Matrix Games Forums

Forums  Register  Login  Photo Gallery  Member List  Search  Calendars  FAQ 

My Profile  Inbox  Address Book  My Subscription  My Forums  Log Out

Any tips on starting new colonies?

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Shadow Empire >> Any tips on starting new colonies? Page: [1]
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 2:40:14 AM   
yutowap33

 

Posts: 70
Joined: 11/1/2017
Status: offline
Any tips on starting new colonies?
Post #: 1
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 5:46:35 AM   
Arralen


Posts: 808
Joined: 5/21/2000
Status: offline
Assets beyond 6 hexes add administrative strain.

(in reply to yutowap33)
Post #: 2
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 6:29:13 AM   
Mina

 

Posts: 44
Joined: 1/16/2021
Status: offline
- Start by building a railhead and Truck station on the tile you want to put your new city at. They're 1 turn to build and essential, because getting materials and food to your new city's incredibly important.
- Try to have cards like Zoo/Commercial Project available before starting a new zone. You're going to need to have your worker morale at 50 or better in order to get **** built in a reasonable timeframe, if worker morale is bad then you'll struggle to convert pop into workers, so you won't have enough people to build your QoL ****, so morale won't start improving, and repeat ad nauseum.
- Investor Backing is also good to play on new cities because it provides a random but static amount of money. Private investment scales depending on existing population
- If you've got any Autonomous Cloning Facility cards then use them on your new zones. 1000 pop a turn is most beneficial for tiny settlements.
- If at all possible, place your new cities in places with nearby free folk settlements that you can rope into their zone borders.
- Otherwise consider recruiting some colonists from one of your bigger cities with population to spare (Via zone orders). You'll need logistic points to send them but it can be a big boost when you'd otherwise have to rely on natural migration.

In general, newly created zones are a lot slower than just conquering an existing one from a minor. If you've got a bigass swath of empty field or forest then you don't need to place a new zone, it's when you come across a cluster of ruins or a few mineable resources that are well outside of the 6 tile no admin strain radius of your existing city that you wanna put one down.

(in reply to Arralen)
Post #: 3
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 7:27:30 AM   
Maerchen

 

Posts: 337
Joined: 6/16/2020
From: Germany
Status: offline
As a side note, the quick zone tab on the left can only fit 26 zones. My 38 zone empire is quite difficult to manage. I went full commerce, got the stacking production bonuses. 4.5k IP per turn from light industries and service tax is a nice thing to have...



_____________________________

The logistics hell this game is IS the fun part! - Maerchen, 2020

The good thing is, we have all the information in the reports. The bad thing is, we have all the information. Maerchen, 2020

Came for SE. Will stay for SE.

(in reply to Mina)
Post #: 4
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 9:40:46 AM   
zgrssd

 

Posts: 3024
Joined: 6/9/2020
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: yutowap33

Any tips on starting new colonies?

Generally it is better to keep your population concentrated in one city, idealy the Capitol/SHQ position. Higher Tier assets are more upkeep efficient, so that makes bigger cities more interesting.

Assets more then 6 hexes from "their" city, cause administrative strain. Adminsitrative Strain over 10% can cause production reduction. Usually you pick new cities to aleviate that problem.

Terrain is important. While hard terrain makes the city a lot easier defendable by Infantry, it also increases the cost for road and rail access dramatically. The best terrain is ruins, as it offers all the defense for no relevant cost increase.

(in reply to yutowap33)
Post #: 5
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 11:12:39 AM   
Mina

 

Posts: 44
Joined: 1/16/2021
Status: offline
Oh yeah I forgot to mention, because higher tier buildings offer both more production AND more cost-effective production, you're best off concentrating everything in a single large city where your SHQ is placed, other zones are for resource extraction mainly. Size III gives you a large enough population base to run a bunch of resource extraction, as well as your private economy stuff like farms/qol/etc.

There might be a point where a single megacity and its SHQ might not have enough logistical points to manage the entire zone's pull/push requirements, in which case you'd need to figure out a location for a new megacity and its assorted industries, along with a new SHQ. I haven't encountered it yet personally

(in reply to zgrssd)
Post #: 6
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 11:15:57 AM   
BlueTemplar


Posts: 887
Joined: 4/29/2010
Status: offline
- You *might* (or might not) actually want to make new cities without even hitting 10% admin strain with your old ones if you're interested in having more city-only assets (but higher levels of the city-only assets you already have are generally a better idea). But of course your regime needs to have enough unemployed population/colonists, otherwise you'll have to shut down public or private assets or live with the inefficiency.
- Have a good governor ready for the turn after you create the city.
- Start with your Zone unincorporated for higher population happiness growth, and so that its initially zero civilization score doesn't impact yours. This will also give more resources for the private sector to build up.
- Increase worker pay 1 millicredit at a time until it hits 70+ happiness and rising : you won't have many workers to start with anyway, and their salaries will help the private sector. Lower it 1 millicredit at a time when it hits 80+.
- Add some direct investment of your own too, as this increases population happiness. You might be later able to convert population happiness (easier to achieve) into worker happiness (harder to achieve) via a faction "worker privileges" card.

(in reply to Mina)
Post #: 7
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 12:20:49 PM   
Uemon

 

Posts: 110
Joined: 12/11/2020
Status: offline
Get colonists, build QOL buildings, play QOL cards, send more colonists. Early on, only do this if there are big deposits that are farther than 6 hexes away from your city. Mina and zgrssd made all the important points.

Overall the power of cities lies in city hex only buildings that you can unlock with economic council, which allow you to produce resources inside your cities (and thus not rely on external metal/rares/food etc). With every level efficiency of those buildings increases, so essentially you can run an empire from a level V city (200.000 pop). The problem with small cities is that they will grow very slowly and you can only build low level buildings, which give very few resources. So unless you dump a lot of colonists (which still have to come from somewhere) try not to overdo it because it will take a while before those new cities become really economically relevant (on their own, access to resources still counts obviously).

(in reply to BlueTemplar)
Post #: 8
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 12:23:47 PM   
KarisFraMauro

 

Posts: 113
Joined: 12/2/2020
Status: offline
Speaking of city improvement cards, what governs the militia headquarters one? I've never even seen it before my current game, and it doesn't look like it's connected with any particular profile. Maybe I missed it though.

(in reply to Uemon)
Post #: 9
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 12:28:19 PM   
Uemon

 

Posts: 110
Joined: 12/11/2020
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: KarisFraMauro

Speaking of city improvement cards, what governs the militia headquarters one? I've never even seen it before my current game, and it doesn't look like it's connected with any particular profile. Maybe I missed it though.


I am 90% sure it is connected with profile, i believe its fist related card?

(in reply to KarisFraMauro)
Post #: 10
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 1:43:30 PM   
Maerchen

 

Posts: 337
Joined: 6/16/2020
From: Germany
Status: offline
It is an autocracy card. I am wrong, it is fist.

< Message edited by Maerchen -- 2/4/2021 4:25:58 PM >


_____________________________

The logistics hell this game is IS the fun part! - Maerchen, 2020

The good thing is, we have all the information in the reports. The bad thing is, we have all the information. Maerchen, 2020

Came for SE. Will stay for SE.

(in reply to Uemon)
Post #: 11
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 1:45:36 PM   
BlueTemplar


Posts: 887
Joined: 4/29/2010
Status: offline
Oh, also, you probably want to Allow Emergency Food, wouldn't want your newly arrived population to starve !

Whether it arrived via migration or via colonists - I guess that in some situation you might want to dump colonists on it as population rather than workers if you have enough workers but still need more populace to upgrade the city ASAP?

(in reply to Maerchen)
Post #: 12
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 2:24:39 PM   
KarisFraMauro

 

Posts: 113
Joined: 12/2/2020
Status: offline
Digging a little deeper you are indeed correct, it's volunteerism at fist 40. But it isn't listed in the profile as far as I can see, you have to look in the encyclopedia.

(in reply to Uemon)
Post #: 13
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 3:29:49 PM   
Clux


Posts: 383
Joined: 9/16/2018
From: Mexico
Status: offline
Make sure that the new city its on a strategic position, it must be nearby of resources, a good defensive position (due terrain) or in the worst case, make sure that it will be useful to keep expanding towards the wilderness-non aligned to conquer other regimes (kinda like an Outpost)

_____________________________

Amateurs talk about strategy. Professionals talk about logistics!

(in reply to KarisFraMauro)
Post #: 14
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 3:54:09 PM   
zgrssd

 

Posts: 3024
Joined: 6/9/2020
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: KarisFraMauro

Digging a little deeper you are indeed correct, it's volunteerism at fist 40. But it isn't listed in the profile as far as I can see, you have to look in the encyclopedia.

Stratagems given to you by happy factions based on the current Profile do not appear in the Profile page. It has been reported as a bug a few times now, I think.

(in reply to KarisFraMauro)
Post #: 15
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 3:56:55 PM   
KarisFraMauro

 

Posts: 113
Joined: 12/2/2020
Status: offline
Huh. I thought maybe it might be a bug, either that or something related to the version played.

(in reply to zgrssd)
Post #: 16
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 5:15:03 PM   
yutowap33

 

Posts: 70
Joined: 11/1/2017
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mina

- Start by building a railhead and Truck station on the tile you want to put your new city at. They're 1 turn to build and essential, because getting materials and food to your new city's incredibly important.
- Try to have cards like Zoo/Commercial Project available before starting a new zone. You're going to need to have your worker morale at 50 or better in order to get **** built in a reasonable timeframe, if worker morale is bad then you'll struggle to convert pop into workers, so you won't have enough people to build your QoL ****, so morale won't start improving, and repeat ad nauseum.
- Investor Backing is also good to play on new cities because it provides a random but static amount of money. Private investment scales depending on existing population


That pretty much what I did. I used 10k colonist, only went for Rail station and no Truck station (hopping that civil authority will take care of the latter in this remote community), and used my spare zone cards to boost the colonies (I built 2 to see how they compare).

I am little confused about private investment expansion, is there some build order and timer between constructions? because both colonies started by building a farming community, and now despite having pile of cash in private funds has no next project



(in reply to Mina)
Post #: 17
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 5:28:01 PM   
newageofpower


Posts: 261
Joined: 12/3/2020
Status: offline
They need enough unemployed civilians (population, not workers) as future employees to keep building stuff.

(in reply to yutowap33)
Post #: 18
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 5:40:17 PM   
yutowap33

 

Posts: 70
Joined: 11/1/2017
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BlueTemplar
Oh, also, you probably want to Allow Emergency Food, wouldn't want your newly arrived population to starve !


When it's a good idea not to allow emergency food? I was scared by it once, since then I always do, not sure what the disadvantages are.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BlueTemplar
- Start with your Zone unincorporated for higher population happiness growth, and so that its initially zero civilization score doesn't impact yours. This will also give more resources for the private sector to build up.
- Increase worker pay 1 millicredit at a time until it hits 70+ happiness and rising : you won't have many workers to start with anyway, and their salaries will help the private sector. Lower it 1 millicredit at a time when it hits 80+.


I definitely missed that.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Uemon

Overall the power of cities lies in city hex only buildings that you can unlock with economic council, which allow you to produce resources inside your cities (and thus not rely on external metal/rares/food etc).


What buildings you consider to have the most benefit? Also a while back someone mentioned that extra zones made their empire flourish economically, any idea what he was referring? (I don't see anything in the trade report that might lend to that)

(in reply to BlueTemplar)
Post #: 19
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 5:59:46 PM   
newageofpower


Posts: 261
Joined: 12/3/2020
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: yutowap33
What buildings you consider to have the most benefit? Also a while back someone mentioned that extra zones made their empire flourish economically, any idea what he was referring? (I don't see anything in the trade report that might lend to that)


Commerce/Light Industry spam is pretty strong early/midgame. Though in the newest beta, the private sector turns off everything to build more Farms....

< Message edited by newageofpower -- 2/4/2021 6:19:19 PM >

(in reply to yutowap33)
Post #: 20
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 8:42:55 PM   
BlueTemplar


Posts: 887
Joined: 4/29/2010
Status: offline
quote:

When it's a good idea not to allow emergency food? I was scared by it once, since then I always do, not sure what the disadvantages are.

Probably when you're short on public food, and prefer to see it go to your soldiers or public workers rather than the population ?

(in reply to newageofpower)
Post #: 21
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/4/2021 9:58:24 PM   
zgrssd

 

Posts: 3024
Joined: 6/9/2020
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: yutowap33

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mina

- Start by building a railhead and Truck station on the tile you want to put your new city at. They're 1 turn to build and essential, because getting materials and food to your new city's incredibly important.
- Try to have cards like Zoo/Commercial Project available before starting a new zone. You're going to need to have your worker morale at 50 or better in order to get **** built in a reasonable timeframe, if worker morale is bad then you'll struggle to convert pop into workers, so you won't have enough people to build your QoL ****, so morale won't start improving, and repeat ad nauseum.
- Investor Backing is also good to play on new cities because it provides a random but static amount of money. Private investment scales depending on existing population


That pretty much what I did. I used 10k colonist, only went for Rail station and no Truck station (hopping that civil authority will take care of the latter in this remote community), and used my spare zone cards to boost the colonies (I built 2 to see how they compare).

I am little confused about private investment expansion, is there some build order and timer between constructions? because both colonies started by building a farming community, and now despite having pile of cash in private funds has no next project



quote:

ORIGINAL: newageofpower

They need enough unemployed civilians (population, not workers) as future employees to keep building stuff.

^^That
The private economy can even mothball facilities, but does not seem to scrap.

Especially new colonies will often have a severe lack of non-worker population. This can drive private Worker salaries as high as 7 miliCredits, wich also makes it hard to maintain a workforce.
But I am pretty sure a high Private Pay and unfilled Worker jobs should be a incentive for migration.

(in reply to yutowap33)
Post #: 22
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/5/2021 8:09:17 AM   
Mina

 

Posts: 44
Joined: 1/16/2021
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: yutowap33
I am little confused about private investment expansion, is there some build order and timer between constructions? because both colonies started by building a farming community, and now despite having pile of cash in private funds has no next project


I have no idea how it all works, but occasionally I've seen it go from no next project to deciding to build something once I chucked enough credits in. It'll only show up on next turn though.

(in reply to yutowap33)
Post #: 23
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/5/2021 10:00:48 AM   
BlueTemplar


Posts: 887
Joined: 4/29/2010
Status: offline
Oh, also about worker salary and worker happiness :
It seems like when you raise it, the immediate worker happiness increase is +5/millicredit (not having to do it millicredit by millecredit should save you quite a bit of PP on the first setup !).
However, when you lower the salary, the immediate happiness decrease seems to be a function relative to the relative decrease in pay :
In the most extreme case, going from a pay of 1 credit per thousand workers to 0 decreases their happiness from 80+ to 0 at once ! (Don't do that, lol.)

(I think council leader relation works in a similar way where their budget is concerned ?)

(in reply to Mina)
Post #: 24
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/6/2021 11:05:38 PM   
yutowap33

 

Posts: 70
Joined: 11/1/2017
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BlueTemplar
- Start with your Zone unincorporated for higher population happiness growth, and so that its initially zero civilization score doesn't impact yours. This will also give more resources for the private sector to build up.


I thought you meant the happiness reduction due to QOL score being bellow national civilization level, but I have set both of my colonies to unincorporated and I am still plagued by it. Can you clarify?

(in reply to BlueTemplar)
Post #: 25
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/6/2021 11:15:02 PM   
BlueTemplar


Posts: 887
Joined: 4/29/2010
Status: offline
IIRC QOL score doesn't (directly) impact Population happiness, you might be confusing with Worker happiness ?

And supposedly having the zone unincorporated increases Population happiness growth, though I haven't really been able to confirm, maybe it happens indirectly because the population generally ends up with more food to sell and credits for luxury products and services ?

BTW, I'm getting the impression that the public sector doesn't know how to use Industrial Points, so if the Zone is Unincorporated those from Light Industry end up wasted "thrown in a ditch somewhere" ?
(EDIT : Which would *really* be a shame, if like me, you've managed to get a Light Industry 2 in your Capital very early on by combining private sector "prodding" to build the lvl 1 and the "Eager Industrialist" fate stratagem to upgrade it, just to then waste all those IPs because you set your Capital to Unincorporated to raise Population happiness...)

< Message edited by BlueTemplar -- 2/6/2021 11:21:36 PM >

(in reply to yutowap33)
Post #: 26
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/6/2021 11:37:16 PM   
yutowap33

 

Posts: 70
Joined: 11/1/2017
Status: offline
Mouse hover over Population/worker happiness show the exact same lines (in terms of QOL) for both my unincoporated and incorporated zones.

iirc unincorporated zones benefit from no happiness loss due to combat losses. That is true for my two new zones but not for my unincorporated colonies, maybe this has todo with cultural adaption score? (colonies start with 100)

(in reply to BlueTemplar)
Post #: 27
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/7/2021 12:13:51 AM   
BlueTemplar


Posts: 887
Joined: 4/29/2010
Status: offline
Ah, never mind, population happiness *is* affected by QOL, but only *Zone* QOL (and compared to *Zone* Civ score, and those will eventually even out), but Population doesn't (directly ?) care about Regime's average Civilization Score and/or Civilization Level ?

The manual says :
quote:

5.3.11.4. reGular and unInCorPorated zones
You’ll start the game with only Regular Zones, but conquest will give you an
Unincorporated Zone.
An Unincorporated Zone has a certain level of independence and it is not
fully integrated with your other Zones.
Unincorporated Zones have the following different rules:
§ You still receive Service Tax from the Zone.
§ You do not receive Private Asset Tax from Private Assets. Private
Assets thus do not provide you with any Items.
§ The Zone Stats do not impact your Regime Stats, like your Popularity
or Culture Level.

§ No Sales or Income Tax will be imposed.
§ Regime casualties have no impact on the Population Happiness and
Loyalty.

§ No Recruitment of Colonists or Recruits is possible, but you can still
recruit Workers.
§ No Cultural Adjustment will take place.
§ Unincorporated Zones have double the Happiness growth up to 75
points, compared to Regular Zones.

You can order an Unincorporated Zone to become a Regular Zone at any
moment you like. Just call your Governor to discuss Zone Orders.
In general, it is a good idea to leave a conquered Zone Unincorporated for a
while, either to get Population Happiness restored as quickly as possible or
to ensure you keep benefiting from the option to use their possibly unique
Militia forces.

P.S.: Maybe the manual is outdated/wrong on this last § ?
P.P.S.: Also, is that double happiness growth only for Population, or maybe also for Workers too ?

< Message edited by BlueTemplar -- 2/7/2021 12:30:00 AM >

(in reply to yutowap33)
Post #: 28
RE: Any tips on starting new colonies? - 2/7/2021 1:49:13 PM   
zgrssd

 

Posts: 3024
Joined: 6/9/2020
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BlueTemplar

Ah, never mind, population happiness *is* affected by QOL, but only *Zone* QOL (and compared to *Zone* Civ score, and those will eventually even out), but Population doesn't (directly ?) care about Regime's average Civilization Score and/or Civilization Level ?

The manual says :
quote:

5.3.11.4. reGular and unInCorPorated zones
You’ll start the game with only Regular Zones, but conquest will give you an
Unincorporated Zone.
An Unincorporated Zone has a certain level of independence and it is not
fully integrated with your other Zones.
Unincorporated Zones have the following different rules:
§ You still receive Service Tax from the Zone.
§ You do not receive Private Asset Tax from Private Assets. Private
Assets thus do not provide you with any Items.
§ The Zone Stats do not impact your Regime Stats, like your Popularity
or Culture Level.

§ No Sales or Income Tax will be imposed.
§ Regime casualties have no impact on the Population Happiness and
Loyalty.

§ No Recruitment of Colonists or Recruits is possible, but you can still
recruit Workers.
§ No Cultural Adjustment will take place.
§ Unincorporated Zones have double the Happiness growth up to 75
points, compared to Regular Zones.

You can order an Unincorporated Zone to become a Regular Zone at any
moment you like. Just call your Governor to discuss Zone Orders.
In general, it is a good idea to leave a conquered Zone Unincorporated for a
while, either to get Population Happiness restored as quickly as possible or
to ensure you keep benefiting from the option to use their possibly unique
Militia forces.

P.S.: Maybe the manual is outdated/wrong on this last § ?
P.P.S.: Also, is that double happiness growth only for Population, or maybe also for Workers too ?

On happiness:
I think unincorporated zones have a certain loyalty growth. Loyalty drags up happiness if it is higher, but takes damage doing so.
Loyalty is dragged up by Happiness in return.

(in reply to BlueTemplar)
Post #: 29
Page:   [1]
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Shadow Empire >> Any tips on starting new colonies? Page: [1]
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

0.559