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Why does reloading air to ground munition take so long

 
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Why does reloading air to ground munition take so long - 7/7/2020 4:12:24 PM   
DracheTek

 

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Why does readying ground strike aircraft take so long? I mean even loading dumb bombs take ten good hours. What kind of process is this time simulating? Can any insider please tell me?
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RE: Why does reloading air to ground munition take so long - 7/7/2020 4:28:01 PM   
thewood1

 

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Might want to read this...

https://www.warfaresims.com/?page_id=3262

And do a search in the forums. Its been discussed to death, although the above article covers it. It might also be in the appendix of the manual.

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RE: Why does reloading air to ground munition take so long - 7/7/2020 5:09:40 PM   
thewood1

 

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Did a simple search on "sortie".

https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/searchpro.asp?phrase=sortie&author=&forumid=1154&topicreply=both&message=body&timeframe=%3E&timefilter=0&language=single&top=300&criteria=AND&minRank=0&sortMethod=r&submitbutton=+OK+

There are some good threads on sortie rates.

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RE: Why does reloading air to ground munition take so long - 7/8/2020 12:50:56 AM   
DracheTek

 

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Well, stop already. By the time I post this I am not insulted by either of you. resource is resource, thanks.
quote:

CAS and local air defense are the types of missions that are often cited for the historically quick turnarounds. The pilots are already briefed and flight plans are simple and known. They basically fly the same route to attack a target within a set geographical area, without completely changing their missions, weapon types and attack profiles.

If this hold true, why does "ground strikes with rockets and bombs" not eligible for this criteria cited above?

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RE: Why does reloading air to ground munition take so long - 7/8/2020 12:58:59 AM   
DracheTek

 

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Looked around database. database editors just did not add quick turnaround to most of RED side ground attack loadouts. Unfair

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RE: Why does reloading air to ground munition take so long - 7/8/2020 4:58:05 AM   
RoryAndersonWS


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DracheTek

Looked around database. database editors just did not add quick turnaround to most of RED side ground attack loadouts. Unfair


Please let us know which platforms you think are missing quick turnaround settings, there are threads dedicated to database errors.

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RE: Why does reloading air to ground munition take so long - 7/8/2020 6:21:22 AM   
DracheTek

 

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Don't worry, I am not trying to point out database problems this time, but rather wanted to discuss about aircraft sortie in general. From my very limited point of view, I think every single loadout containing "ONLY IRON BOMB OR ROCKETS" should have quick turnaround similar to what A-10 lineup have.

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RE: Why does reloading air to ground munition take so long - 7/8/2020 6:32:12 AM   
Rory Noonan

 

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Not a bad thought; some of the less capable services have longer turnaround times to model reduced sortie rates due to parts availability etc.

I suppose we need to consider whether a North Korean MiG-19 can reasonably be expected to be turned around in 15-30 minutes in the same manner as dedicated CAS aircraft like the A-10 in service with well equipped branches.

Maybe we could allow quick turnaround but set the intervals to be a bit longer? 1-2 hours?

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RE: Why does reloading air to ground munition take so long - 7/8/2020 10:49:29 AM   
thewood1

 

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I think there was a whole discussion about 30 minute turnarounds for simple bombs and rockets. It was generally agreed and shown that other than no loadout (ferry or something similar) that you can't sustain 30 minute turnarounds. Its in that list of discussions I posted.

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RE: Why does reloading air to ground munition take so long - 7/9/2020 12:08:49 PM   
ExNusquam

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: apache85

Not a bad thought; some of the less capable services have longer turnaround times to model reduced sortie rates due to parts availability etc.

I suppose we need to consider whether a North Korean MiG-19 can reasonably be expected to be turned around in 15-30 minutes in the same manner as dedicated CAS aircraft like the A-10 in service with well equipped branches.

Maybe we could allow quick turnaround but set the intervals to be a bit longer? 1-2 hours?

I would keep the quick turnarround times as they are; leave the database "operator agnostic." I think it might be interesting to see those numbers scale with proficiency, like OODA delays currently.

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RE: Why does reloading air to ground munition take so long - 7/9/2020 1:10:11 PM   
thewood1

 

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I also don't think we consider airbase capacity. If you have to turnaround four planes, its a lot different than 24 planes. Bottlenecks become critical eventually.

I'm not saying you have to add that to CMO. I'm just pointing out there are numerous variables we haven't ever thought of. There I think some level of abstraction is needed. The short is that I agree that current process is more than adequate. Keep in mind that Lua is there to handle any situation that requires more specificity.

< Message edited by thewood1 -- 7/9/2020 1:12:20 PM >

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RE: Why does reloading air to ground munition take so long - 7/9/2020 4:42:49 PM   
Gunner98

 

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quote:

Keep in mind that Lua is there to handle any situation that requires more specificity.


This is something worth exploring more in designing scenarios. My scenarios sometimes have squadrons re-deploying to forward bases and often there is a transport A/C linked to that which delivers ammo - but a Lua change to make that base operated at sustained rate as opposed to surge (10-20 hr ready time vice 3-6) may be in order to simulate minimal ground crew. It could be linked with perhaps a Special Action where the player can ramp up ready times at a cost in VP, or linking another transport with pers/MHE/tooling etc. Something to ponder.

B

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RE: Why does reloading air to ground munition take so long - 7/9/2020 6:19:49 PM   
thewood1

 

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I would rather ramp up maintenance issues and failures for pushing sortie rates beyond sustainable than just VPs. Again, not saying CMO has to have this as a menu option. Just as good to do it through Lua.

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RE: Why does reloading air to ground munition take so long - 7/9/2020 9:16:51 PM   
Rory Noonan

 

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Simulating random failures is actually quite easy to do in Lua; I'm surprised it's not done more widely.

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RE: Why does reloading air to ground munition take so long - 7/9/2020 10:05:17 PM   
thewood1

 

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I do it now and then just for flavor. Never tied it to sortie or at-sea rates. With detailed damage models, you could simulate engine failure, weapon failure, sensor failure, etc.

You don't really even have to go to that level of detail. Just have Lua increase the likelihood of the readiness state set to "maintenance" and unavailable.

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RE: Why does reloading air to ground munition take so long - 7/10/2020 12:29:46 AM   
Rory Noonan

 

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Some example code for pretty much all of those suggestions is available in Sakura Blue

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