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Small scenario's - 7/12/2021 3:40:33 PM   
DDSCWarrior_slith

 

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Can we have some small scenario's ~ 5 turns... would be cool for a weekend gaming exchange. Allowing some focus on details etc... without the burden of 100's of units.


At the same time : there seems to be "NO" scenario's other then the official ones. Is this lack of interest of scenario designers, or is it so difficult to create one. E.g. TOAW has 100'rds of custom scenario's.
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RE: Small scenario's - 7/12/2021 8:44:43 PM   
potski

 

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Velikie Luki is already a small sized scenario (8 turns and only a limited OOB to handle) while Road to Minsk is only 2 turns (but a whole Army Group). So, yes, small sized scenarios are definitely possible.

The problem would be in designing something which is a challenge, ie. that there is an objective in terms of capturing VPs which is not immediately straight forward. Velikie Lukie is quite challenging for a beginner to defeat the AI in the time available. Minsk is not really challenging to defeat the AI, but is more about getting used to handling larger numbers of units before taking on the campaign.

The Road to Leningrad is more intermediate I think. It is a whole Army Group, but the smaller of the three and easier to handle. It is 16 turns and so I'd imagine most who hadn't done it before would certainly take several hours spread over a weekend? And find it a real challenge, in fact I am not sure it is possible to play as the Axis and capture Leningrad in 16 turns. And, if that is right (I am not an advanced user, didn't ever plan WITE, but some WITW and WIP:AE, so can't easily judge) then perhaps that is OK to prove that the campaign in real life really was doomed from the outset, and that following the same approach in the campaign in the game is not going to go well. I have been following Strategy Gaming Dojo's stream with alot of interest and noted that it took him well over 16 turns to capture the city, and he so over-extended in doing so that he was soon retreating to avoid a Stalingrad type encirclement.

As it happens I have just been playing with the scenario editor...

So I would definitely be interested in contributing to developing some alternative scenarios.

(in reply to DDSCWarrior_slith)
Post #: 2
RE: Small scenario's - 7/13/2021 10:25:45 PM   
IslandInland


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DDSCWarrior_slith

Can we have some small scenario's ~ 5 turns... would be cool for a weekend gaming exchange. Allowing some focus on details etc... without the burden of 100's of units.


At the same time : there seems to be "NO" scenario's other then the official ones. Is this lack of interest of scenario designers, or is it so difficult to create one. E.g. TOAW has 100'rds of custom scenario's.



I am waiting until a manual is released for the editor and stuff such as generic data is changeable within the editor. At the moment generic data and other things simply revert back to default when edited.



_____________________________

War In The East 2 Beta Tester and
War In The West Operation Torch Beta Tester
XXXCorps

(in reply to DDSCWarrior_slith)
Post #: 3
RE: Small scenario's - 7/13/2021 11:52:53 PM   
potski

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: IslandInland


I am waiting until a manual is released for the editor and stuff such as generic data is changeable within the editor. At the moment generic data and other things simply revert back to default when edited.




Can you explain what data reverts back to default? I have changed names of cities and the profiles assigned to them, plus the font type/size and whether bold, and that works OK. And I've tried both the mods that change the swamps and rivers. All are working as expected and even take effect on saved games without problems. Still testing the editor, so I want to avoid using it for things where there are known issues.

(in reply to IslandInland)
Post #: 4
RE: Small scenario's - 7/14/2021 10:28:54 PM   
IslandInland


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quote:

ORIGINAL: potski


quote:

ORIGINAL: IslandInland


I am waiting until a manual is released for the editor and stuff such as generic data is changeable within the editor. At the moment generic data and other things simply revert back to default when edited.




Can you explain what data reverts back to default? I have changed names of cities and the profiles assigned to them, plus the font type/size and whether bold, and that works OK. And I've tried both the mods that change the swamps and rivers. All are working as expected and even take effect on saved games without problems. Still testing the editor, so I want to avoid using it for things where there are known issues.


All generic data reverts to default as does Lead-Lease and factories.

Or at least the generic data I've edited has reverted back to default. The map might be OK and editable but I haven't tried to change the map in any way.





Attachment (1)

< Message edited by IslandInland -- 7/14/2021 10:32:52 PM >


_____________________________

War In The East 2 Beta Tester and
War In The West Operation Torch Beta Tester
XXXCorps

(in reply to potski)
Post #: 5
RE: Small scenario's - 7/15/2021 8:01:15 AM   
jlbhung

 

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I use the Editor to change and save generic data without problem. See the pic below showing the modified data sets.

However, you have to be careful when installing patches. If new patches change generic data, your modified data will be overwritten. I adopt one of the following approaches in response to data patches depending on the content of the changes and the workload -
(a) use the Editor to redo all changes of my mod to the changed generic data file after installing new patches;
(b) backup my mod file and replace the relevant generic data after installing new patches, then use the Editor to implement the official updates according to the patch changelog (this is easier in WitE1, where they provide detail changelog. I am a bit disappointed that in the several WitE2 patches so far, some of the changes in data are not detailed in the changelog. I asked once and someone suggested me to export the .csv files and use spreadsheet software to compare the changes in data myself. Unfortunately the spreadsheet software I bought several years ago does not support this feature.) ; and
(c) backup my mod file and simply replace the relevant generic data after installing new patches, ignoring the official updates to the data.







Attachment (1)

(in reply to IslandInland)
Post #: 6
RE: Small scenario's - 7/15/2021 5:00:50 PM   
IslandInland


Posts: 875
Joined: 12/8/2014
From: YORKSHIRE
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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlbhung

I use the Editor to change and save generic data without problem. See the pic below showing the modified data sets.

However, you have to be careful when installing patches. If new patches change generic data, your modified data will be overwritten. I adopt one of the following approaches in response to data patches depending on the content of the changes and the workload -
(a) use the Editor to redo all changes of my mod to the changed generic data file after installing new patches;
(b) backup my mod file and replace the relevant generic data after installing new patches, then use the Editor to implement the official updates according to the patch changelog (this is easier in WitE1, where they provide detail changelog. I am a bit disappointed that in the several WitE2 patches so far, some of the changes in data are not detailed in the changelog. I asked once and someone suggested me to export the .csv files and use spreadsheet software to compare the changes in data myself. Unfortunately the spreadsheet software I bought several years ago does not support this feature.) ; and
(c) backup my mod file and simply replace the relevant generic data after installing new patches, ignoring the official updates to the data.








Presumably then the modified data is present in your mod and does not revert to default?

I will have to try this. Thanks.


_____________________________

War In The East 2 Beta Tester and
War In The West Operation Torch Beta Tester
XXXCorps

(in reply to jlbhung)
Post #: 7
RE: Small scenario's - 7/16/2021 3:00:15 PM   
jlbhung

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: IslandInland

Presumably then the modified data is present in your mod and does not revert to default?



Yes. The modified data stay. While my mod does not involve factories, I tested it today and would like to affirm that modification to factories also stay, just that you have to tick both "Cities" and "Factories" generic data to save (see pic below, with a 100 Pe-2 airframe factory added to Leningrad as an example). Ticking only "Cities" will not work. My experience with ticking "Factories" only is that I cannot see the newly added factories on MAP in the Editor when re-loading generic data, but I can see the newly added factories using the Locations Tab of the Editor.

Lastly, mod to units have to save in specific scenarios, not generic data.




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by jlbhung -- 7/16/2021 3:04:08 PM >

(in reply to IslandInland)
Post #: 8
RE: Small scenario's - 7/17/2021 10:55:38 AM   
potski

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlbhung

I asked once and someone suggested me to export the .csv files and use spreadsheet software to compare the changes in data myself. Unfortunately the spreadsheet software I bought several years ago does not support this feature.) ; and



Spreadsheet software can be useful to view some of the files in columns, and filter them etc. There are plenty of good FREE spreadsheet apps, and you can find ones that are compatible with the latest versions of Excel and/or appear very much like Excel if you don't want the hassle of dealing with different files and learning features. However, I also recommend that you get Notepad++. This is a free text editor, but as the name suggests has much much better features than the Notepad that comes with Windows. It includes the ability to open multiple files in tabs, which alone is pretty good when you are working on several files side by side. And it allows you to compare two files that you have open and will highlight the differences between the files.

So export your modded data to CSV, which also acts as a backup. Change the name of the files, or move them to a backup folder. Then update the game and allow it to overwrite the DAT files. Now export the files to CSV. Open the official CSV and the modded CSV in Notepad++ and compare the two files. Now you can simply copy/paste the changes you made over the top of the official CSV before importing that back into the game.

(in reply to jlbhung)
Post #: 9
RE: Small scenario's - 7/18/2021 4:40:27 AM   
jlbhung

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: potski

... I also recommend that you get Notepad++...



Thank you for the suggestion. Have not thought of using Notepad++ before. Will try it when the next patch involving data amendments comes up.

(in reply to potski)
Post #: 10
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