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Theatre box issues - 4/2/2021 9:27:52 AM   
Nix77

 

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Joined: 10/2/2016
From: Finland
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Transferring transport aircraft doesn't seem to change the theatre strengths at all. This shouldn't be the case, transports should give at least air/ground strength. Haven't checked all the units but I hope there are no other such cases. It would be realistic to have a minimum of certain unit type per theater box, so you couldn't inflate your air strength completely with only flak units etc.

It would be useful to list air units "strength" in similar way that flak values and ground CV are represented in theatre boxes, to give the player a hint how many units are needed if you're missing 3 points of AIR DAY strength for example.

What actually do these percentages and numbers in parenthesis mean in the TB status screen:

GROUND : 90 (100) : 90%
Ground(base) : 70
Artillery(10%) : 4.40 (6.16)

"GROUND" part is clear to me. "Ground(base)" this is ground CU strength, is it directly CV-related? The following "Artillery(10%) : 4.40 (6.16)" is a bit unclear, what does the percentage mean? What is the number in parenthesis?

EDIT: got that last part, I've missed Chapter 36 completely! 36.12.1 explains this, but still there's no "Air Transport" target&minimum, I think it should be there.

< Message edited by Nix77 -- 4/2/2021 12:25:56 PM >
Post #: 1
RE: Theatre box issues - 4/2/2021 7:12:47 PM   
Joel Billings


Posts: 30279
Joined: 9/20/2000
From: Santa Rosa, CA
Status: online
Agreed, we seem to have missed giving transports any value in generating TB values. If we confirm that, it's something we will look at to adjust in the future. Players could consider a house rule that transports should not be transferred manually even when the enhanced TB control option is on. Thanks for the report.

_____________________________

All understanding comes after the fact.
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(in reply to Nix77)
Post #: 2
RE: Theatre box issues - 4/8/2021 5:46:46 AM   
Nix77

 

Posts: 432
Joined: 10/2/2016
From: Finland
Status: offline
I think I got the numbers wrong first time.

Ground(base) : 70
Artillery(10%) : 7.00 (8.00)

Here the "7.00" means that's the required artillery level, in this case 10% of ground base. "8.00" is your current artillery level, so everything is ok.

Problem is the game doesnt enforce these levels at all, which I think it should, even with TB control on. If I reduce my artillery commitment below 7.00, both numbers start dropping. I think after I have dropped below the 10% threshold, I shouldn't be able to remove artillery from that theatre, unless I lower my ground base to allow that.

The display is really confusing, since there are values like 0.2(0.2), that don't match the percentage requirement at all since the requirement level just starts following the actual level after you get below the percentage requirement. It's extremely difficult to understand what's going on with the numbers at first.

There should also probably be own levels for armor/mech, cavalry and mountain infantry at least, so the player can't just cherry pick the best units from theatres they were actually needed in.

Different theatres should then have different percentage requirements: higher mountain for Transcaucasus, 0% mountain and cavalry for NF, some cavalry for Far East.


< Message edited by Nix77 -- 4/8/2021 6:07:34 AM >

(in reply to Joel Billings)
Post #: 3
RE: Theatre box issues - 4/8/2021 10:47:17 AM   
MechFO

 

Posts: 526
Joined: 6/1/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Nix77

I think I got the numbers wrong first time.

Ground(base) : 70
Artillery(10%) : 7.00 (8.00)

Here the "7.00" means that's the required artillery level, in this case 10% of ground base. "8.00" is your current artillery level, so everything is ok.


The 10% is not the required value but the max bonus value you can have from that category.

You can stuff all your artillery in there but once you reach the 10% of base value it will stop contributing towards you covering the required ground value.

I agree that motorized and infantry shouldn't count the same. WITW I think got it right by doubling motorized units CV contribution. Do that and recalibrate the needed values accordingly.

Transports is the only item I can find that's not being counted.

< Message edited by MechFO -- 4/8/2021 10:50:19 AM >

(in reply to Nix77)
Post #: 4
RE: Theatre box issues - 4/8/2021 11:02:45 AM   
Nix77

 

Posts: 432
Joined: 10/2/2016
From: Finland
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MechFO

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nix77

I think I got the numbers wrong first time.

Ground(base) : 70
Artillery(10%) : 7.00 (8.00)

Here the "7.00" means that's the required artillery level, in this case 10% of ground base. "8.00" is your current artillery level, so everything is ok.


The 10% is not the required value but the max bonus value you can have from that category.

You can stuff all your artillery in there but once you reach the 10% of base value it will stop contributing towards you covering the required ground value.

I agree that motorized and infantry shouldn't count the same. WITW I think got it right by doubling motorized units CV contribution. Do that and recalibrate the needed values accordingly.

Transports is the only item I can find that's not being counted.



Ahh ok, that explains it :)

I think there still should be a minimum value for at least some of the unit types, so you just couldn't empty a theatre of certain type of units that were actually used and needed there.

(in reply to MechFO)
Post #: 5
RE: Theatre box issues - 4/8/2021 11:19:05 AM   
MechFO

 

Posts: 526
Joined: 6/1/2007
Status: offline
I think the incentive is already there, those bonuses add up to being important and the only items I stripmine are independant Artillery and Pioneers, which by their nature are rare in the TB's anyway.

The only shortcoming I really see is that Motorized is valued the same as non-motorized, when they are not. This provides too much incentive to strip out the mobile units.

(in reply to Nix77)
Post #: 6
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