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Question about DDG113 VLS loadout

 
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Question about DDG113 VLS loadout - 11/18/2020 3:45:06 AM   
Varangian

 

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Hi

This is probably a stupid question, but I am curious.

I am trying the ASW tutorial which uses the DDG113 John Finn, an Arleigh Burke Flight IIA.
In the weapons it lists one Mk41 VLS with 32 cells and a second with 64 cells.

In the 32 cell VLS is has 28 Tomahawks and 12 RIM-162A ESSM for a total of 40 missiles in 32 cells. This does not add up to me. What am I missing?

Thanks
Barry
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RE: Question about DDG113 VLS loadout - 11/18/2020 4:12:16 AM   
Battelman2

 

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ESSMs are small and can be quad-packed into Mk41 cells. That's one of the big reasons that they are so popular.

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RE: Question about DDG113 VLS loadout - 11/18/2020 6:25:52 AM   
Dimitris

 

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RE: Question about DDG113 VLS loadout - 11/19/2020 6:58:45 AM   
Varangian

 

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Thanks for the replies.

This gives a potentially huge increase in shipboard SAM capacity. I wonder if USN planners were terrified after reading the Dance of the Vampires chapter in RSR.

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RE: Question about DDG113 VLS loadout - 11/19/2020 2:04:31 PM   
Gunner98

 

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quote:

Dance of the Vampires chapter in RSR.(




I cannot remember where, but there were some very interesting threads here a couple years ago which discussed roles, loadouts and tasks for VLS ships. There was some documentation with some very informative charts.

Scenario designers should realize that the loadout in the CMO DB is simply a baseline starting point. Each TG in RL is configured based on a detailed assessment of the threats and tasks expected. Why would you carry TLAMs if you didn't have an ASuW task? If the bad guy your facing doesn't have BMs, why do you need ABMs? How strong is the Sub threat - how many ASROCs do you need... etc

No ship or TG will completely strip itself of a capability, so even if you don't expect a threat, there will still be missiles to counter it - but the choice is in the weighting.

E.g. You have a CSG going into the Western Pacific - air threat high, BM threat high, CM threat high, Sub threat high, chance of an ASuW task coming your way probably low. You're CSG has 1x CG-52 and 3x DDG-51. You need to mix and match your ~400 VLS tubes to counter the threat. The real loadouts are highly classified, and the number of certain types of missiles limited, they can only be reloaded in port so length of the mission is important. So I think that the balancing of these factors when setting up a scenario is important.

So sure, you can load them up with a heck of a lot of ESSMs, but they don't work so well against subs or BMs and will be overwhelmed quickly by CMs if the strike hasn't been whittled down a bit.

This is part of the fun.

B



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RE: Question about DDG113 VLS loadout - 11/19/2020 3:14:50 PM   
thewood1

 

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If you google VLS loadouts, there are a number of reports and presentations that detail them out. There is one report that detailed methods for optimizing Burke loadouts for various missions.

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RE: Question about DDG113 VLS loadout - 11/19/2020 3:15:25 PM   
thewood1

 

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And here it is...

https://apps.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a620888.pdf

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RE: Question about DDG113 VLS loadout - 11/19/2020 6:05:55 PM   
stilesw


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Excellent reference. I've added it to the Command unofficial Dropbox reference library.

Unofficial - i.e. not sponsored by WarefareSims, MatrixGames, Slitherine, their employees, relatives, pets or ancestors.


As always, any forum member can have access to this Dropbox resource. Just PM me with your email address.

-Wayne Stiles



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RE: Question about DDG113 VLS loadout - 11/19/2020 6:56:09 PM   
thewood1

 

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I have posted it before, along with a few other VLS references. You might be able to search on this one and find them, if you are so inclined.

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RE: Question about DDG113 VLS loadout - 11/19/2020 11:41:04 PM   
BeirutDude


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quote:

Scenario designers should realize that the loadout in the CMO DB is simply a baseline starting point. Each TG in RL is configured based on a detailed assessment of the threats and tasks expected. Why would you carry TLAMs if you didn't have an ASuW task? If the bad guy your facing doesn't have BMs, why do you need ABMs? How strong is the Sub threat - how many ASROCs do you need... etc


It took me a few scenario designs to get up the courage to play with the base VLS loadouts and then it takes playing with them and making a lot of mistakes to get them right. Its not intuitive!

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RE: Question about DDG113 VLS loadout - 11/19/2020 11:45:02 PM   
BeirutDude


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quote:

And here it is...

https://apps.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a620888.pdf


Good Stuff, bookmarked that link!

_____________________________

"Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem."
PRESIDENT RONALD REAGAN, 1985

I was Navy, but Assigned TAD to the 24th MAU Hq in Beirut. By far the finest period of my service!

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RE: Question about DDG113 VLS loadout - 12/6/2020 7:30:35 PM   
stilesw


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quote:

I have posted it before, along with a few other VLS references. You might be able to search on this one and find them, if you are so inclined.


Found VLS Loadout Planner and Winning the Salvo Competition previously added to the library. Thanks for the information.

-WS

_____________________________

“There is no limit to what a man can do so long as he does not care a straw who gets the credit for it.”

Charles Edward Montague, English novelist and essayist
~Disenchantment, ch. 15 (1922)

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RE: Question about DDG113 VLS loadout - 12/6/2020 7:46:53 PM   
thewood1

 

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Related to this thread...

The first thing I do with any scenario that has Burkes and Ticos in it is evaluate the VLS loadout. The default loadout is very heavy with Tomahawks for land strikes. If the scenario is a peer navy challenge, I reload with a heavy AA loadout. Depending on the date and mission, I usually put in a bunch of ESSMs and SM-6s. Lately, I've been activating the SAM as ASuM option for more flexibility.

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Post #: 13
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