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How is this for beginners?

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How is this for beginners? - 8/8/2020 2:04:10 AM   


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I'm trying to graduate from the Panzer Corps games and I'm wondering if WitW on easy difficult would be too much of a jump?

I've been eyeballing War Plan, but I like the detail of WitW more, but it's my understanding that War Plan isn't as complex?

The other game I'm also eyeballing is the Strategic Command WW2. I'm thinking this would be the most logical jump over WitW, but SC WW2 looks a lot like Panzer Corps but at a grander scale.

Wisdom, comments and suggestions welcome!
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RE: How is this for beginners? - 8/8/2020 2:39:01 AM   

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I never played Panzer Corps, but I did play the predecessor games years ago---Panzer General, Allied General even Fantasy and Star General. ( If they ever try to reboot Star General I might just give it a go for the sake of 1990s nostalgia)

The Strategic Command series is pretty much what it's designers profess it to be. "A game designed to hit the sweet spot between a serious PC wargame and something that would be generally a lot of fun to play for the casual gamer." It captures the ebb and flow of WW2 okay although in the particulars it sometimes falters. For example, given the one unit per hex limitation you end up with fleets of cruisers and battleships and carriers spread out over vast stretches of oceans, when in reality given the map scale such fleets easily could fit in a single hex. However, it is a quick-moving, breezy game once you get the feel of it.

I've yet to try War Plan, but it certainly looks like a step up from Strategic Command.

War in the West would clearly be a larger leap. It's got a heavy dose of intrinsic detail and a lot more to do every turn both in terms of planning, administration and moving. Lots of logistics too. The learning curve is not quite as Himalayan as War in the Pacific, but it's still steep. Maybe more like the Alps.

(in reply to zasgard)
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RE: How is this for beginners? - 8/8/2020 6:56:30 AM   

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ORIGINAL: Shellshock

The learning curve is not quite as Himalayan as War in the Pacific, but it's still steep. Maybe more like the Alps.

I agree. The learning curve is steep if you want to understand and to control everything. However, some features like the air war can be automatized. It can help you to focus on other things during the first games. In addition, the grand campaign is easier to play than the WITE one (less counters to control in the beginning). A party against the AI can help you to understand a great part of the mechanics before trying against a human.

< Message edited by Laits -- 8/8/2020 8:34:09 AM >


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(in reply to Shellshock)
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RE: How is this for beginners? - 8/8/2020 10:02:14 AM   

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From: Utlima Thule
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just to add to the above.

It is complex, I've been playing since release and still find I've been missing/misunderstanding something.

The good thing is to some extent you can situate yourself in that complexity as suits you.

At one end you can fully automate the air war, your role becomes that of the strategic manager who tells 8 AAF to concentrate on tank factories this week and your tactical airforces to prioritise bombing rail lines over close ground support. At the other end of that scale, you can determine which bombers hit which factories using which particular payload.

The ground war benefits from relatively low density. Even in the main campaigns by say Oct 1944 you probably are only dealing with 50-70 divisions and not all these need to be moved every turn.

I'd say the best way in is via the scenarios. The game suggests start with Sicily - I personally wouldn't. Even if you stick to the pre-game set up you have to handle air borne operations, naval assets as well as quite a complex little puzzle on the ground.

My suggestion would be start with the breakout scenario. Its all set up for the Cobra offensive, it'll teach you a lot about ground combat and the intersection of ground and tactical air. Then either one of the later 1944 scenarios where you will start to have to pay much more attention to logistics or (if you have Torch) one of the N African scenarios.

These are gems, low density but unit usage and placement really matters. And a pretty good crash course in how the logistics game works.

As you progress, the 1943 campaign is perfectly playable in a month or so vs the AI, esp if you either automate the air war or know what you are doing. If you get to early 1944 and find its all gone wrong, its no huge loss to step away and restart (or go back a number of turns). Most people have had to do this, as the linkages between 1943 (Italy and strategic bombing) and 1944 (France and tactical bombing) are something that you tease out with practice.

There is a lot of good resources both in the AAR section and the War Room (the tips and tricks thread is very good)


(in reply to Laits)
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RE: How is this for beginners? - 8/8/2020 11:29:28 PM   

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IMO opinion it's one of the best wargames ever made.

It can be challenging but equally the game can be played on a basic level without knowing what you are doing and that is how you learn. The air war can be left to the AI if you wish and you can focus on the ground war,

Warplan and SCWWII are great games, I own them but this game is where it's at. If you are prepared to learn a little and invest the time this game will pay you back in spades.

I bought it on release and I am still playing it now. It's that good.


I saw generals create imaginary "masses of manoeuvre" with a crayon and dispose of enemy concentrations, that were on the ground and on the map, with an eraser. Who was I to criticise them, hero as I was of a hundred "Chinagraph wars" of make-believe?

(in reply to loki100)
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