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Entente Declaring War on the Netherlands?

 
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Entente Declaring War on the Netherlands? - 7/14/2021 3:57:01 PM   
redrum68

 

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Interested in thoughts on whether it can be a good move to declare war on the Netherlands if the Entente is winning on Western Front to expand the front? This can be the case if the CPs decide to focus on Serbia and the Eastern Front.
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RE: Entente Declaring War on the Netherlands? - 7/14/2021 10:10:08 PM   
Bavre

 

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As someone who mostly goes Russia first, I would say no:

Diplo and NM fallout is massive, territory is very defensible vs attack from the west and the Dutch army is one of the strongest minor armies in the game. In later stages they show up with a cannon at German tech level.

On the plus side CP looses the food supplies and MPP income from the Netherland is quite meager. However some Diplo chits and a bit of patience should do the same.

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RE: Entente Declaring War on the Netherlands? - 7/15/2021 12:41:06 AM   
redrum68

 

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I guess that leads to the question then as what to do if you have lots of extra UK/French corps in France sitting at a stalemate with the Germans?

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RE: Entente Declaring War on the Netherlands? - 7/15/2021 1:40:03 AM   
ThisEndUp

 

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It heavily depends on how confident you are of taking out the dutch. They sit behind a major river, and there are quite a few corps available to them. If you succeed in forcing a surrender in 2-3 turns, it might be worth the NM hit to have a bridgehead across the Rhine and deny the Germans their food supplies. If you can't, then the benefits are only the MPP hit Germany takes: having to attack an entrenched unit across the Rhine is rather difficult and since the dutch can provide their own units to hold that section of the line, the extension of the front becomes quite pointless. Additionally, as Bavre mentioned, the decision might come back to bite you as they are a German minor with 1 artillery build limit. If you can't kill them quickly enough, I would not recommend attacking them.

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RE: Entente Declaring War on the Netherlands? - 7/15/2021 3:35:54 AM   
redrum68

 

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Makes sense. Is there anyway to know how many Dutch units spawn once you declare war on them? Hard to gauge if I can quickly blitz them and have them surrender in a few turns without knowing what I'm up against.

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RE: Entente Declaring War on the Netherlands? - 7/15/2021 5:26:49 AM   
ThisEndUp

 

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Here is the starting deployment. I do not think that it is randomised.

Tough nut to crack from the south, especially since major rivers give a +1 movement penalty and severe combat penalty as well. If you are already at the Rhine in Germany proper and have infantry weapons 1, it would be much easier. The crossing at Arnhem is your best bet if you have it; taking the empty hex just south of Deventer along with the town itself will allow you to cut them off from further reinforcement.

The prerequisites for a successful operation are too high in my opinion. By the time you have both of these things, the Dutch should already be leaning towards you, unless you went all in on Romania or something. Note that Denmark, Norway, and Sweden will all swing away from you if you go to war with the Dutch.




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RE: Entente Declaring War on the Netherlands? - 7/15/2021 1:32:59 PM   
Bavre

 

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Generaly if you want to strategize on potential invasions:

Hotseat vs yourself, declare war, switch sides and do a screenshot.

Note however, that some deployments can vary over time (as ThisEndUp already hinted). Later in the game the dutch do not just have a cannon slot, but already the upgraded cannon deployed! And I totally forgot about the dutch sub. It also shares the german tech and can therefore be a nice addition to their fleet.

About your situation at hand: I would suggest to do some air recon on the german side of the Rhine between Maastricht and Arnhem. You basically want to know whether there's a large enough gap between the northern end of the german line and the potential dutch main positions to exploit in a surprise push. If the Germans are already positioned in a similar way to ThisEndUps screenshot, I would say forget it. You may lengthen the front a bit, but if they stop you dead at the Rhine, I mean just look at the picture: your troops will be in a very bad position in that section of the front. Chances for a successful attack out of that awkward wedge across a major river are slim at best.

Better just send your surplus guys somewhere else (Italy, Balkans, near East ...). Cause enough trouble there and the Germans will have to reroute resources to help their little buddies.


Oh, and additionally:
Units from German minors are literally the best the CP gets! They are stat-wise identical to German troops, but have an extra perk: they can serve not only under their own Generals, but under Generals from every major of their side (Germans, Austrians, Turks).

< Message edited by Bavre -- 7/15/2021 1:48:25 PM >

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RE: Entente Declaring War on the Netherlands? - 7/15/2021 9:49:00 PM   
mdsmall

 

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Just to confirm what Bavre has said: if the Netherlands has fully mobilized for either side, there is a 25% chance per turn of the Dutch artillery unit spawning after June 1, 1915.

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RE: Entente Declaring War on the Netherlands? - 7/15/2021 11:55:50 PM   
redrum68

 

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Ok, I think I've been convinced not to invade the Netherlands. Thoughts on the best places to send extra units from the Western Front?

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RE: Entente Declaring War on the Netherlands? - 7/16/2021 9:49:48 PM   
Bavre

 

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Impossible to tell in general, I'm afraid. Depends too much on the overall situation. Is the other side showing weakness anywhere around the med? How are the Turks/Austrians holding up?

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RE: Entente Declaring War on the Netherlands? - 7/16/2021 10:57:47 PM   
redrum68

 

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Well its the game I'm posting an AAR for here: https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=5046374

But also just looking for in general where people tend to focus sending extra UK/French units.

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RE: Entente Declaring War on the Netherlands? - 7/17/2021 12:38:52 AM   
mdsmall

 

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Serbia is the obvious place, if you still have access to a port in Montenegro or Albania to land your British or French units. See Old Crow's strategy as Entente in the game we are playing on his You Tube Channel, Balthazor's Strategic Arcana.

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RE: Entente Declaring War on the Netherlands? - 7/17/2021 3:51:18 PM   
Bavre

 

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I agree. You have a very solid foothold on the balkans in this game and the Austrians are already under huge pressure. Gaza would be feasible too, but a push from Serbia into Austrias underbelly is imho the most efficient way here.

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RE: Entente Declaring War on the Netherlands? - 7/18/2021 3:07:11 PM   
redrum68

 

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Ok, Serbia is where I've started sending some like the ANZAC corps was just wondering if there are other areas that people often send units to. And yeah, I think AH collapsing is the easiest way to win the game as they are already below 30% NM.

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RE: Entente Declaring War on the Netherlands? - 7/19/2021 1:39:00 AM   
ZeppoSpecs

 

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Serbia is probably the best bet. If you keep Serbia alive until Greece joins the Entente, the Greeks can build one artillery at UK tech levels and you can blast your way to Vienna/Sofia/Constantinople.

Against the AI, I tend to ship extra Western Front Entente units to both Serbia and Egypt (French to Serbia and British to Egypt). You'll need 2 HQs in Egypt/Gaza to raise your supply level. A trick I picked up from someone on the forum is to ship the Belgian HQ to Egypt. You can't attach any British units to the Belgian HQ, but you can chain with the British HQ to get decent supply (as good as the Ottomans get, at any rate).

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