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RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021

 
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RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 6/28/2021 11:54:44 PM   
ThunderLizard2

 

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ELO completed: ThunderLizard2 (Allies) v. DmitryN (Axis). Allies win in fall '42. Axis pushed back China well into the interior and have invaded Southern India. Italy knocked out and Allies landings occured in France (Paris freed) and Northern Germany (Hamburg), Northern Italy and Balkans. Russia holding tight and yet to lose one of big three.

New ELO starting:

ThunderLizard2 (Axis) v. EarlyDoors (Allies)

(in reply to EarlyDoors)
Post #: 511
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 6/29/2021 5:57:24 PM   
ElvisJJonesRambo


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European Championship: England (WON) 2 goals vs Germany (LOSS) 0 goals

$$$$$ easy $$$$$$

Federer wins by injury
(Not easy money, he's rusty)

(in reply to ThunderLizard2)
Post #: 512
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 6/30/2021 1:45:04 PM   
ThunderLizard2

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ElvisJJonesRambo

European Championship: England (WON) 2 goals vs Germany (LOSS) 0 goals

$$$$$ easy $$$$$$

Federer wins by injury
(Not easy money, he's rusty)




Elvis is back! Looking forward to more Rambo reports.

(in reply to ElvisJJonesRambo)
Post #: 513
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/1/2021 11:39:25 AM   
petedalby

 

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quote:

Pete is tough to beat as the Axis so I'm looking forward to a challenging game.


It's the kiss of death!

Jackmck (Allies) beats petedalby (Axis) in June 44. Terrific Allied strategy by Jackmck to boost USSR morale at every opportunity. Despite losing all 3 capitals, Leningrad, Stalingrad and most other NMO's the USSR refused to surrender. The Japanese & Germans were overwhelmed by Allied counterattacks which started as early as '41.

The learning point for the Allies is to keep going until the USSR surrenders - because it might not.

Great game! Thanks very much.

(in reply to ThunderLizard2)
Post #: 514
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/1/2021 12:56:39 PM   
EarlyDoors


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quote:


Terrific Allied strategy by Jackmck to boost USSR morale at every opportunity. Despite losing all 3 capitals, Leningrad, Stalingrad and most other NMO's the USSR refused to surrender.


How did he boost morale, Pete?


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Post #: 515
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/1/2021 1:14:05 PM   
Marcinos1985

 

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quote:

And we're off! MattShadowlord vs Marcinos (Allies)


Allied victory in 1943. My opponent's got a sense of humour, nice addition to a good game.

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Post #: 516
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/1/2021 2:25:15 PM   
petedalby

 

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quote:

How did he boost morale, Pete?


There appear to be various in game events which boost Soviet morale such as landing 3+ Allied units in France, same for Italy. Being still in the war at the start of 1943. Liberation of Italy, liberation of France, Allies in Germany, taking Konigsberg I think was another?

In our game you triggered some of these. I guess there is probably a variable factor as well but despite all their losses and the loss of NMOs the USSR morale didn't drop much below 80%.

(in reply to Marcinos1985)
Post #: 517
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/1/2021 2:46:07 PM   
EarlyDoors


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quote:

ORIGINAL: petedalby

quote:

How did he boost morale, Pete?


There appear to be various in game events which boost Soviet morale such as landing 3+ Allied units in France, same for Italy. Being still in the war at the start of 1943. Liberation of Italy, liberation of France, Allies in Germany, taking Konigsberg I think was another?

In our game you triggered some of these. I guess there is probably a variable factor as well but despite all their losses and the loss of NMOs the USSR morale didn't drop much below 80%.


......interesting........
i've also seen UK/US NM fall from the losses sustained in many failed invasions

as always, i guess, getting the balance right is the key

_____________________________

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Honours the game
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http://scwaw-rankings.s3-website.eu-west-2.amazonaws.com

(in reply to petedalby)
Post #: 518
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/1/2021 3:43:31 PM   
The Land

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: petedalby

quote:

Pete is tough to beat as the Axis so I'm looking forward to a challenging game.


It's the kiss of death!

Jackmck (Allies) beats petedalby (Axis) in June 44. Terrific Allied strategy by Jackmck to boost USSR morale at every opportunity. Despite losing all 3 capitals, Leningrad, Stalingrad and most other NMO's the USSR refused to surrender.


I didn't believe it was possible for a nation to continue if all its capitals were taken. Did USSR really have all its alternates occupied as well as Moscow?


_____________________________


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Post #: 519
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/1/2021 3:46:16 PM   
The Land

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: EarlyDoors

......interesting........
i've also seen UK/US NM fall from the losses sustained in many failed invasions

as always, i guess, getting the balance right is the key


The morale events are one-off, all-or-nothing... if planned carefully I am sure it is possible to do a landing in France and Italy that raises Soviet morale while losing minimal troops. It's probably also possible once the US is in to find ways to invade and conquer minors thus getting the Axis a unit morale penalty for a defeated ally, at little cost...


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Post #: 520
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/1/2021 4:36:20 PM   
petedalby

 

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quote:

I didn't believe it was possible for a nation to continue if all its capitals were taken. Did USSR really have all its alternates occupied as well as Moscow?


Most definitely. It's happened to me twice now with the USSR. I even posted a query on the first occasion - https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4956257

(in reply to The Land)
Post #: 521
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/1/2021 9:11:36 PM   
LoneRunner

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: The Land

I didn't believe it was possible for a nation to continue if all its capitals were taken. Did USSR really have all its alternates occupied as well as Moscow?



Here's a quote from the manual regarding surrender:

Section 7.5 Surrendering Nations

Every turn after a country loses its Capital (or last Capital if it had more
than one) there will be a check to see if it carries on fighting. The chance
that it will carry on fighting depends on the number of units it has left
within its own borders, as follows:
§§ Major Country Surrender = 3% * number of remaining units within the
home country
§§ Minor Country Surrender = 6% * number of remaining units within the
home country


So, if USSR has 34 units left within the home country, it should not surrender. However, in one game I had over 40 land units and the USSR surrendered anyway after Perm fell. So my guess is that surrender is based on a combination of capitals lost, number of units within the home country, morale, and luck. Be good to know how that works exactly.

(in reply to The Land)
Post #: 522
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/2/2021 10:40:03 AM   
The Land

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LoneRunner

So, if USSR has 34 units left within the home country, it should not surrender. However, in one game I had over 40 land units and the USSR surrendered anyway after Perm fell. So my guess is that surrender is based on a combination of capitals lost, number of units within the home country, morale, and luck. Be good to know how that works exactly.


If National Morale reaches 0, then they'll surrender. But that's tricky with the 'major' majors as they start with 100k+ NM. Had it happened in that case?


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Post #: 523
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/2/2021 2:59:28 PM   
EarlyDoors


Posts: 489
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From: uk
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Game started:

DmitryN (axis) v EarlyDoors (allies)

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Honours the game
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(in reply to The Land)
Post #: 524
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/5/2021 6:32:46 AM   
petedalby

 

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New ELO game started:

DavidDailey (Allies) vs petedalby (Axis)

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Post #: 525
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/8/2021 10:06:46 AM   
boudi

 

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Boudi (Allies) DmitryN (Axis)

DmitryN win.

From my point of vue The tactic of concentrating the Kriegsmarine in the far north where the Royal Navy cannot go to fight is too gamey.

DmitryN played remarkably well. He has exploited a loophole in the game remarkably well. Well done and congratulations.

< Message edited by boudi -- 7/8/2021 10:08:31 AM >

(in reply to petedalby)
Post #: 526
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/8/2021 11:08:05 AM   
rafaelmbaez

 

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Why the Royal Navy cannot go there to fight ?

Not sure why its "gamey" to fight there?

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Post #: 527
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/8/2021 12:15:25 PM   
boudi

 

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Why?

Because the passage to the north of the map is too narrow. We are stuck between the edge of the map and Norway. So two submarines can block a whole fleet without taking much damage. The next move Germany sends in its cruisers and battleships and sinks the British destroyers. Then U-Boots attack british CA & BB. Axis naval bombers based in Norway finish the job. 2 turns like that and the Royal Navy is forced to abandon the fight, and the USSR is no longer supplied.

It's Gamey because we can't miss the submarines, and besides, logistically, Germany could never have left its entire fleet in the Great North without a single return to the Baltic Sea. You need fuel, you need supplies, you need repairs. With the game you can leave your ships and submarines for 3 years without moving them.

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)

< Message edited by boudi -- 7/8/2021 12:18:37 PM >

(in reply to rafaelmbaez)
Post #: 528
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/9/2021 6:54:31 AM   
rafaelmbaez

 

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Hummm, I get your point, it happened to me in a Allied game.

I had to cancel the convoys, yes, the USSR is not supplied, but I took a very aggresive stance with UK and US using that MMP so the Axis had to divert resources to counter the Allies ( If I remember correctly, I invaded Portugal and entered Spain through there )

In any case, when the US enters de War, another gamey tactic is just defend Hawaii, and move the whole US fleet to the Atlantic. Combined with the Royal Navy, the German Fleet should be no problem, even in that narrow area.

And because its there, it cannot escape either.

(in reply to boudi)
Post #: 529
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/9/2021 8:28:32 AM   
boudi

 

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I for one cannot continue to play a game where exploiting a map construction prevents the land-lease from reaching the USSR.

One solution would be to prevent in the game engine the German ships and submarines from going too far north. force them to stay west of Norway.

(in reply to rafaelmbaez)
Post #: 530
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/9/2021 9:17:42 AM   
firsteds

 

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quote:

I for one cannot continue to play a game where exploiting a map construction prevents the land-lease from reaching the USSR.


Actually it seems to have become a common tactic. Axis subs and navy backed by a maritime bomber in Norway. But there are lots of counters you can try (practice in hotseat):

- turn off the convoy yourself for a few turns, keep the money and lower the NM impact on Russia from raiding
- invade Norway
- smash through with RN (upgrade AA and ASW and send a carrier in fighter mode)
- smash through with RN and US navy
- diplo Finland or Sweden

I don't think it is a map error or an exploit. There are lots of other bottlenecks. Yes, maritime bombers are powerful, but they don't like bad weather or strong AA.

(in reply to boudi)
Post #: 531
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/9/2021 10:00:11 AM   
petedalby

 

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For every tactic there is a counter. Attack the MBs with your Carrier based fighters. Build MTBs and Support Carriers - both excellent at killing U-boats. Blockade the North Sea from the start of the game to make it hard for the KM to get through.

(in reply to firsteds)
Post #: 532
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/9/2021 10:25:59 AM   
rafaelmbaez

 

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This is another thing... you should be aware when the Kriegsmarine leave Denmark, and make sure to intercept it with the Royal Navy.

UK have a sub that is perfect for it, the Salmon ?

(in reply to petedalby)
Post #: 533
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/9/2021 1:33:14 PM   
MrTomnus

 

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Game ended: EarlyDoors victory!

Axis: MrTomnus
Allies: EarlyDoors

Thanks to EarlyDoors for another great game, you outperformed me in almost every theatre but your masterful defence of the Soviet Union was the tipping point. As the Axis i was too experimental with my strategy(went for full annexation of France, misadventures in Syria with the DAK and building the Graf Zeppelin wasted precious resources and time) and the RNG gods were not in my favour with my diplomatic chits.

Hard lessons learned but a great game against a skilled opponent. Well done!

(in reply to rafaelmbaez)
Post #: 534
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/9/2021 10:11:08 PM   
Jackmck

 

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quote:

Actually it seems to have become a common tactic. Axis subs and navy backed by a maritime bomber in Norway. But there are lots of counters you can try (practice in hotseat):

- turn off the convoy yourself for a few turns, keep the money and lower the NM impact on Russia from raiding
- invade Norway
- smash through with RN (upgrade AA and ASW and send a carrier in fighter mode)
- smash through with RN and US navy
- diplo Finland or Sweden

I don't think it is a map error or an exploit. There are lots of other bottlenecks. Yes, maritime bombers are powerful, but they don't like bad weather or strong AA.


Best counter is to go offensive- attack Italy/France/Norway
I realize some defensive counters - very important to pass resources to the USSR in 1942. Here are some:
- buy an additional British sub (or two)- they complicate matters for the Axis fleet
- have the US come into the war with ASW/AA/NW level 2; combine them with RN and send them to destroy ships and subs. Buy a few escort carriers
- Build a maritime bomber for the Russians - it's been surprisingly effective.

(in reply to firsteds)
Post #: 535
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/9/2021 10:20:15 PM   
Jackmck

 

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quote:

quote:

I didn't believe it was possible for a nation to continue if all its capitals were taken. Did USSR really have all its alternates occupied as well as Moscow?


Most definitely. It's happened to me twice now with the USSR. I even posted a query on the first occasion - https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4956257


On the last turn, Germany also had all of its capitals occupied- actually held only one city (stettin?) but did not surrender yet. Also its NM was still quite high.
Japan's NM falls as the Allies advance- so does Italy quite drastically- but Germany's NM doesn't seem to fall that much ever despite the surrender of Italy, Hungary, etc., and the liberation of France, Netherlands, etc. Seems quite odd.

In our game, i think the USSR should have surrendered, but with the Italy out and Japan in trouble, the Axis probably would have still have lost. I would have liked to see how that played out though. It is frustrating not knowing for sure- or even the parameters of randomness for Major Power surrenders.

(in reply to petedalby)
Post #: 536
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/10/2021 4:54:21 AM   
EarlyDoors


Posts: 489
Joined: 12/16/2018
From: uk
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrTomnus

Game ended: EarlyDoors victory!

Axis: MrTomnus
Allies: EarlyDoors

Thanks to EarlyDoors for another great game, you outperformed me in almost every theatre but your masterful defence of the Soviet Union was the tipping point. As the Axis i was too experimental with my strategy(went for full annexation of France, misadventures in Syria with the DAK and building the Graf Zeppelin wasted precious resources and time) and the RNG gods were not in my favour with my diplomatic chits.

Hard lessons learned but a great game against a skilled opponent. Well done!


Thanks Mr Tomnus, I really enjoyed it and thanks for playing on. 1945 must have been tough ~ lots of destruction
The game followed history very closely other than full france and japanese invasion of australia
First time I've seen the atomic bombs too

_____________________________

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Honours the game
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Post #: 537
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/10/2021 11:32:02 PM   
DmitryN

 

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2 New ELO game started:
Wassmuss (Allies) vs DimitryN (Axis)
and
Rudolf Steiner (Allies) vs DimitryN (Axis)

(in reply to EarlyDoors)
Post #: 538
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/11/2021 3:43:37 PM   
SchukiSchu

 

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Hello! I'm completely new to multiplayer but I'd love to play! I have 300 hours of singleplayer experience as Axis and know all the mechanics of the game, which is something, I guess. Anybody here wants to give me my first crushing defeat? I would prefer to play as Axis and I can promise one round per day. I have a question, though: Isn't playing the Allies a lot easier than playing as Axis? You don't seem to take that into account for your point system, or do you? Or maybe I'm completely mistaken and they're equally hard?

(in reply to DmitryN)
Post #: 539
RE: Updated rankings as at 18 Jan 2021 - 7/12/2021 1:34:17 PM   
firsteds

 

Posts: 35
Joined: 3/24/2021
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New ELO game started:

Schuki92 (Axis) v firsteds (Allies)

Note that Schuki92 is his official Slitherine user name and comes up on the PBEM screen. He posts here in the Matrix forum as SchukiSchu.

(in reply to SchukiSchu)
Post #: 540
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