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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/21/2021 11:47:35 AM   
stjeand


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I did not mean unbalanced persay...

From what I have seen is that the USSR needs the Allies to take the pressure off in 42 by invading somewhere. The US and UK have a LOT of troops at that time...more than they did historically and can do quite a bit more. i.e. invade Italy...in reality they could never have mounted such and invasion.

What I meant was...

If Russia was a little more powerful...and the other Allies a little less...I wonder if that would push things more towards they way history played out?

You appear to be doing fine in Russia...but the Germans have a LOT of troops now busy in Italy.
Add to that you are a better player and did appear to have so really good luck. (My luck is mostly bad...especially weather wise)

I think Germany needs Italy to last into mid to late 43...or else the end has come early.


But the new shatter rule is going to change quite a bit...more for the Germans initially...as I don't think it will help the Russians so much with their "weaker" troops as they are normally overwhelmed.
I hope that the units are out of play for at least 2 months...don't want the French returning...

(in reply to ncc1701e)
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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/21/2021 3:16:16 PM   
Harrybanana

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: stjeand

I did not mean unbalanced persay...

From what I have seen is that the USSR needs the Allies to take the pressure off in 42 by invading somewhere. The US and UK have a LOT of troops at that time...more than they did historically and can do quite a bit more. i.e. invade Italy...in reality they could never have mounted such and invasion.

What I meant was...

If Russia was a little more powerful...and the other Allies a little less...I wonder if that would push things more towards they way history played out?

You appear to be doing fine in Russia...but the Germans have a LOT of troops now busy in Italy.
Add to that you are a better player and did appear to have so really good luck. (My luck is mostly bad...especially weather wise)

I think Germany needs Italy to last into mid to late 43...or else the end has come early.


But the new shatter rule is going to change quite a bit...more for the Germans initially...as I don't think it will help the Russians so much with their "weaker" troops as they are normally overwhelmed.
I hope that the units are out of play for at least 2 months...don't want the French returning...



The reason that the UK and the US generally have more troops in 42 than historical is because in most games I have seen:

1. The Axis do not put as much force strength in Africa as historical. Instead most players prefer to Go All-In on Russia. Indeed in both this game and our mirror game all of Italy's mobile units were in Russia, not Africa.

2. The Allies build far fewer air units than historical and instead uses all of this saved production on building larger armies. For example, I have only played one game where the Allies built significant numbers of strategic bombers. In this game I have not built any. I did build a maritime patrol bomber and that was a mistake. Had I not done so i would have an additional Us Armour.

3. I believe that in most games the Allies send less Lend-Lease to Russia than historical. In this game I have not sent any UK Lend lease to Russia at all. I have sent quite a bit of US Lend Lease, but I think most players don't. I say this because the US needs 30 MS for its own resources and can send about 90 Lend lease to Russia. So it needs a total of 120 MS, but in many games the US doesn't build this many.

1 above also explains why the Russians need that Allied pressure in 42.

So I don't think it is a case of the Allies needing to be less powerful and Russia more powerful. I think their respective productions are about right. But as I keep harping on, I think airpower needs to be more effective. As is the Allies don't need massive air superiority to invade as they did historically, air parity is enough. And they don't need strategic bombers at all as they get more bang for their buck with armour.

You are correct that the new Shatter Rule may be a game changer. We will have to wait to see.


< Message edited by Harrybanana -- 5/21/2021 3:17:07 PM >

(in reply to stjeand)
Post #: 272
RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/21/2021 6:54:06 PM   
stjeand


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Well for Africa I normally have at least a Italian Mech and armor as well as a German Mech...and most of the time a German armor. That is pretty much it...
Maybe an infantry...Best to replace the Italian port garrisons with German divisions just to save supplies...

The Brits can have 10 to 20 corps by 41 and just walk over that once the US arrives even before. The Axis have no way to supply much more than that.


But you are correct. The Allies rarely bother with a lot of air.
I do really like strat bombers though. Once they get going they are pretty crippling...especially early AND if they can hit Polesti...that will end the Axis fast.
My oil always bottoms around October.

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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/22/2021 10:13:57 PM   
Harrybanana

 

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DECEMBER 18, 1942

4 MS sunk and 2 U-Boat hits.

On the Axis turn they counterattacked in Italy, but did not advance into the vacant hex.




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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/22/2021 10:15:33 PM   
Harrybanana

 

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I push back the weakened German units with the help of the RN and isolate Taranto.

Although the combat odds for the final attack read 3-1 I don't believe it. If I destroyed 21 strength ponits the odds would have been far better that 3-1.




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< Message edited by Harrybanana -- 5/22/2021 10:18:10 PM >

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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/22/2021 10:19:38 PM   
Harrybanana

 

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In Russia my very limited offensive continues.




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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/22/2021 10:20:03 PM   
Harrybanana

 

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North




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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/22/2021 10:20:33 PM   
Harrybanana

 

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South




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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/22/2021 10:24:09 PM   
Harrybanana

 

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JANUARY 1, 1943

The Allies ring in the New Year by capturing Taranto in a bloody battle that requires 5 attacks. Again the role played by the navies was critical.

Unless the Axis can recapture something on their next turn Italy will surrender.




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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/22/2021 10:25:42 PM   
Harrybanana

 

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Italy after all my moves




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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/22/2021 10:26:44 PM   
Harrybanana

 

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The limited offensive in Russia continues.




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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/23/2021 8:20:17 PM   
stjeand


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Well the shatter was due to a retreat that could not happen...I have seen a 1/1 shatter before not being able to retreat, though only once.
Mostly 3 or 4 to 1 odds get shatters.

That would definitely be a unit going back into the deployment queue.

1/1 odds and killed 10 on a Pz...that was a good roll, twice...then the 2/1 was a good roll.
Luck is definitely with you at the moment.

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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/23/2021 11:57:48 PM   
Harrybanana

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: stjeand

Well the shatter was due to a retreat that could not happen...I have seen a 1/1 shatter before not being able to retreat, though only once.
Mostly 3 or 4 to 1 odds get shatters.

That would definitely be a unit going back into the deployment queue.

1/1 odds and killed 10 on a Pz...that was a good roll, twice...then the 2/1 was a good roll.
Luck is definitely with you at the moment.


Are you talking about my December 18 attacks or my January 1 attacks? Either way I didn't have any 1:1 Attacks causing a unit to shatter because it couldn't retreat. The Attack on December 18 that caused the unit to shatter says it was stated to be at 3:1. But I think that was misreported. I am unsure when it gives the odds if that is before casualties have been taken or after.

As for my January 1 attacks, actually I don't think I was that lucky this time. My understanding (which could be wrong but I don't think so) is that the combat odds have very little to do with the casualties inflicted. Rather casualties are inflicted by the intrinsic elements of each unit (artillery guns, tanks, etc). So if two 20 strength units attack a 20 strength defender they will inflict more casualties with their 40 strength 2:1 attack than two 5 strength units will inflict on a 2 strength defender with their 10 strength 5:1 attack. Of course the 20 strength defender will also inflict more casualties on them than the 2 strength defender will on its attackers.

This is why if you look at my January 1 attacks I inflicted far more casualties with my first two 1:1 odds attacks (10 and 8) than I did with my 11:1 last attack (only 1). But I believe what really caused most of those casualties with the first three attacks was the shore bombardment. IMHO naval bombardment is too powerful. Not sure how that is working out in WP Pacific. But it tends to make up for Allied air units being under powered.

< Message edited by Harrybanana -- 5/24/2021 12:03:34 AM >

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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/24/2021 4:03:30 AM   
Harrybanana

 

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JANUARY 15, 1943

The BOA continues to rage. 12 MS and 2 escorts are sunk by 8 U-Boats; but I do score 9 U-Boat hits including sinking 1. The Brits are once again down to about 100 MS.

Blizzard in Russia so no attacks there.

The Italians surrender. No attacks in the rain but I do move into the hexes vacated by the Italians.




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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/24/2021 12:11:34 PM   
stjeand


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Harrybanana

Are you talking about my December 18 attacks or my January 1 attacks? Either way I didn't have any 1:1 Attacks causing a unit to shatter because it couldn't retreat. The Attack on December 18 that caused the unit to shatter says it was stated to be at 3:1. But I think that was misreported. I am unsure when it gives the odds if that is before casualties have been taken or after.

As for my January 1 attacks, actually I don't think I was that lucky this time. My understanding (which could be wrong but I don't think so) is that the combat odds have very little to do with the casualties inflicted. Rather casualties are inflicted by the intrinsic elements of each unit (artillery guns, tanks, etc). So if two 20 strength units attack a 20 strength defender they will inflict more casualties with their 40 strength 2:1 attack than two 5 strength units will inflict on a 2 strength defender with their 10 strength 5:1 attack. Of course the 20 strength defender will also inflict more casualties on them than the 2 strength defender will on its attackers.

This is why if you look at my January 1 attacks I inflicted far more casualties with my first two 1:1 odds attacks (10 and 8) than I did with my 11:1 last attack (only 1). But I believe what really caused most of those casualties with the first three attacks was the shore bombardment. IMHO naval bombardment is too powerful. Not sure how that is working out in WP Pacific. But it tends to make up for Allied air units being under powered.



Well I wish what you said was true always...I just recently attacked units with 1/1 4 corps vs 1 a lost a lot more than killed...4 to 5 times...and many times killed 0 and took looses...so there has to be good amount of luck somewhere.

But...yes the naval bombardment seems a bit off. You can perform unlimited numbers of them...if you were able to attack next to them unlimited times.

< Message edited by stjeand -- 5/24/2021 12:14:20 PM >

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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/24/2021 4:29:57 PM   
ncc1701e


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quote:

ORIGINAL: stjeand

But...yes the naval bombardment seems a bit off. You can perform unlimited numbers of them...if you were able to attack next to them unlimited times.


Already tracked here:
https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4991825


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(in reply to stjeand)
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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/24/2021 7:25:48 PM   
Harrybanana

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: stjeand

quote:

ORIGINAL: Harrybanana

Are you talking about my December 18 attacks or my January 1 attacks? Either way I didn't have any 1:1 Attacks causing a unit to shatter because it couldn't retreat. The Attack on December 18 that caused the unit to shatter says it was stated to be at 3:1. But I think that was misreported. I am unsure when it gives the odds if that is before casualties have been taken or after.

As for my January 1 attacks, actually I don't think I was that lucky this time. My understanding (which could be wrong but I don't think so) is that the combat odds have very little to do with the casualties inflicted. Rather casualties are inflicted by the intrinsic elements of each unit (artillery guns, tanks, etc). So if two 20 strength units attack a 20 strength defender they will inflict more casualties with their 40 strength 2:1 attack than two 5 strength units will inflict on a 2 strength defender with their 10 strength 5:1 attack. Of course the 20 strength defender will also inflict more casualties on them than the 2 strength defender will on its attackers.

This is why if you look at my January 1 attacks I inflicted far more casualties with my first two 1:1 odds attacks (10 and 8) than I did with my 11:1 last attack (only 1). But I believe what really caused most of those casualties with the first three attacks was the shore bombardment. IMHO naval bombardment is too powerful. Not sure how that is working out in WP Pacific. But it tends to make up for Allied air units being under powered.



Well I wish what you said was true always...I just recently attacked units with 1/1 4 corps vs 1 a lost a lot more than killed...4 to 5 times...and many times killed 0 and took looses...so there has to be good amount of luck somewhere.

But...yes the naval bombardment seems a bit off. You can perform unlimited numbers of them...if you were able to attack next to them unlimited times.


Well there are exceptions. Obviously the defense multiplier and entrenchment level of the defender count for something. A unit in Stalingrad attacked at 1:1 will probably inflict more casualties than it takes. And I probably would have taken about double the number of casualties as I inflicted in the above battles if not for the Shore bombardment.

Shore bombardment is effective. But it is also limited by the fact that the bombarding naval units lose effectiveness very quickly. So they are only good for 3 or 4 attacks and then you have to send them back to port to rest for several turns.

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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/24/2021 7:28:45 PM   
Harrybanana

 

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JANUARY 29, 1943

5 MS sunk and 8 U-Boat hits.

Blizzard in Russia means no attacks.

In Italy the Germans look weak on the Adriatic coast.




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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/24/2021 7:29:44 PM   
Harrybanana

 

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So the Americans, with British help, punch through.




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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/24/2021 7:32:23 PM   
Harrybanana

 

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FEBRUARY 12, 1943

Proving they can still pack a punch, the U-Boats sink 4 MS and 3 escorts, but take 7 hits.

Rain in Italy, so the Allies just advance up to the Germans new lines.




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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/24/2021 7:34:02 PM   
Harrybanana

 

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Snow in Russia, so Russian offensive between Kursk and Kharkov continues.

North after moves




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< Message edited by Harrybanana -- 5/24/2021 7:35:20 PM >

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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/24/2021 7:34:41 PM   
Harrybanana

 

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South after moves.




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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/26/2021 5:24:28 AM   
Harrybanana

 

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FEBRUARY 26, 1943

4 MS sunk and 2 U-Boat hits during the convoy phase. But on my turn my Maritime Bomber finally locates and sinks it first U-Boat. Hurrah!




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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/26/2021 5:25:41 AM   
Harrybanana

 

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Rain in Italy allows the Germans to firm up their lines somewhat.




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< Message edited by Harrybanana -- 5/26/2021 5:26:07 AM >

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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/26/2021 5:27:28 AM   
Harrybanana

 

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In Russia, the offensive near Kharkov continues to gain momentum.




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< Message edited by Harrybanana -- 5/26/2021 5:28:01 AM >

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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/26/2021 5:28:55 AM   
Harrybanana

 

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Tula is captured.




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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/26/2021 5:29:52 AM   
Harrybanana

 

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A new offensive begins near Leningrad.




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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/27/2021 4:51:38 AM   
Harrybanana

 

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MARCH 12, 1943

2 MS sunk and 2 U-Boat hits.

Rain everywhere so no attacks anywhere.

Forces and Casualties.




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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/27/2021 4:52:28 AM   
Harrybanana

 

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Technology





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RE: Hadros (Axis) vs HB (Allies) Hadros Ok tp read firs... - 5/27/2021 4:53:58 AM   
Harrybanana

 

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Deployment Queues




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