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Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/2/2021 8:38:19 AM   
KarisFraMauro

 

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I swear this game never ceases to surprise me. Since I'm definitely still learning I'm sticking to siwa class for now, but for the first time out of dozens of games everything is radioactive. About 50 percent of the territory is category three, so it's not as if it's a level I can easily ignore either. It's certainly interesting, but I'm wondering how exactly it resulted. Purely random? Distance from the star? Something about the dissolution war?
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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/2/2021 8:42:25 AM   
Uemon

 

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I believe radiation is generated in the history part of map creation, and basically what happens is regimes with nukes end up nuking each other. I think its random, but basically higher the pre fall population (and number of zones) more irradiated land youll have. There should also be some AI regimes that might spawn radiation or are spawned in radiation, i dont know, but i have seen those before, they would have a small territory, with a bunch of ruins and like 2 of the better goodie tiles.

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/2/2021 9:36:56 AM   
KarisFraMauro

 

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That makes sense. I'm also gradually increasing the difficulty so I wouldn't be surprised if that's a factor. The arachnids certainly seem to be enjoying all the radiation.

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/2/2021 10:36:11 AM   
Maerchen

 

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Check your planet history: Apocalypse. Check the timeline and the year AA (after apocalypse), if your game start is <200 years AA you will have a lot of radiation if hte cults nuked some zones, reactors went critical, etc.

I am currently on such a world, highest rad is 1065.

_____________________________

The logistics hell this game is IS the fun part! - Maerchen, 2020

The good thing is, we have all the information in the reports. The bad thing is, we have all the information. Maerchen, 2020

Came for SE. Will stay for SE.

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/2/2021 7:18:25 PM   
Daza99

 

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Does radiation on a planet also increase chances or always does of mutants being on a planet? i would presume so. Has anyone seen mutants on a planet with no radiation? Also i wonder if these mutants are more dangerous if the radiation level is higher? and what about mutant fauna if we have any of those? like the generator creates fauna as per normal and then alters them due to the radiation levels on the planet?

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/2/2021 8:23:02 PM   
KarisFraMauro

 

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I never paid that much attention to the apocalypse before, to be honest. Looks like it's worth a bit of a closer inspection. And rad levels 1000... Toasty.

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/2/2021 8:36:31 PM   
Uemon

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Daza99

Does radiation on a planet also increase chances or always does of mutants being on a planet? i would presume so. Has anyone seen mutants on a planet with no radiation? Also i wonder if these mutants are more dangerous if the radiation level is higher? and what about mutant fauna if we have any of those? like the generator creates fauna as per normal and then alters them due to the radiation levels on the planet?


Can confirm, i have multiple mutant regimes on a planet without radiation (at least that i can see and i see about 40% of the map).

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/2/2021 8:59:41 PM   
newageofpower


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Uemon
Can confirm, i have multiple mutant regimes on a planet without radiation (at least that i can see and i see about 40% of the map).

IIRC the Manual says mutants are created via bio/genetic weapons, not radiation.

It's not the Fallout/Wasteland series, guys.

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/3/2021 3:38:11 AM   
zgrssd

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: KarisFraMauro

I swear this game never ceases to surprise me. Since I'm definitely still learning I'm sticking to siwa class for now, but for the first time out of dozens of games everything is radioactive. About 50 percent of the territory is category three, so it's not as if it's a level I can easily ignore either. It's certainly interesting, but I'm wondering how exactly it resulted. Purely random? Distance from the star? Something about the dissolution war?

I think that is cosmic background radiation hammering the surface. It happens with really weak magnetic fields and no other body to shield your planet. Mars in particular has that little problem.
Alternatively, the normal radioactive material for the planet might not yet have setelled to lower layers of he ground.

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/3/2021 6:47:00 AM   
KarisFraMauro

 

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Yeah this is the closest planet to a star I've played yet (1/3rd astronomical unit) so it would make sense for that to influence things. Lighter gravity so less of an atmosphere to act as a shield. And for the magnetic field (umm, van allen belt?) I guess I'd need a rotating molten core.

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/4/2021 9:00:34 PM   
zgrssd

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: KarisFraMauro

Yeah this is the closest planet to a star I've played yet (1/3rd astronomical unit) so it would make sense for that to influence things. Lighter gravity so less of an atmosphere to act as a shield. And for the magnetic field (umm, van allen belt?) I guess I'd need a rotating molten core.

Mars used to have a decent Atmosphere and Magnetic field. Then the magnetic field vanished.
Due to lacking a sufficient magnetic field, solar wind actually managed to strip most of mars atmosphere.

Mars has less atmosphere then what it's gravity can maintain.

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/5/2021 3:25:48 AM   
KarisFraMauro

 

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Really, I didn't know the solar wind was that scary... Read somewhere that provided you put colonies in the upper atmosphere rather than the "slightly" inhospitable surface Venus could make a more habitable home than Mars. Something to do with more moisture in the atmosphere. Although I'm not sure about gravity being amenible to colonization. Read a neat short science fiction story a few years back about a war between Venus and one of the gas giants, with humans on Earth being alarmed spectators to the whole thing.

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/28/2021 6:29:19 PM   
arvcran2

 

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Curious, which planet class/category would Mars fit in with SE's planet generation for new games? Seth, Lima, or Planetoid?

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/28/2021 7:35:26 PM   
zgrssd

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: arvcran2

Curious, which planet class/category would Mars fit in with SE's planet generation for new games? Seth, Lima, or Planetoid?

Lets see:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mars

25° Axis tilt
High distance from the Sun at 1.4-1.6 AU
Suface temperature mean is −63 °C. min −143 °C. max 35 °C.
0.38 g
Atmosphere 0.006 Bar/6 mBar*, 96% CO2

*Atmosphere is way lower then what gravity could maintain. Lack of Magnetic field allowed solar wind to strip it way down. Do not try to fly or aerobreak there!

We can exclude Lima, as Mars has no liquid surface water.
In the real world desserts are cases of extreme temperatures, with nights even colder then the days are hot. But it does sound more like a Boreas then Seth class to me. And a odd Boreas, with barely any ice outside the poles.

< Message edited by zgrssd -- 1/28/2021 7:39:12 PM >

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/28/2021 8:02:11 PM   
arvcran2

 

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Yes I suppose Boreas fits. What about our sun, how would you place it in terms of SE generation? Well Wiki Star entry classifies our sun as a G2V.

Using Boreas I am getting results with 0 rainfall and oceans.

< Message edited by arvcran2 -- 1/28/2021 8:17:15 PM >

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/29/2021 5:18:56 AM   
KarisFraMauro

 

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Now you've got me wondering about Europa. Moon or planetoid I guess, but all the water under the surface makes it a bit more interesting. The vents aren't quite volcanoes exactly but they're kinda close. And maybe even a little life swimming around.

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/29/2021 7:17:26 AM   
arvcran2

 

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Am curious to know why we do not have some kind of non random method of choosing a colony and star pair.

I tried the unclassified to see what kind of results I would get. Most atmosphere compositions were coming up with >95% Xe.

Mars has a similar day length to earth at 24 and a half hours.

The thing with a moon is the proximity of it's planet and the effects it would have on it. Not sure what planetoid is, large enough asteroid so that it is spherical?

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/29/2021 7:31:55 AM   
zgrssd

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: KarisFraMauro

Now you've got me wondering about Europa. Moon or planetoid I guess, but all the water under the surface makes it a bit more interesting. The vents aren't quite volcanoes exactly but they're kinda close. And maybe even a little life swimming around.

"Water under the surface" would just be water mining spots. All Ice acts as infinite water mining spot in the game.
Those vents are called cryovolcanoes. Those would be just about as dangerous to move on as Volcanoes, but offer no ability to generate power as it is no easy geothermal access.

It has some serious water-ice on the surface, so realy just a boreal or moon type with ice sheets?


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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/29/2021 7:47:34 AM   
arvcran2

 

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Since Mars is considered dead due to it's lack of magma activity and production of magnetic field, would this have some kind of relation to the symptom of Olympus Mons?

Seems to me we would need to resurrect Mars before attempting to bring back an atmosphere.

< Message edited by arvcran2 -- 1/29/2021 7:49:39 AM >

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/29/2021 9:23:41 AM   
BlueTemplar


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"the symptom of Olympus Mons" ?

quote:

ORIGINAL: arvcran2

Am curious to know why we do not have some kind of non random method of choosing a colony and star pair.

I tried the unclassified to see what kind of results I would get. Most atmosphere compositions were coming up with >95% Xe.

Mars has a similar day length to earth at 24 and a half hours.

The thing with a moon is the proximity of it's planet and the effects it would have on it. Not sure what planetoid is, large enough asteroid so that it is spherical?

"Planetoid" seems to be obsolete terminology (aka "Minor Planet") :
quote:

A minor planet is an astronomical object in direct orbit around the Sun (or more broadly, any star with a planetary system) that is neither a planet nor exclusively classified as a comet.[a] Before 2006, the International Astronomical Union (IAU) officially used the term minor planet, but during that year's meeting it reclassified minor planets and comets into dwarf planets and small Solar System bodies (SSSBs).[1]

Minor planets can be dwarf planets, asteroids, trojans, centaurs, Kuiper belt objects, and other trans-Neptunian objects.[2] As of 2019, the orbits of 794,832 minor planets were archived at the Minor Planet Center, 541,128 of which had received permanent numbers (for the complete list, see index).[3]

The first minor planet to be discovered was Ceres in 1801. The term minor planet has been used since the 19th century to describe these objects.[4] The term planetoid has also been used, especially for larger (planetary) objects such as those the International Astronomical Union (IAU) has called dwarf planets since 2006.[5][6] Historically, the terms asteroid, minor planet, and planetoid have been more or less synonymous.[5][7] This terminology has become more complicated by the discovery of numerous minor planets beyond the orbit of Jupiter, especially trans-Neptunian objects that are generally not considered asteroids.[7] A minor planet seen releasing gas may be dually classified as a comet.

Objects are called dwarf planets if their own gravity is sufficient to achieve hydrostatic equilibrium and form an ellipsoidal shape. All other minor planets and comets are called small Solar System bodies.[1] The IAU stated that the term minor planet may still be used, but the term small Solar System body will be preferred.[8] However, for purposes of numbering and naming, the traditional distinction between minor planet and comet is still used.

So it doesn't even need to be large/"spherical".

P.S.: Speaking of Unclassified Planets and random generation, I've tried to roll a "Drop me in a game now!" Unclassified with the following parameters :
- Open Farming is possible *and* not too penalized *and* requires water. (Sub-zero xenoplants don't seem to require water, though one wonders how can they be edible if they use any other kind of solvent ?)
- Capital starts in an area good enough to start with an open farm rather than a dome.
- Capital starts in an area with enough rain/water body so that open farming is still not worse than domed farming.
Well after rolling what must have been fifty planets, not managing to find one, I gave up.
Took me less than a dozen tries on Siwa class (which was still surprisingly high).
(Also, Medusa class seems to always prevent Open farming completely with both Bio Hazard and Alien Nutritional Toxicity at lvl 4.)

< Message edited by BlueTemplar -- 1/29/2021 9:37:47 AM >

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/29/2021 10:21:31 AM   
zgrssd

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: arvcran2

Since Mars is considered dead due to it's lack of magma activity and production of magnetic field, would this have some kind of relation to the symptom of Olympus Mons?

Seems to me we would need to resurrect Mars before attempting to bring back an atmosphere.

The game "Surviving Mars" deals with terraforming mars:
https://survivingmars.paradoxwikis.com/Terraforming

There is a permanent loss of atmosphere, based on the strenght of the atmosphere. Countered by "Magnetic Field Generator", of wich you will need enough.
You need enough temperature for liquid water, but temperature requires a Atmosphere.
Adding Atmsophere will reduce the Dust and Meteor shower weather as well as improove wind turbine production.
But add toxic rain (until you got enough for clear rain) and reduce solar panel output (wich is already pretty bad on mars).
You also want to add vegetation wich does create a self-suistaining Atmosphere growth, but to do so you need enough water and temperature.
But if you got enough atmosphere, your people can stop wearing space suits everywhere.
I can give you a let's play of the game to look at:
https://youtu.be/GyFdPzioxHo?list=PLNn7c31H7NjmZWyu-37V2xifD5V7Pzleo

Note that in Shadow Empires, the colonists may already terraform the planet. If there is CO2, liquid water and non-toxic soil, they will plant trees. Given a few centuries, that can snowball into a breathable atmosphere. However they can not do stuff like reinforcing the amtosphere or magnetic field
The formula for a O2 atmosphere is: CO2 + earth plants + time.
However in reality, such a terraforming should have a major cooling effect (given that you take most CO2 out of the atmosphere).

< Message edited by zgrssd -- 1/29/2021 10:22:53 AM >

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/29/2021 11:23:34 AM   
BlueTemplar


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I was wondering how much Earth's 80% nitrogen in the air would be important for Earth plants ?
Finding an almost-only-Xenon atmosphere being rated as perfect for Earth plants (Terran Agri. Atmos Toxicity lvl 0) was weird...
But AFAIK plants actually have trouble using the air nitrogen, and mostly get it from the soil ?

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/29/2021 1:12:38 PM   
arvcran2

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: zgrssd

quote:

ORIGINAL: arvcran2

Since Mars is considered dead due to it's lack of magma activity and production of magnetic field, would this have some kind of relation to the symptom of Olympus Mons?

Seems to me we would need to resurrect Mars before attempting to bring back an atmosphere.

The game "Surviving Mars" deals with terraforming mars:
https://survivingmars.paradoxwikis.com/Terraforming

There is a permanent loss of atmosphere, based on the strenght of the atmosphere. Countered by "Magnetic Field Generator", of wich you will need enough.
You need enough temperature for liquid water, but temperature requires a Atmosphere.
Adding Atmsophere will reduce the Dust and Meteor shower weather as well as improove wind turbine production.
But add toxic rain (until you got enough for clear rain) and reduce solar panel output (wich is already pretty bad on mars).
You also want to add vegetation wich does create a self-suistaining Atmosphere growth, but to do so you need enough water and temperature.
But if you got enough atmosphere, your people can stop wearing space suits everywhere.
I can give you a let's play of the game to look at:
https://youtu.be/GyFdPzioxHo?list=PLNn7c31H7NjmZWyu-37V2xifD5V7Pzleo

Note that in Shadow Empires, the colonists may already terraform the planet. If there is CO2, liquid water and non-toxic soil, they will plant trees. Given a few centuries, that can snowball into a breathable atmosphere. However they can not do stuff like reinforcing the amtosphere or magnetic field
The formula for a O2 atmosphere is: CO2 + earth plants + time.
However in reality, such a terraforming should have a major cooling effect (given that you take most CO2 out of the atmosphere).

Awesome, I'll have a look at playthrough. -60C is a deterrent to growing trees :). Stars go through phases of size and radiation diffusion which could account for significant changes in planetology.

Hey BlueTemplar, by 'Olympus Mons symptom' I am referring to what appears to be a single massive magma release of Mars's core.

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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/29/2021 1:13:48 PM   
arvcran2

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BlueTemplar

I was wondering how much Earth's 80% nitrogen in the air would be important for Earth plants ?
Finding an almost-only-Xenon atmosphere being rated as perfect for Earth plants (Terran Agri. Atmos Toxicity lvl 0) was weird...
But AFAIK plants actually have trouble using the air nitrogen, and mostly get it from the soil ?

Such interesting topics! So much to learn ;)!

(in reply to BlueTemplar)
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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/29/2021 4:52:03 PM   
BlueTemplar


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Indeed !

quote:

ORIGINAL: arvcran2
Hey BlueTemplar, by 'Olympus Mons symptom' I am referring to what appears to be a single massive magma release of Mars's core.

Oh, right, more even than just very high, it is indeed MASSIVE !


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RE: Anything govern radiation levels in planet creation? - 1/29/2021 11:18:29 PM   
zgrssd

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BlueTemplar

I was wondering how much Earth's 80% nitrogen in the air would be important for Earth plants ?
Finding an almost-only-Xenon atmosphere being rated as perfect for Earth plants (Terran Agri. Atmos Toxicity lvl 0) was weird...
But AFAIK plants actually have trouble using the air nitrogen, and mostly get it from the soil ?

For most consideration, Nitrogen is just a innert "filler gas".
Even on earth we priarily use it for explosives and fertilizers - nitrogen fertilizers are actually a common source of homemade explosives and what makes industrial accidents with fertilizer so energetic.

Xenon or another noble gas would thus not be inherently bad alternative to Nitrogen in the atmosphere.

(in reply to BlueTemplar)
Post #: 26
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