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New Scenario for Testing: BF #2 Borscht on Bornholm

 
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New Scenario for Testing: BF #2 Borscht on Bornholm - 6/22/2020 9:03:44 PM   
Gunner98

 

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Next in the hopper we're back to the Baltic:

In this scenario you are playing the Soviet side and are charged with conducting an airborne and amphibious landing on Bornholm. NATO is on the backfoot so this should be a quick and relatively simple operation, but it’s essential that the island is seized and secured rapidly to allow for future operations.

Heavy use of cargo operations and load tables are included


Edit - this is version 5 using CMO Build 1146.1 and DB470

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Gunner98 -- 6/27/2020 8:45:46 PM >


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RE: New Scenario for Testing: BF #2 Borscht on Bornholm - 6/23/2020 1:56:58 PM   
CHM


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Is this supposed to use the very latest database (v484)? I thought that was a tad buggy.


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RE: New Scenario for Testing: BF #2 Borscht on Bornholm - 6/23/2020 2:25:17 PM   
Gunner98

 

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I upgraded it to v484 last night before posting - didn't realize it was buggy

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RE: New Scenario for Testing: BF #2 Borscht on Bornholm - 6/23/2020 2:31:50 PM   
CHM


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gunner98

I upgraded it to v484 last night before posting - didn't realize it was buggy


Hopefully I'm just talking out of the back of my neck. Which version of the game are you on? I have updated to build 1147.2 and yet my database is still at v483.

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RE: New Scenario for Testing: BF #2 Borscht on Bornholm - 6/23/2020 5:43:15 PM   
CHM


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On topic this time. A couple of points I noticed:

The Cargo Capacity (mass) is far too low to be of any use on any landing ship. For example,



Which means nothing big can be loaded,



Additionally, there is a discrepancy between the number of landing ships listed in the briefing and those actually present:

Briefing: Ropucha x1, Ropucha II x5, Alligator x2, Polnochny x14, Ivan Rogov x1, Aist x13, Pomornik x7
Reality: Ropucha x1. Ropucha II x1, Alligator x2, Polnochny x12, Ivan Rogov x1, Aist x12, Pomornik x1

Also, are the hovercraft supposed to start in the hovercraft pier nearby?

(in reply to CHM)
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RE: New Scenario for Testing: BF #2 Borscht on Bornholm - 6/23/2020 8:29:08 PM   
tylerblakebrandon

 

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Versions post 483 were removed starting with 1147.1 because of bugs per Devs in the 1147.1 thread.

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RE: New Scenario for Testing: BF #2 Borscht on Bornholm - 6/24/2020 12:38:12 AM   
Gunner98

 

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OK
Wasn't tracking that. I'll drop the DB version back down and send out another copy tomorrow.

Tks

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RE: New Scenario for Testing: BF #2 Borscht on Bornholm - 6/24/2020 11:10:09 PM   
CHM


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Found the missing ships.

They're here:



All invisible, but they whirr into life (still in the Atlantic) when ordered to RTB:



Sadly, the cargo mass issue remains even when downgrading to DB v483:


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RE: New Scenario for Testing: BF #2 Borscht on Bornholm - 6/27/2020 3:48:19 PM   
Gunner98

 

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OK

Finally able to get back and take a look at this. I've deleted the file in the OP.

Sadly the two latest versions I have are:

-V3 on DB470 with the Cargo working and the hovercraft where they are supposed to be - but none of the latest updates I made (and I scrapped my notes)
-V4 with the DB issues and the missing hovercraft - I no longer trust this version

So I'll backtrack and adjust V3 to what I can remember and do a bit of a cross check. May not catch all the changes but at least cargo is working which is critical.

When the next update comes out I'll keep to this DB version for a while to make sure. Should be out later today or tomorrow.

B

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RE: New Scenario for Testing: BF #2 Borscht on Bornholm - 6/27/2020 8:49:33 PM   
Gunner98

 

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OK this is an updated older version of the scenario - it is using DB 470 (that is when I built the original Baltic scenario and it has my baseline).

I tested using V3 and everything worked fine.
The messed up version was V4 which I had updated to the latest DB 484
This version is V3 plus what changes I believe I made earlier but without updating the DB. I may have missed stuff but that is what testing is for.

Once the DB version is fixed up I'll bring it forward to the latest but not until it is working.

Attachment (1)

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RE: New Scenario for Testing: BF #2 Borscht on Bornholm - 6/28/2020 8:35:25 AM   
KnightHawk75

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gunner98

OK this is an updated older version of the scenario - it is using DB 470 (that is when I built the original Baltic scenario and it has my baseline).

I tested using V3 and everything worked fine.
The messed up version was V4 which I had updated to the latest DB 484
This version is V3 plus what changes I believe I made earlier but without updating the DB. I may have missed stuff but that is what testing is for.

Once the DB version is fixed up I'll bring it forward to the latest but not until it is working.

Cool. Thanks.

(in reply to Gunner98)
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RE: New Scenario for Testing: BF #2 Borscht on Bornholm - 7/2/2020 4:17:14 PM   
RSMC

 

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Feedback on V5.
Action for airfield capture is checked for repeatable and unchecked for active - I think you want them reversed
Special action for heliport is not created
Victory points +10 for landing ships staying 4 hours are awarded only once per ship class, not for each ship
Ejected pilot logic is present for the NATO side only
If you want the player to reduce the risk for the Su-30s, should they be considered high value for VP count?
NATO subs shooting at extreme ranges, WP able to outrun almost all of them

Interesting lessons learned
I put many SAMs on a single ship, they unloaded as a group and then got taken out by a small number of HARMs. Worked much better with 1 SAM unit per ship.
Hovercraft don't have the range to reach Borhnholm, I sent them to Kolobrzeg to refuel then sent them on to Borhmolm. That worked fine with the timing.
After capturing Ronne port, docking damaged ships gave much better results for stopping flooding and fire damage progression.
Don't shoot all the anti ship missiles from the KUG - that will drive them to base to reload. Leave 1 unfired and you can use the KUG as an anti air escort for the landing.
Don't forget the 25th coastal missile unit at Kalingrad, those 36 Sepals can cover the entire area.

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RE: New Scenario for Testing: BF #2 Borscht on Bornholm - 7/2/2020 4:26:28 PM   
RSMC

 

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One more - check the settings on anti aircraft fire - I had WP shoot down several damaged / out of communication aircraft returning to base.

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RE: New Scenario for Testing: BF #2 Borscht on Bornholm - 7/2/2020 4:39:28 PM   
Gunner98

 

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quote:

One more - check the settings on anti aircraft fire - I had WP shoot down several damaged / out of communication aircraft returning to base.


Thanks for all that - you can override the return to port policy by hitting 'u' for un-assign but I'll change that setting so it doesn't cause problems. Not sure I'll change the AD setting though - trigger happy defenders etc. Will think on it though.

Cheers

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RE: New Scenario for Testing: BF #2 Borscht on Bornholm - 7/20/2020 1:38:27 PM   
Gunner98

 

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Guys

RL has overtaken me, I'll try and get back to this (and NF#41) next week. Any other points would be great.

B

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RE: New Scenario for Testing: BF #2 Borscht on Bornholm - 8/5/2020 8:17:06 PM   
AndrewJ

 

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I've finally found some time to give this one a try, so here goes!


SITUATION

We're up in the Baltic, and HQ has ordered us to oversee the seizure of the island of Bornholm, by airdrop and amphibious landing. Our large amphibious fleet is currently loading in the Kaliningrad area, behind two lines of screening ASW patrol boats operating across the mouth of Gdansk Bay. Out to sea we have a strong surface group based around the cruiser Grozny, and several smaller groups of missile boats, ASW patrol craft, ASW frigates, and minesweepers en-route to the Bornholm area. I've also got a number of diesel subs around Bornholm. Only one is a modern Kilo, but even the old Foxtrots and Romeos could be useful if a ship comes their way. Against NATO subs, however, they're probably going to be flaming (bubbling?) datums. Air assets (aside from the paratroopers' cargo planes) include a very nice force of modern Flankers, good numbers of MiG-23s, and MiG-27s, plus assorted reconnaissance, AEW, and ASW assets.

The enemy's disposition is uncertain. The area is well within reach of NATO air-power, but a lot of that may be tied up with heavy fighting in Germany, so it's not certain how much will reach us. German Kormoran-carrying Tornadoes will be a special concern. Surface forces may show up, but we should be able to see them coming in time to counter them. The main risk will be the swarm of NATO's almost-midget diesel subs that are sure to be infesting the area. And the mines...


THE PLAN

Night has just fallen, and my attack planes are not night-vision equipped. Realistically, any strikes and parachute landings will have to wait for morning. In the meantime, my amphibs are ordered to complete loading, form a tight convoy, and begin heading for Bornholm, escorted by ASW patrol craft and mine-sweeping helicopters. My major surface group will hurry south to meet them, and provide SAM cover from expected air attacks, while land-based ASW helicopters and MPA sweep their transit lane for subs.

Lesser naval forces (forward ASW patrols and missile boats) will do their best to operate in the approaches to Bornholm. They are essentially defenceless against aircraft or anti-shipping missiles, so Flankers and MiG-23s are assigned to provide some cover. I would prefer to reserve most of my planes for decisive action, so the CAP will have to be light to begin with. I am most concerned about the survivability of my minesweepers, which will need to operate unsupported and within sight of the shore for an extended period. They will be most vulnerable of all.
Bombardment of Bornholm is expected to begin at first light, with parachute assaults and amphibious landings scheduled to follow in the early afternoon, after my attack planes are ready for a second wave. I don't anticipate too much resistance on Bornholm itself, but there are sure to be counter-strikes as my forces arrive in the theatre and after they have landed.


OPENING NIGHT

Sub clashes, Part 1

Operations begin with CAP, surveillance, and ASW aircraft lifting off and heading for their stations, while ships and submarines slow to creep and listen for nearby foes.

Almost immediately, the captain of the S-212, a Romeo class sub, is startled to get a contact on a fast-moving sub 6 miles to his N, moving at 16 knots. There's no way he can catch it, even at flank speed, and he'd only deafen himself and make an absurd amount of noise if he tried, so he sticks up an antenna, contacts the Krivak that's operating in his region, and radios in a spotting report. Minutes later an SS-N-14 is dropping an ASW torpedo on the contact, and after a few close passes there is a satisfying thud, and the NATO sub (the Unicorn, a very modern British boat) settles lifelessly on the Baltic sea floor.

It's only a few minutes later that the ASW patrol group operating NE of Bornholm detects incoming torpedoes - this time NATO saw us first! The little ships scatter, turning to flee at flank speed, and blindly firing ASW torpedoes over their shoulders along the bearing to the enemy weapons. The incoming torpedoes are fast, but, fortunately, short ranged, and they run out of fuel before they can reach my retiring ships. As my captains swing about to re-engage they hear another explosive thud, as one of their torpedoes hits something. They continue to search the area cautiously, but find nothing, and they tentatively write it up as a kill. (Postwar records show that this was the patrol area for the Danish sub Nordkaperen.)


Bornholm Recce

By this point my reconnaissance aircraft are starting to get a better picture of the theatre. There's a single surveillance radar radiating in the centre of Bornholm, a very slow moving aerial contact over the island, possibly some sort of drone, and a surface contact west of the island, moving further west at 12 knots. There's the possibility that this could be a civilian ferry, or something like that, but a close pass by a recce Su-24 reveals it to be a minelayer. Probably empty by now, dammit...

My SEAD Fitters (which can work quite happily in the darkness) arrive at this point, and destroy the surveillance radar with a single well-placed ARM. The Su-24 swings around to make a low-level high-speed pass over Bornholm itself, trusting in speed and darkness to keep it safe. A Stinger gunner proves that to be unwise, wrecking the port engine, but the plane manages to get home and report. Analysis of the tapes and footage shows no signs of ships or aircraft at the port and airfield, which is a relief, and although there are some indications of ground units, there don't seem to be any major SAM sites or anti-shipping missile batteries. (Unless they're still hiding.)

Meanwhile, my distant shore-based Sepal missile batteries have fired a single shot at the minelayer, and when the massive missile finally arrives it plunges in towards the isolated target, and promptly malfunctions and misses completely. Fortunately, the minelayer turned on its radars to try and shoot down the Sepal, which allows the Fitters to fire a pair of ARMs at it. Those do not malfunction, and the hits start a fierce fire, which soon brings the wounded listing ship to a halt. It eventually burns out and sinks during the night.

NATO doesn't seem to be sending any aircraft into the region (other than the Bornholm drone, which is swiftly shot down), and my advancing ELINT MiG-25s and Bears approach the western limits of our area of operation. The Bear's radar operator spots a German frigate operating alone near the Neustadt naval base, but there don't seem to be any other NATO ships at sea yet. The ELINT planes also pick up the strong emissions of NATO AWACS planes, operating safely within their airspace, and ground based radars too. These are all beyond my assigned AO, and probably amid fierce fighting, so there's nothing I can do about them. I have to accept that my operations will be under observation the whole time.


Sub clashes, Part 2

NATO doesn't want my southern ASW group to feel left out, and they're fired on by torpedoes too. The captains know the drill, and they turn to flee while firing torpedoes, but this time the results are inconclusive. I manage to outrun the enemy torpedoes, which are slower but longer-ranged than the ones I encountered in the north, but none of my shots hit either. My ships turn around to start hunting again, but initially they find nothing.

Since NATO doesn't seem to be sending fighters into the region, it seems safe to send a Be-12 ASW plane into the area to assist. When it arrives and turns on its radar it immediately gets a small contact, which is much too far away to be the sub which fired on my ASW group. Another sub snorkelling? Floating garbage? The Be-12 abandons the ASW group and flies over to investigate, soon gets a sonobuoy contact on some sort of SS, and gleefully pounces on it and kills it with a single torpedo.

Meanwhile the other sub fires on the ASW group again, forcing me to flee and fire defensively once more. The Be-12 comes hurrying back, and picks up the submarine contact with a sonobuoy, just in time to hear one of my defensively fired torpedoes home in and strike it. Four down!


UPCOMING

Four enemy subs sunk within the first hour and a half is a very encouraging start. The worrying part is that the two subs which fired at me were completely undetected by my ASW ships before they attacked. If something like that happens to the amphibs, they won't be able to turn and run like ASW corvettes - there will be hits. There are probably more subs still out there, possibly along the route my amphibs have to travel before they get to Bornholm. I think I'll need to adjust the ASW patrol plans for my convoy, to provide more local direct screening on the route of travel, rather than trying to do wide barrier lines.

The other thing I'm worried about is the lack of enemy air activity. They've definitely spotted and ID-ed my aircraft as hostile, and even shot AAA and SAMs at them, but so far there's been no attempt to intercept me or give cover to Bornholm. I'd been hoping to start whittling the enemy fighters down in air-to-air combat, where my Flankers should have the range advantage, but I can't do that if they won't come up to fight. The ungrateful rotters...

(in reply to Gunner98)
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