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Artillery Strikes - 2/4/2021 9:08:10 AM   
rob89

 

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Are artillery strikes from heavy arty on-map units possible?
For ex., the 17-cm-sKan18, with a 30km firing range, could strike second lines, HQs etc. ...

If not, why?

And, in any case, how does the counter-battery fire work?

thanks in advance

best regards

< Message edited by rob89 -- 2/4/2021 9:10:17 AM >
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RE: Artillery Strikes - 2/4/2021 9:33:01 PM   
Jim D Burns


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From: Salida, CA.
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quote:

If not, why?


Spotters.

WWII artillery was not a capable weapon without highly trained spotters observing and adjusting rounds onto target. Lobbing dozens of shells 30km into the enemy rear would achieve absolutely nothing even if you knew the exact building you wanted to hit. You had to have someone with eyes on target who could adjust fire for you else you would simply be wasting ammo.

Now spotter planes could and did adjust fire, but it was rarely reliable since a single enemy fighter could sweep the air clean in a matter of minutes of any slow spotter planes. Late war spotter planes were more common for the allies use, and you could make a case for longer ranged fire then, but you'd need total air superiority before I'd say long range bombardments would be a reliable tool in your warchest. And of course AA was always a threat to low and slow spotter planes so it was never a sure thing you could reliably adjust a fire mission for long.

Jim

(in reply to rob89)
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RE: Artillery Strikes - 2/4/2021 9:53:44 PM   
GloriousRuse

 

Posts: 780
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Generally speaking, no.

1. The hex scale is 10 miles per, and by and large the heaviest guns were not pushed right up to the front. If you assume that a) your guns are a bit back, maybe 1/3 of their range, b) the enemy two hexes deep isn’t standing immediately on the hex border, then even the longest range artillery for WW2 will struggle to achieve anything meaningful, even with spotting assistance.

2. The combat engine is mostly concerned with dedicated assaults and defenses ranging from a few regiments to multi-corps operations, the actions of a battalion fire mission really aren’t the concern for the scale. The steady state shelling is mostly accounted for by increased attrition for units in contact, which is assumed to cover patrolling, small unit actions, your daily dose of shells, etc. - this isn’t small, as the “background hum” consumes tens of thousands of men every week.

3. Specific artillery units can attack from two hexes back in support of a fight - imagine pushing the guns up safely in your rear area for dedicated fire plans.

4. Counter battery is not, to the best of my knowledge, modeled beyond artillery shooting at artillery. Given there are at times 10M+ men fighting, the model is more concerned with “did the right number of guns die for an action” than it is with “make sure we account for acoustic ranging when that 122mm fires and a 105mm fires”

(in reply to Jim D Burns)
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RE: Artillery Strikes - 2/4/2021 10:08:45 PM   
fighterf4u

 

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Joined: 1/26/2021
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One thing that really irked me when playing as the Soviets in WITE 1 is the sheer number of useless units you had to deal with: the engineer brigades, artillery brigades, and anti-tank brigades.

These units are far to weak to attack anything on their own, and it's pain coordinating them with the corps level units given the 3 unit per hex limit.

In WITE2, these brigade level units can just be attached to the corps right?

(in reply to GloriousRuse)
Post #: 4
RE: Artillery Strikes - 2/4/2021 10:13:22 PM   
loki100


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Joined: 10/20/2012
From: Utlima Thule
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quote:

ORIGINAL: fighterf4u

One thing that really irked me when playing as the Soviets in WITE 1 is the sheer number of useless units you had to deal with: the engineer brigades, artillery brigades, and anti-tank brigades.

These units are far to weak to attack anything on their own, and it's pain coordinating them with the corps level units given the 3 unit per hex limit.

In WITE2, these brigade level units can just be attached to the corps right?


mix, the AT brigades can be on map, attached to combat units or to a HQ. The artillery brigades are just big Support Units so off map in a HQ.

The AT brigades on map are (I think) pretty useless) but attached &/or concentrated in a HQ can be a brutal shock to the Axis. They also disband in early 42 (can't recall exactly when)

Most engineering assets are totally off map in all circumstances

_____________________________


(in reply to fighterf4u)
Post #: 5
RE: Artillery Strikes - 2/4/2021 10:15:29 PM   
GloriousRuse

 

Posts: 780
Joined: 10/26/2013
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Brigade level units for the Soviets are almost always either “Multi-Role” - you can use them on map as an independent maneuver unit or attach them directly to HQs and larger formations - or as pure Support Units that can ONLY be used as attachments to formations or higher HQs.

(in reply to fighterf4u)
Post #: 6
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