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B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits?

 
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B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 12:01:37 AM   
RangerJoe


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I can understand the first attack, but what happened in the second one?

quote:

Afternoon Air attack on Miri , at 64,87

Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid spotted at 14 NM, estimated altitude 13,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 3 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-17D Fortress x 5

No Allied losses

Oil hits 2

Aircraft Attacking:
2 x B-17D Fortress bombing from 10000 feet *
City Attack: 4 x 500 lb GP Bomb
3 x B-17D Fortress bombing from 10000 feet *
City Attack: 4 x 500 lb GP Bomb



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on Miri , at 64,87

Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid spotted at 2 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 0 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-17D Fortress x 5

No Allied losses

Mk 7 Depth Charge hits 4

Aircraft Attacking:
5 x B-17D Fortress bombing from 11000 feet *
City Attack: 4 x 500 lb GP Bomb


_____________________________

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Post #: 1
RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 12:10:53 AM   
RangerJoe


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This is also understandable:

quote:

Night Time Surface Combat, near Vigan at 80,73, Range 7,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
xAKL Banshu Maru #56
xAKL Choun Maru #21
xAKL Hinode Maru #20
xAKL Musashi Maru
xAKL Rokko Maru, Shell hits 4, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAKL Toshi Maru #2
PB Akitsui Maru
xAK Tokusima Maru
xAK Kosei Maru
xAK Yamagiku Maru
xAK Toyokawa Maru, Shell hits 2
xAK Konan Maru
xAKL Arizama Maru
xAK Aki Maru
xAK Chowa Maru
xAKL Jinsan Maru
xAK Koyo Maru
xAK Mansei Maru
xAKL Oridono Maru
xAK Soyo Maru, Shell hits 1
xAK Satsuma Maru, Shell hits 4, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
xAK Sugiyama Maru, Torpedo hits 2, and is sunk
xAKL Tensyo Maru
xAK Tsuyama Maru, Shell hits 4, heavy fires
xAKL Tohuku Maru, Shell hits 1
xAK Ueizuru Maru, Shell hits 8, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
xAK Unkai Maru #6, Shell hits 2
xAKL Yosyu Maru, Shell hits 1
xAK Yasuteru Maru

Allied Ships
PT-31
PT-32
PT-33
PT-35
PT-41
PT Q-111
PT Q-112
PT Q-113, Shell hits 2, heavy fires

Maximum visibility in Overcast Conditions and 35% moonlight: 7,000 yards


But then the Japanese really got unlucky against the Flippino Navy!

quote:

Night Time Surface Combat, near Vigan at 80,73, Range 2,000 Yards

Japanese aircraft
no flights

Japanese aircraft losses
E8N2 Dave: 2 destroyed

Japanese Ships
BB Ise, Torpedo hits 3, and is sunk
CA Mogami
DD Mikazuki
DD Okikaze

Allied Ships
PT-31
PT-32
PT-33
PT-35
PT-41, Shell hits 3, and is sunk
PT Q-111
PT Q-112, Shell hits 3, and is sunk
PT Q-113, Shell hits 11, and is sunk

Maximum visibility in Overcast Conditions and 35% moonlight: 3,000 yards

BB Ise sunk by PT Q-111 at 2,000 yards


Unfortunately, I hit escape on the second battle and I did not see if it was three torpedo hits by one PT Boat or hits by other PT boats as well. And yes, the surface fleet was the second battle otherwise it may have been wiped out!

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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 3:17:10 AM   
RangerJoe


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Then on 18 December 1941:

quote:

Morning Air attack on Miri , at 64,87

Weather in hex: Thunderstorms

Raid spotted at 19 NM, estimated altitude 15,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 5 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-17D Fortress x 15

No Allied losses

Mk 9 Depth Charge hits 1Morning Air attack on Miri , at 64,87

Weather in hex: Thunderstorms

Raid spotted at 19 NM, estimated altitude 15,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 5 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-17D Fortress x 15

No Allied losses

Mk 9 Depth Charge hits 1


But

quote:

Morning Air attack on Miri , at 64,87

Weather in hex: Thunderstorms

Raid spotted at 25 NM, estimated altitude 12,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-17D Fortress x 11

No Allied losses

Oil hits 2


_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 3
RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 3:19:28 AM   
RangerJoe


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Then on 19 December 1941:

quote:

Morning Air attack on Miri , at 64,87

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid spotted at 16 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 4 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-17D Fortress x 12

No Allied losses

Oil hits 1
Hedgehog Mk 11 hits 1


and

quote:

Morning Air attack on Miri , at 64,87

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid spotted at 19 NM, estimated altitude 10,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 5 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-17D Fortress x 9

No Allied losses

Oil hits 4


_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 3:23:55 AM   
RangerJoe


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This is the latest Scenario 2 with the updated AI. I have some bombers attacking the oil, other B-17s attacking the Light Industry that was placed there. When the Dutch bombers attack the oil, sometimes they also get oil hits.

But I don't understand why the ASW devices in the city are being hit. I did not realise that Miri had/has ASW devices in this scenario.

_____________________________

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I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 4:12:52 AM   
BBfanboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

This is the latest Scenario 2 with the updated AI. I have some bombers attacking the oil, other B-17s attacking the Light Industry that was placed there. When the Dutch bombers attack the oil, sometimes they also get oil hits.

But I don't understand why the ASW devices in the city are being hit. I did not realise that Miri had/has ASW devices in this scenario.

Miri has a refinery as well as the oil patch, right? I suspect the database has the wrong code for the refinery - making it the depth charge device? In the device database the codes for Support, Motorized Support, and Engineers are very close to the codes for industry as well.

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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 4:49:38 AM   
RangerJoe


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This one has LI as well as resources. The oil hits are working fine but the LI attacks?

This game is against the computer so my opponent won't smirk as his industry is safe from bombing.

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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 8:21:12 AM   
Ambassador

 

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FOW maybe ? Have you checked in-game to see if there was damage on the industry ?

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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 11:48:44 AM   
RangerJoe


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Yes, I have looked. The oil hits show up but no LI hits show up. That is, the oil production goes down but not the LI.

_____________________________

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I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 12:15:20 PM   
GetAssista

 

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Given it's only you who see those bugs, I'd tell the people what have you edited in Scen2 for your personal use :) It's OK.
And load a game as Japan and peek at Miri, take a screenshot, post it here. And load Scen2 in the editor go to Miri in Locations->731 and post screenshot here. Then we can talk

Also it kinda bothers me that Oil is the only industry that does not have itself set as an upgrade, but it's like that in all the scenarios since time immemorial

Also, the fact that you hit devices 111->113->115 in consecutive days is similar to how AI repairs 2 industries per turn :D Be a good boy, peek at Miri



To add some lighthearted joke bugs with the AI games: recently I was able to bombard and damage planes that were not in the airgroups :) They were in the reinforcement convoy that mysteriously rerouted from off-map to a very much alive and hot on-map base. Wonder what happens with planes that are damaged in crates.

< Message edited by GetAssista -- 11/17/2020 12:33:55 PM >

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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 4:31:28 PM   
BBfanboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

Given it's only you who see those bugs, I'd tell the people what have you edited in Scen2 for your personal use :) It's OK.
And load a game as Japan and peek at Miri, take a screenshot, post it here. And load Scen2 in the editor go to Miri in Locations->731 and post screenshot here. Then we can talk

Also it kinda bothers me that Oil is the only industry that does not have itself set as an upgrade, but it's like that in all the scenarios since time immemorial

Also, the fact that you hit devices 111->113->115 in consecutive days is similar to how AI repairs 2 industries per turn :D Be a good boy, peek at Miri



To add some lighthearted joke bugs with the AI games: recently I was able to bombard and damage planes that were not in the airgroups :) They were in the reinforcement convoy that mysteriously rerouted from off-map to a very much alive and hot on-map base. Wonder what happens with planes that are damaged in crates.

Resources also do not have an expansion (there is no such thing as an industry upgrade other than aircraft related ones changing their type).

As I speculated before, there appears to be errors in the number used in the base definition slots for Refinery and LI. One comes up with the device number for a Mark 7 DC, another for a Mark 9 DC. Not sure what comes up for the mousetrap, unless there is more industry at Miri. It could be the other way around too - the database index number for those ASW devices could have accidentally been changed to the same code as the industry. Checking the modded database would be the way to find out.
If that is not the cause of the problem, I can only suggest some kind of corruption of data has taken place and a restart or re-install might be required.

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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 4:57:20 PM   
GetAssista

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy
Resources also do not have an expansion (there is no such thing as an industry upgrade other than aircraft related ones changing their type).

You are talking about something else, not what I have said. Check the Editor to be in the clear

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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 4:57:57 PM   
fcooke

 

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Seems really odd. Good job by the PTs though. I don't even think the hedgehog was around in Dec 41, and have never heard of it being used by aircraft. And I don't think the US ever used 17s in ASW work, though the Brits did for a while. So I am with BB, database error or corrupt files. Though I guess you could take the top turret off a 17 and mount the hedgehog launcher there....

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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 5:07:09 PM   
RangerJoe


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No, the BOMBS HIT the ASW devices at Miri, the B-17s were not equipped with them.

It is a new install, with the new scenarios and the new AIs.

I probably should reinstall, then run those turns.

Thank you on those PT Boats. I think that they definitely earned their pay that night.

< Message edited by RangerJoe -- 11/18/2020 12:45:36 AM >


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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 5:14:01 PM   
fcooke

 

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Err - American bombers hit Japanese hedgehogs in Dec 41? Something is rotten in Denmark....

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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 9:37:09 PM   
BBfanboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy
Resources also do not have an expansion (there is no such thing as an industry upgrade other than aircraft related ones changing their type).

You are talking about something else, not what I have said. Check the Editor to be in the clear


quote:

GetAssista: Also it kinda bothers me that Oil is the only industry that does not have itself set as an upgrade


I took your word 'upgrade' to mean expansion in size, since upgrade is not applicable to all none-aircraft industries: shipbuilding, refineries, armaments, vehicles, etc. I cannot otherwise figure out what you mean by "upgrade" because I did not expect you to forget about all those other industries.

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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 9:38:16 PM   
BBfanboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: fcooke

Err - American bombers hit Japanese hedgehogs in Dec 41? Something is rotten in Denmark....

Maybe they were raising them to be sold as pets?

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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/17/2020 11:20:35 PM   
Moltrey


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Ranger Joe:
You need to bring this to AndyMac's attention over in the other thread, perhaps he can look into it for you.

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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/18/2020 12:20:12 AM   
RangerJoe


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Well,for 5 December 1941:

quote:

Morning Air attack on Kuching , at 58,88

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid spotted at 20 NM, estimated altitude 15,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 5 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-17D Fortress x 15

No Allied losses

Light Industry hits 1


This LI was also added to the base for this scenario.

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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/18/2020 11:47:18 AM   
GetAssista

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy
I took your word 'upgrade' to mean expansion in size, since upgrade is not applicable to all none-aircraft industries: shipbuilding, refineries, armaments, vehicles, etc. I cannot otherwise figure out what you mean by "upgrade" because I did not expect you to forget about all those other industries.

You should not look for hidden meanings, upgrade is upgrade. Each device can be assigned one. Oil is not assigned an upgrade, all other other industries are, it's all clear there in the editor. But that's a minor probably not related to what RangerJoe is having. And given that he apparently does not want to look into the Miri industries, I won't bother too.

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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/18/2020 2:00:47 PM   
RangerJoe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy
I took your word 'upgrade' to mean expansion in size, since upgrade is not applicable to all none-aircraft industries: shipbuilding, refineries, armaments, vehicles, etc. I cannot otherwise figure out what you mean by "upgrade" because I did not expect you to forget about all those other industries.

You should not look for hidden meanings, upgrade is upgrade. Each device can be assigned one. Oil is not assigned an upgrade, all other other industries are, it's all clear there in the editor. But that's a minor probably not related to what RangerJoe is having. And given that he apparently does not want to look into the Miri industries, I won't bother too.


The mouse over showed no damage to the light industries but the oil was getting damaged. But since the computer moved a bunch of fighters, bombers, and auxiliary aircraft in, I gave my bombers a rest and changed targets after Kuching was captured. If I were to load the Japanese side now, I could see what they moved in and I would rather not do that. If I exit the game and reload it, then I might look at an earlier turn.

As far as posting screenshots, I have not taken them in the game so I would have to learn to do that. I can post pictures and get people to see them. Just ask Zorch if he wants me to post a picture of my right foot . . .

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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/18/2020 11:52:45 PM   
RangerJoe


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I must admit, Manila will be just a little difficult to hold against this division which has multiple big brass ones:

quote:

Ground combat at Manila (79,77)

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 14514 troops, 315 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 790

Defending force 28858 troops, 249 guns, 84 vehicles, Assault Value = 997

Allied ground losses:
6 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Assaulting units:
31st PA Infantry Division
3rd PA Constabulary Rgt /1
51st PA Infantry Division
91st PA Infantry Division
3rd/12th PA Inf Battalion
2nd PA Constabulary Regiment
3rd/101st PA Bn /1
1st PA Infantry Division
71st PA Infantry Division
2nd/101st PA Battalion
41st PA Infantry Division
103rd PA Infantry Rgt /1
Winnipeg Grenadiers Bn /1
4th PI Base Force /1
South Luzon Force
PAF Aviation
Manila USAAF Base Force
Guam USN Base Force /1
1st PI Base Force
Mindanao Force Corps /1

Defending units:
16th Division


edit:

The 48th Division is similar, there is a brigade of the 8th division with an AV of 492 or something like that. The TO&E is the normal one for the division, I don't know if this is the way that it should be.

I hope that the picture is readable, it is my first screenshot to be posted on the site.




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by RangerJoe -- 11/19/2020 12:33:20 AM >


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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/19/2020 9:58:25 PM   
traskott


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That the typical TOE of AndyMac AI divisions in the ironman scenarios. I have seen even some LCUs of 2000 AV each.

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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/19/2020 10:35:11 PM   
RangerJoe


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When you hit the "show unit TOE" it shows the regular strength for a division, not this strength. I was just wondering if the division as supposed to be this strong. Oh well, I will trap it but I doubt if I can keep it from taking Manila.

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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/21/2020 3:55:59 PM   
bigred


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s
quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

This is also understandable:

quote:

Night Time Surface Combat, near Vigan at 80,73, Range 7,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
xAKL Banshu Maru #56
xAKL Choun Maru #21
xAKL Hinode Maru #20
xAKL Musashi Maru
xAKL Rokko Maru, Shell hits 4, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAKL Toshi Maru #2
PB Akitsui Maru
xAK Tokusima Maru
xAK Kosei Maru
xAK Yamagiku Maru
xAK Toyokawa Maru, Shell hits 2
xAK Konan Maru
xAKL Arizama Maru
xAK Aki Maru
xAK Chowa Maru
xAKL Jinsan Maru
xAK Koyo Maru
xAK Mansei Maru
xAKL Oridono Maru
xAK Soyo Maru, Shell hits 1
xAK Satsuma Maru, Shell hits 4, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
xAK Sugiyama Maru, Torpedo hits 2, and is sunk
xAKL Tensyo Maru
xAK Tsuyama Maru, Shell hits 4, heavy fires
xAKL Tohuku Maru, Shell hits 1
xAK Ueizuru Maru, Shell hits 8, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
xAK Unkai Maru #6, Shell hits 2
xAKL Yosyu Maru, Shell hits 1
xAK Yasuteru Maru

Allied Ships
PT-31
PT-32
PT-33
PT-35
PT-41
PT Q-111
PT Q-112
PT Q-113, Shell hits 2, heavy fires

Maximum visibility in Overcast Conditions and 35% moonlight: 7,000 yards


But then the Japanese really got unlucky against the Flippino Navy!

quote:

Night Time Surface Combat, near Vigan at 80,73, Range 2,000 Yards

Japanese aircraft
no flights

Japanese aircraft losses
E8N2 Dave: 2 destroyed

Japanese Ships
BB Ise, Torpedo hits 3, and is sunk
CA Mogami
DD Mikazuki
DD Okikaze

Allied Ships
PT-31
PT-32
PT-33
PT-35
PT-41, Shell hits 3, and is sunk
PT Q-111
PT Q-112, Shell hits 3, and is sunk
PT Q-113, Shell hits 11, and is sunk

Maximum visibility in Overcast Conditions and 35% moonlight: 3,000 yards

BB Ise sunk by PT Q-111 at 2,000 yards


Unfortunately, I hit escape on the second battle and I did not see if it was three torpedo hits by one PT Boat or hits by other PT boats as well. And yes, the surface fleet was the second battle otherwise it may have been wiped out!

quote:

second battle otherwise it may have b

I a game about 5 years ago I had a PT boat catch the Musashi TF in shallow water off Rangoon in mid43. One torp into Musashi and she was out of the game(heavy damage) for the remainder of the war.


< Message edited by bigred -- 11/21/2020 3:57:32 PM >


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(in reply to RangerJoe)
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RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 11/21/2020 5:12:26 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 17126
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bigred
I a game about 5 years ago I had a PT boat catch the Musashi TF in shallow water off Rangoon in mid43. One torp into Musashi and she was out of the game(heavy damage) for the remainder of the war.


Nice, but Greyjoy's PT torpedoing Yamato and getting a magazine explosion is still the best fluke I have seen.

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(in reply to bigred)
Post #: 26
RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 12/27/2020 9:54:34 AM   
PaxMondo


Posts: 9750
Joined: 6/6/2008
Status: offline
RJ: as GA requested, you would need to post some screen shots from the editor before any assistance can be offered. I looked at my copy of the new Scen 1 and 2 and I am not seeing any issues. Possibly you have a corrupted file, possibly you have a memory leak, etc. But cannot assist without some screen shots from the editor ... not the game, the editor.

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(in reply to BBfanboy)
Post #: 27
RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 12/27/2020 4:00:16 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 12047
Joined: 11/16/2015
From: My Mother, although my Father had some small part.
Status: offline
I have reinstalled the game and it has not reoccurred. At that time, I had never done a screenshot and posted it . . .

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(in reply to PaxMondo)
Post #: 28
RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 1/30/2021 2:39:42 AM   
Dan1977

 

Posts: 62
Joined: 1/28/2021
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To RangerJoe, Did you fix the Miri's devices issue in the Editor? That will fix it. By the way, I have spent money at Ranger Joes in Columbus. Is that where your posting name comes from?

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 29
RE: B-17D bomb and achieve? Mk 7 Depth Charge hits? - 1/30/2021 2:50:47 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 12047
Joined: 11/16/2015
From: My Mother, although my Father had some small part.
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dan1977

To RangerJoe, Did you fix the Miri's devices issue in the Editor? That will fix it. By the way, I have spent money at Ranger Joes in Columbus. Is that where your posting name comes from?


No, I have never used the editor.

No, my posting name does not come from there.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to Dan1977)
Post #: 30
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