that the Japanese can not just send every army here and wipe the Chinese out...should be a push but then a line should form. May have to lower some of the ports so that the Japanese can not supply many more units there, or up the Chinese a bit to be able to defend better.



FINAL LIST OF CHANGES


Japanese landing craft are received at a rate of 20 per turn until 3/29/42. This is due to the limit amphibious capacity that the IJN had.

US to Australia convoy route was moved due to it being to easy for the Japanese to intredict and sink mass amounts of merchants with their surface fleet. In turn the US MS starting capacity was reduced and they receive more in phases during 1942

UK to India convoy route was moved due to it being to easy for the Japanese to intredict and sink mass amounts of merchants with their surface fleet. In turn the UK MS starting capacity was reduced and they receive more in phases during 1942

CV stacking limit is set to 4. After the attack on Pearl Harbor the IJN rarely if at all operated all 6 CVs together. This will now allow there to be actual naval battles rather that complete Japanese domination until mid 43 which is more historical. But to reflect their earlier better training the Japanese CVs experience and air experience on them each increased by +5%.

New Zealand - The Japanese player may not draw supply to any port if the Allies control Rabaul, Lae, Port Moresby, New Caledonia, Sydney or Brisbane.

Port Moresby, New Caledonia and Fiji - Each has been made a supply source, given 50% defense bonus and 2 built in AA.

Dutch East Indies - The Japanese IJN stated that they can not provide adequate supply resources for the invasion of Sumatra and Java unless they had full control of Borneo and Singapore.
The Axis may not draw supply in any DEI port unless they control Singapore and all 4 ports in Borneo.
Additionally the Japanese must capture 3 locations for the DEI to surrender. Those locations are Batvia, Surabaya and Palembang.
Once the DEI has surrendered the Japanese must just hold Singapore and a single port on the island of Borneo to keep the DEI ports supplied.

India - The IJN understood that they did not have enough supply ships to support an invasion of India. Their supplies lines were stretched just reaching Rangoon and in Burma. With this the Axis may not draw any port supply from ports in India unless they have surrendered. Calcutta is the sole exception. IF the Japanese are able to capture Calcutta they will receive port supply there so long as they control Rangoon, Singapore and the Dutch East Indies has surrendered.

Chittagong - Burma supply lines were extremely difficult to maintain via land and the port of Chittagong was difficult for either side to access if they did not control both Calcutta and Rangoon. To this extent neither the Allies or the Axis can use Chittagong as a supply source unless they control both Rangoon and Calcutta.

US / Allies Island Hopping - Supplying invasions in the Pacific was difficult. Lines were extremely long and difficult to protect. The US opted a methond of island hopping to create supply depots in order to supply further and further from the US West Coast.
In order to maintain the supply lines the Allies would need to capture a port a specific distance from Hawaii and create a supply depot.
Then they would move close to the Japanese mainland and take another island and create a supply depot there. That way they could move supplies via shorter distances.
To accomplish this the Allies must do the following:

US Ring: So long as the Allies hold one port listed below they can supply islands /ports in the Distant Ring.
This includes the ports of Honalulu, Hilo and Lahaina.
Other ports in the ring that can be taken but do not provide supply moving forward Midway and Johnson Isle.
Distant Ring: So long as the Allies hold one port listed below they can supply islands /ports in the Outer Ring.
This includes the ports of Wotje, Kwajalein, Buan, Henderson Field, Ndeni and Espirito Santo.
Other ports in the ring that can be taken but do not provide supply moving forward Namuga, Munda, Nauru, Tarawa, Maloelap and Canton Isle.
Outer Ring: So long as the Allies hold one port listed below they can supply islands / ports in the Middle Ring.
This includes the ports of Truk, Manus, Jayapura, Lae, Kavieng, Rabual and Enewetok.
Other ports in the ring that can be taken but do not provide supply moving forward Wake, Ponape, Wekak, Manando and Makasser.
Middle Ring: So long as the Allies hold one port listed below they can supply islands / ports in the Inner Ring.
This includes the ports of Aparri, Lingayen, Manilla, Davao, Yap, Palau, Guam or Saipan.
Other ports in the ring that can be taken but do not provide supply moving forward Pagan, Baybay, Cebu and Legaspi.
Inner Ring: So long as the Allies hold one port listed below they can supply islands / ports in the Japanese home island and China.
This includes the ports of Taihoku, Okinawa, Iwo Jima, Chichi Jima and Tainan Formosa.
Other ports in the ring that can be taken but do not provide supply moving forward Naha.

Armored units in the game are divisions not corps since no armored corps existed in the Pacific Theater

Mech units have been removed from the game since they were not used in the Pacific Theater

Japan garrison reinforcements - Japan will get free small, 5 strength, island naval garrison units on the following size 1 port locations once they are Axis controlled and the hex is unoccupied: Dumai, Dili, Makassar, Manando, Wedo, Ambon, Sorong, Nauru, Milne Bay, Munda, and Namuga.

Japanese Island Garrison unit. The Mech unit was replaced by a 5 strength Island Garrison unit. It has a lower attack than the standard inf and a higher defense. Unit requires double landing craft if used in an amphibious invasion.


(in reply to stjeand)
Post #: 5
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