Matrix Games Forums

Forums  Register  Login  Photo Gallery  Member List  Search  Calendars  FAQ 

My Profile  Inbox  Address Book  My Subscription  My Forums  Log Out

RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version Page: <<   < prev  32 33 34 [35] 36   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/3/2020 6:22:29 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 8206
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert


quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe


quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

'Major incident' declared in British city of Manchester to tackle COVID-19

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-health-coronavirus-britain-man-idUSKBN24Y0NU

Where was it first known? Why, Wuhan China!

OK, we know that Wuhan was the first place actually reporting it as a new virus. But calling it the Wuhan Virus plays into the narrative that they created the virus there and intentionally let it spread to the rest of the world. Let's not get into those conspiracy theories.


I only quoted what was in the article and copied the url. I will not tell people what to call it. I just was reminding people where it was first detected.


Oh, so "I only quoted" and "I was just reminding people" are the same? Your rhetoric is slipping.

I love how after any post where you call people names you then spam a bunch of posts together with anything to cover your tracks so the moderators won't notice. Very clever.

On the more relevant information here, Manchester and some areas in NW England have been locked down again. It seems the UK is now doing what is necessary early on and trying to stop runaway spikes in any area showing growth. The numbers aren't too bad yet according to what we know, which is good. Much less than some rural counties in the states. (Only using for comparison of data and response, not pointing any fingers).

According to a rolling seven-day rate of new cases of Covid-19 compiled by the PA news agency, Oldham has the second highest rate of new cases per 100,000 people out of all local authorities in England.

The seven-day rate in Oldham jumped from 41.6 to 62.8, with 148 new cases – behind only Blackburn with Darwen.

Other areas reporting notable week-on-week rises in Greater Manchester include Trafford (up from 31.3 to 38.1, with 90 new cases); Manchester (up from 18.6 to 34.3, with 188 new cases); Tameside (up from 12.9 to 28.4, with 64 new cases) and Stockport (up from 13.7 to 22.6, with 66 new cases).


In my home state of Oregon some rural counties have ben rapidly increasing. Umatilla county has 58 per 100,000 right now. That's high desert farming and ranching country.


I post article with information about Manchester and you call that spamming yet you turn around and post more information about Manchester. So you are a self admitted SPAMMER.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to obvert)
Post #: 1021
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/3/2020 7:23:36 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 8206
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline
quote:

Whole cities and towns to be tested in case of local Covid outbreak using 90 minute procedure
The tests will be used to check hospital and care home staff and patients, but there are plans for more than a million tests a day by winter


https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/08/02/whole-cities-towns-tested-case-local-covid-outbreak-using-90/

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 1022
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/3/2020 9:58:20 AM   
obvert


Posts: 14046
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe


I post article with information about Manchester and you call that spamming yet you turn around and post more information about Manchester. So you are a self admitted SPAMMER.


I believe I was referring to the string of posts you made after you told me "phuc ewe." It's pretty obvious. You and I know what you're doing, and it's just combative. I'm interested in the information and not your interest in "reminding people" where the virus originated, as if that was some unbiased remark. It's not.

In my post on Manchester I was fleshing out information in a readable format on the page rather than forcing someone to click into an article. I value those kinds of posts from others and so try when possible to pick relevant information to give context which someone can follow up by looking into the link. That's been consistent in my posts over time.

< Message edited by obvert -- 8/3/2020 10:00:39 AM >


_____________________________

"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm." - Winston Churchill

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 1023
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/3/2020 12:32:21 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 15437
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline
It appears you two have differing viewpoints you want to bring forward. Fine - unless something is really bad info, would you please just let it go and not challenge each other's every post?

I appreciate your inputs to help me understand why various groups of people are 'coming from' on their reactions to the virus. It appears that various cultural factors interact with the scientific info to give differing responses and to those groups, their responses are valid. We will not get to common approaches to the virus without being able to separate out the cultural memes. So let's hear from all without shutting them down on minor points.

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to obvert)
Post #: 1024
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/4/2020 6:30:11 PM   
obvert


Posts: 14046
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

It appears you two have differing viewpoints you want to bring forward. Fine - unless something is really bad info, would you please just let it go and not challenge each other's every post?

I appreciate your inputs to help me understand why various groups of people are 'coming from' on their reactions to the virus. It appears that various cultural factors interact with the scientific info to give differing responses and to those groups, their responses are valid. We will not get to common approaches to the virus without being able to separate out the cultural memes. So let's hear from all without shutting them down on minor points.


Sorry. If someone writes "Phuc Ewe" that's not a differing viewpoint. That doesn't belong here. It's just that kind of attitude to disagreement that is so prevalent in today's cultural climate which is making any sort of unified effort against this common threat difficult.

I've never used explicative directed at another mer here and I won't. Disagreement is fine. It isn't and shouldn't be personal unless another member goes there, and at that point I'll call them out.

_____________________________

"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm." - Winston Churchill

(in reply to BBfanboy)
Post #: 1025
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/4/2020 7:25:44 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 8206
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline
Who wrote "Phuc Ewe" here?

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to obvert)
Post #: 1026
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/4/2020 7:28:47 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 8206
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline
As acid rain is curtailed, wheat gets less sulfur needed for tasty bread

quote:

With lockdowns due to the coronavirus curbing air pollution globally, sulfur deficiency could become even more acute in the U.S. farm belt, soil scientists said, although the effect will likely pale in comparison to gradually reduced emissions over the last 30 years.


https://www.startribune.com/a-sourdough-tradeoff-as-acid-rain-is-curtailed-wheat-gets-less-sulfur-needed-for-tasty-bread/571971482/?refresh=true

Not to mention that SO3 actually helps to cool the atmosphere! Then it fertilizes the plants that absorb CO2 then the plants feed us!

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 1027
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/4/2020 7:32:17 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 8206
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline
Parents unhappy with school options assemble learning 'pods'

https://www.startribune.com/parents-unhappy-with-school-options-assemble-learning-pods/572002422/?refresh=true

Apparently some professional educators are upset about this because it might take taxpayers , i.e. the parents, money away from them.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 1028
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/4/2020 7:46:49 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 8206
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline
'Too many are selfish': US nears 5 million virus cases

quote:

"We all know that alcohol changes your judgment," he (Virginia Gov. Ralph Northam ) said. "You just don't care as much about social distancing after you've had a couple of drinks. That's when the virus gets spread."


https://www.startribune.com/too-many-are-selfish-us-nears-5-million-virus-cases/572004952/

Maybe some of them want to spread something else, like the Egyptian Flu!

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 1029
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/5/2020 5:56:21 PM   
tolsdorff

 

Posts: 103
Joined: 12/12/2016
From: Breda, Holland
Status: offline
sad to see that the incessant denigration has forced Dan to leave the stage. The damage to the economy has become beyond all measure, almost unrepairable. ridiculous Angst for a barely lethal virus.

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 1030
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/5/2020 6:35:22 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 8206
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: tolsdorff

sad to see that the incessant denigration has forced Dan to leave the stage. The damage to the economy has become beyond all measure, almost unrepairable. ridiculous Angst for a barely lethal virus.


I agree. His last post and log in information:

quote:

Last Post 7/5/2020 5:50:45 PM
Last Login 7/5/2020 5:50:48 PM


I hope that those individuals are ecstatic about driving him an others away. Political censorship.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to tolsdorff)
Post #: 1031
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/5/2020 9:13:09 PM   
mind_messing

 

Posts: 2908
Joined: 10/28/2013
From: Glasgow, Scotland
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: tolsdorff

sad to see that the incessant denigration has forced Dan to leave the stage. The damage to the economy has become beyond all measure, almost unrepairable. ridiculous Angst for a barely lethal virus.


Know anyone who's been on a ventilator yet? Might want to ask them what they think rather than dismissing it out of hand.


quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe


quote:

ORIGINAL: tolsdorff

sad to see that the incessant denigration has forced Dan to leave the stage. The damage to the economy has become beyond all measure, almost unrepairable. ridiculous Angst for a barely lethal virus.


I agree. His last post and log in information:

quote:

Last Post 7/5/2020 5:50:45 PM
Last Login 7/5/2020 5:50:48 PM


I hope that those individuals are ecstatic about driving him an others away. Political censorship.


Oh please, spare us the hagiography.

Nor was it political censorship - his viewpoint was subjected to robust critique and found wanting.

Some of the discussions on the previous thread would be interesting to revisit given how things have panned out.

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 1032
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/5/2020 10:23:49 PM   
Sammy5IsAlive

 

Posts: 307
Joined: 8/4/2014
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: tolsdorff

sad to see that the incessant denigration has forced Dan to leave the stage. The damage to the economy has become beyond all measure, almost unrepairable. ridiculous Angst for a barely lethal virus.


I miss his posts and hope that all is well with him and his family.

This idea that he was somehow censored is well off beam though. Unless something happened that we are not party to there was nothing done by the moderating team to restrict his posting. So it basically boils down to a couple of posters that he was engaged in circular and increasingly acrimonious discussions with. There was nothing to stop him blocking their posts if it was bothering him that much.

To be honest I think it is more a case of him having completed three pretty intense and long term games/AARs over the last year or so and deciding to take a step back and concentrate on other things and enjoy the great outdoors this summer rather than arguing about Coronavirus. I hope that is the case and that it is working out for him.

(in reply to tolsdorff)
Post #: 1033
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/5/2020 11:46:22 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 8206
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing

quote:

ORIGINAL: tolsdorff

sad to see that the incessant denigration has forced Dan to leave the stage. The damage to the economy has become beyond all measure, almost unrepairable. ridiculous Angst for a barely lethal virus.


Know anyone who's been on a ventilator yet? Might want to ask them what they think rather than dismissing it out of hand.

I don't give a shyte. Especially when nursing homes are/were forced to take people seriously ill from Covid-19, the disease caused by the SARS-2 corona virus, first known in Wuhan China.

Besides, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one.



quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe


quote:

ORIGINAL: tolsdorff

sad to see that the incessant denigration has forced Dan to leave the stage. The damage to the economy has become beyond all measure, almost unrepairable. ridiculous Angst for a barely lethal virus.


I agree. His last post and log in information:

quote:

Last Post 7/5/2020 5:50:45 PM
Last Login 7/5/2020 5:50:48 PM


I hope that those individuals are ecstatic about driving him an others away. Political censorship.


Oh please, spare us the hagiography.

Why, feeling guilty?

Nor was it political censorship - his viewpoint was subjected to robust critique and found wanting.

Yes, it was political censorship. The constant denigration of sources plus the constant of "Your states should do it the same way my state did. Send Civid-19 patients to nursing home so those people will get sick and die." Plus the "You should have governmental healthcare where you are. There would be no illness then!" types of attitudes.

Some of the discussions on the previous thread would be interesting to revisit given how things have panned out.

In person?


Same attitude, no changes.

Why should we have more discussion like were previously done on the SARS-2 corona virus first known in Wuhan China? Then exported around the world, starting from Wuhan, China?

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to mind_messing)
Post #: 1034
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/6/2020 12:24:42 AM   
mind_messing

 

Posts: 2908
Joined: 10/28/2013
From: Glasgow, Scotland
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

I don't give a shyte.


That much is obvious.

quote:

Especially when nursing homes are/were forced to take people seriously ill from Covid-19, the disease caused by the SARS-2 corona virus, first known in Wuhan China.


quote:

Besides, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one.


Logical inconsistency detected.

If the logic for returning those with possible Covid-19 to nursing homes was driven by need to preserve healthcare capacity for a wider outbreak, is that not a case where the needs of the many are outweighing the needs of the few?

quote:

Why, feeling guilty?


No, just find your search for a martyr funny and quite pathetic.

quote:

Yes, it was political censorship.


Right. How? I mean in practical terms. I'm not a Matrix mod. They've not been involved, as far as I am aware.

quote:

The constant denigration of sources


Critique of evidence presented is always a part of any worthwhile debate. The quality of sources presented was quite variable and actual engagement was evidence was fairly limited.

quote:

the constant of "Your states should do it the same way my state did. Send Civid-19 patients to nursing home so those people will get sick and die."


As has been discussed earlier in this thread, we've a pretty solid idea of what has worked and what didn't.

quote:

Plus the "You should have governmental healthcare where you are. There would be no illness then!" types of attitudes.


The advantages inherent in a national healthcare system in the context of a pandemic should be obvious.

quote:

In person?


Preferably not until travel is safe again. Electronic mediums work just fine.

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 1035
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/6/2020 12:31:45 AM   
Sammy5IsAlive

 

Posts: 307
Joined: 8/4/2014
Status: offline
Having your views challenged is not censorship.

I guess if you had a situation where you had a single poster with on point of view and 10 posters with opposing views that jumped on them every time they expressed themselves you could have some kind of 'indirect' censorship but as far as I'm concerned that has never been the case on this thread or the previous one. There has always been a broad range of viewpoints and no 'orthodoxy of opinion' discouraging people in general and CR more specifically from expressing their views.

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 1036
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/6/2020 12:53:17 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 8206
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing


quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

I don't give a shyte.


That much is obvious.

quote:

Especially when nursing homes are/were forced to take people seriously ill from Covid-19, the disease caused by the SARS-2 corona virus, first known in Wuhan China.


quote:

Besides, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one.


Logical inconsistency detected.

You need to study logic again.

If the logic for returning those with possible Covid-19 to nursing homes was driven by need to preserve healthcare capacity for a wider outbreak, is that not a case where the needs of the many are outweighing the needs of the few?

That just exposed more people to the Wuhan China originating SARS-2 corona virus which caused more people to become infected with the SARS-2 corona virus developing CoVid-19. But then they died which helped lower the costs of taking care of those individuals.

quote:

Why, feeling guilty?


No, just find your search for a martyr funny and quite pathetic.

You should feel guilty. I have no need to search for a martyr.

quote:

Yes, it was political censorship.


Right. How? I mean in practical terms. I'm not a Matrix mod. They've not been involved, as far as I am aware.

In practical terms, the verbal abuse of the person and the person's sources.

quote:

The constant denigration of sources


Critique of evidence presented is always a part of any worthwhile debate. The quality of sources presented was quite variable and actual engagement was evidence was fairly limited.

Not when it becomes personal.

quote:

the constant of "Your states should do it the same way my state did. Send Civid-19 patients to nursing home so those people will get sick and die."


As has been discussed earlier in this thread, we've a pretty solid idea of what has worked and what didn't.

You are badly mistaken. There was no solid idea of what has worked and what did not. Even now, I doubt if the best treatments are being used.

quote:

Plus the "You should have governmental healthcare where you are. There would be no illness then!" types of attitudes.


The advantages inherent in a national healthcare system in the context of a pandemic should be obvious.

That is purely political.

quote:

In person?


Preferably not until travel is safe again. Electronic mediums work just fine.


Too bad that you do not want to meet in person. Especially where I live . . .


_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to mind_messing)
Post #: 1037
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/6/2020 12:54:58 AM   
Sammy5IsAlive

 

Posts: 307
Joined: 8/4/2014
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing

quote:

Especially when nursing homes are/were forced to take people seriously ill from Covid-19, the disease caused by the SARS-2 corona virus, first known in Wuhan China.


quote:

Besides, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one.



Logical inconsistency detected.

If the logic for returning those with possible Covid-19 to nursing homes was driven by need to preserve healthcare capacity for a wider outbreak, is that not a case where the needs of the many are outweighing the needs of the few?

At least from a UK viewpoint that decision appears to have cost far more lives proportionately than any of the other decisions taken by US politicians that we might disagree with. I do have some sympathy for our politicians/scientists/health officials getting spooked by what happened in the hospitals in Lombardy but in hindsight it was a colossal error

quote:

Plus the "You should have governmental healthcare where you are. There would be no illness then!" types of attitudes.


The advantages inherent in a national healthcare system in the context of a pandemic should be obvious.

I'm very much an advocate of universal healthcare. But when the archetypal example of that is in a country that has one of the worst death rates worldwide and other European countries with similarly nationalised health services (Spain/Italy/Sweden) continue to have worse numbers than the US I hardly think it is a position of strength to start criticising their health system



(in reply to mind_messing)
Post #: 1038
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/6/2020 12:56:04 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 8206
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sammy5IsAlive

Having your views challenged is not censorship.

I guess if you had a situation where you had a single poster with on point of view and 10 posters with opposing views that jumped on them every time they expressed themselves you could have some kind of 'indirect' censorship but as far as I'm concerned that has never been the case on this thread or the previous one. There has always been a broad range of viewpoints and no 'orthodoxy of opinion' discouraging people in general and CR more specifically from expressing their views.


When people discount the information presented because they do not like the source's viewpoint, then that is political especially when the person is directly or indirectly attacked.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to Sammy5IsAlive)
Post #: 1039
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/6/2020 1:06:57 AM   
mind_messing

 

Posts: 2908
Joined: 10/28/2013
From: Glasgow, Scotland
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sammy5IsAlive


I'm very much an advocate of universal healthcare. But when the archetypal example of that is in a country that has one of the worst death rates worldwide and other European countries with similarly nationalised health services (Spain/Italy/Sweden) continue to have worse numbers than the US I hardly think it is a position of strength to start criticising their health system




Concern over costs for users exist in the US system that are not present to the same extent in the Spain/Italy/Sweden systems.

In many ways the already existing problem (which was already fairly serious) has worsened over the past few months with rising unemployment - both in terms of losing work related health benefits and financial concerns.




(in reply to Sammy5IsAlive)
Post #: 1040
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/6/2020 1:14:21 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 8206
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sammy5IsAlive


I'm very much an advocate of universal healthcare. But when the archetypal example of that is in a country that has one of the worst death rates worldwide and other European countries with similarly nationalised health services (Spain/Italy/Sweden) continue to have worse numbers than the US I hardly think it is a position of strength to start criticising their health system




Concern over costs for users exist in the US system that are not present to the same extent in the Spain/Italy/Sweden systems.

In many ways the already existing problem (which was already fairly serious) has worsened over the past few months with rising unemployment - both in terms of losing work related health benefits and financial concerns.


It does not matter about the cost, people still receive care.

But your admission here about the economy is a change. More problems will come from the economy than this illness. You should research the Hong Kong flu, the numbers and how everything was shut down - or not.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to mind_messing)
Post #: 1041
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/6/2020 1:14:24 AM   
Sammy5IsAlive

 

Posts: 307
Joined: 8/4/2014
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sammy5IsAlive

Having your views challenged is not censorship.

I guess if you had a situation where you had a single poster with on point of view and 10 posters with opposing views that jumped on them every time they expressed themselves you could have some kind of 'indirect' censorship but as far as I'm concerned that has never been the case on this thread or the previous one. There has always been a broad range of viewpoints and no 'orthodoxy of opinion' discouraging people in general and CR more specifically from expressing their views.


When people discount the information presented because they do not like the source's viewpoint, then that is political especially when the person is directly or indirectly attacked.


That's going off on a tangent though? If your point is that politics came into a 'no politics thread' then yeah, clearly that happened - from all sides. I don't see where the jump is from that to censorship though.

I'm very reluctant to criticise somebody who is not here to defend himself. But I think it is fair to say that CR was hardly backwards in coming forwards about his own views of the media and the extent to which they could be trusted. From my own perspective it felt very much like he would frequently dismiss any information that didn't fit the 'everything's going to be fine' narrative as being hype from an untrustworthy and politicised media. That's as far as I'll go on him - like I said earlier whatever the differences we might have on an internet forum it is much more important to me that all is well with him and his family.

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 1042
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/6/2020 1:15:41 AM   
mind_messing

 

Posts: 2908
Joined: 10/28/2013
From: Glasgow, Scotland
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe


Logical inconsistency detected.

You need to study logic again.



Please, enlighten me as to my error.

quote:

That just exposed more people to the Wuhan China originating SARS-2 corona virus which caused more people to become infected with the SARS-2 corona virus developing CoVid-19.


Seeing as you're quite rightly concerned about exposing more people to COVID-19, you are supportive of ongoing lockdown measures then?

quote:

But then they died which helped lower the costs of taking care of those individuals.


Lower the costs for whom? Not quite sure of where the profit incentive is in this context.

quote:

You should feel guilty. I have no need to search for a martyr.


For what should I feel guilty?

FWIW, I do think you're searching for something. Not sure you're likely to find it on this forum however.

quote:

Not when it becomes personal.


With reference to specific posts, care to highlight where it became personal?

Please remember that this is the thread where I was compared with the likes of Mao and Pot, so be sure to not let double standards apply :)

quote:

You are badly mistaken. There was no solid idea of what has worked and what did not. Even now, I doubt if the best treatments are being used.


Given the timescales and rate of spread, there was solid evidence of success from South Korea. As time passed, the evidence of what measures worked increased.

To highlight here, I do not want you to be confused by bringing treatment regimes into the discussion. I am focusing on public health measures.

quote:

Too bad that you do not want to meet in person. Especially where I live . . .


If you are looking to meet people via the internet, there are much better websites to do that on than AE.



< Message edited by mind_messing -- 8/6/2020 1:17:01 AM >

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 1043
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/6/2020 1:17:54 AM   
Sammy5IsAlive

 

Posts: 307
Joined: 8/4/2014
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sammy5IsAlive


I'm very much an advocate of universal healthcare. But when the archetypal example of that is in a country that has one of the worst death rates worldwide and other European countries with similarly nationalised health services (Spain/Italy/Sweden) continue to have worse numbers than the US I hardly think it is a position of strength to start criticising their health system




Concern over costs for users exist in the US system that are not present to the same extent in the Spain/Italy/Sweden systems.

In many ways the already existing problem (which was already fairly serious) has worsened over the past few months with rising unemployment - both in terms of losing work related health benefits and financial concerns.




That's my point though - so far at least those cost concerns haven't resulted in higher death rates than those continental European countries. In the UK where there are precisely zero cost concerns from seeking medical attention we have one of the worst death rates in the world.

(in reply to mind_messing)
Post #: 1044
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/6/2020 1:20:50 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 8206
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sammy5IsAlive


quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sammy5IsAlive


I'm very much an advocate of universal healthcare. But when the archetypal example of that is in a country that has one of the worst death rates worldwide and other European countries with similarly nationalised health services (Spain/Italy/Sweden) continue to have worse numbers than the US I hardly think it is a position of strength to start criticising their health system




Concern over costs for users exist in the US system that are not present to the same extent in the Spain/Italy/Sweden systems.

In many ways the already existing problem (which was already fairly serious) has worsened over the past few months with rising unemployment - both in terms of losing work related health benefits and financial concerns.




That's my point though - so far at least those cost concerns haven't resulted in higher death rates than those continental European countries. In the UK where there are precisely zero cost concerns from seeking medical attention we have one of the worst death rates in the world.



US Governmental healthcare. Look up the VA healthcare systems and its problems. Enough said there.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to Sammy5IsAlive)
Post #: 1045
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/6/2020 1:25:42 AM   
mind_messing

 

Posts: 2908
Joined: 10/28/2013
From: Glasgow, Scotland
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe


quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sammy5IsAlive


I'm very much an advocate of universal healthcare. But when the archetypal example of that is in a country that has one of the worst death rates worldwide and other European countries with similarly nationalised health services (Spain/Italy/Sweden) continue to have worse numbers than the US I hardly think it is a position of strength to start criticising their health system




Concern over costs for users exist in the US system that are not present to the same extent in the Spain/Italy/Sweden systems.

In many ways the already existing problem (which was already fairly serious) has worsened over the past few months with rising unemployment - both in terms of losing work related health benefits and financial concerns.


It does not matter about the cost, people still receive care.



Demonstrably untrue.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1490134/

quote:

Overall, 16.9% of Americans report at least 1 financial barrier.


quote:

But your admission here about the economy is a change. More problems will come from the economy than this illness. You should research the Hong Kong flu, the numbers and how everything was shut down - or not.


Problems with the economy are solvable.

Unless we've figured out how to beat death, then we absolutely should be biased towards one side here.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sammy5IsAlive


quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sammy5IsAlive

Having your views challenged is not censorship.

I guess if you had a situation where you had a single poster with on point of view and 10 posters with opposing views that jumped on them every time they expressed themselves you could have some kind of 'indirect' censorship but as far as I'm concerned that has never been the case on this thread or the previous one. There has always been a broad range of viewpoints and no 'orthodoxy of opinion' discouraging people in general and CR more specifically from expressing their views.


When people discount the information presented because they do not like the source's viewpoint, then that is political especially when the person is directly or indirectly attacked.


I'm very reluctant to criticise somebody who is not here to defend himself. But I think it is fair to say that CR was hardly backwards in coming forwards about his own views of the media and the extent to which they could be trusted. From my own perspective it felt very much like he would frequently dismiss any information that didn't fit the 'everything's going to be fine' narrative as being hype from an untrustworthy and politicised media. That's as far as I'll go on him - like I said earlier whatever the differences we might have on an internet forum it is much more important to me that all is well with him and his family.



I think that's a fair assessment. I will add that this was the case even with information that was as impartial as it can get (eg. US Census data).


(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 1046
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/6/2020 1:27:37 AM   
mind_messing

 

Posts: 2908
Joined: 10/28/2013
From: Glasgow, Scotland
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sammy5IsAlive


quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sammy5IsAlive


I'm very much an advocate of universal healthcare. But when the archetypal example of that is in a country that has one of the worst death rates worldwide and other European countries with similarly nationalised health services (Spain/Italy/Sweden) continue to have worse numbers than the US I hardly think it is a position of strength to start criticising their health system




Concern over costs for users exist in the US system that are not present to the same extent in the Spain/Italy/Sweden systems.

In many ways the already existing problem (which was already fairly serious) has worsened over the past few months with rising unemployment - both in terms of losing work related health benefits and financial concerns.




That's my point though - so far at least those cost concerns haven't resulted in higher death rates than those continental European countries. In the UK where there are precisely zero cost concerns from seeking medical attention we have one of the worst death rates in the world.



US Governmental healthcare. Look up the VA healthcare systems and its problems. Enough said there.


For someone that was touting "the needs of the man over the needs of the few, or the one" on the previous page, I'd have felt that your greater concern should surely be the larger number of those on low or no income who have no health insurance, rather than the issues with the VA and the smaller population it serves.

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 1047
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/6/2020 1:29:08 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 8206
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sammy5IsAlive


quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sammy5IsAlive

Having your views challenged is not censorship.

I guess if you had a situation where you had a single poster with on point of view and 10 posters with opposing views that jumped on them every time they expressed themselves you could have some kind of 'indirect' censorship but as far as I'm concerned that has never been the case on this thread or the previous one. There has always been a broad range of viewpoints and no 'orthodoxy of opinion' discouraging people in general and CR more specifically from expressing their views.


When people discount the information presented because they do not like the source's viewpoint, then that is political especially when the person is directly or indirectly attacked.


That's going off on a tangent though? If your point is that politics came into a 'no politics thread' then yeah, clearly that happened - from all sides. I don't see where the jump is from that to censorship though.

I'm very reluctant to criticise somebody who is not here to defend himself. But I think it is fair to say that CR was hardly backwards in coming forwards about his own views of the media and the extent to which they could be trusted. From my own perspective it felt very much like he would frequently dismiss any information that didn't fit the 'everything's going to be fine' narrative as being hype from an untrustworthy and politicised media. That's as far as I'll go on him - like I said earlier whatever the differences we might have on an internet forum it is much more important to me that all is well with him and his family.


I also hope that all is well with him.

I don't think that he had the "everything's going to be fine" mentality but rather that "it's not here yet, so I will take suitable precautions and I will take more precautions if it gets into the area where I live." I was also in the last part and it is here so I am taking more precautions. I have also faced death and survived. So maybe I have a different outlook. Also, most of the deaths where I live are in assisted living facilities and nursing homes. I always said that the people there need to be protected. But one can not live in a bubble.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to Sammy5IsAlive)
Post #: 1048
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/6/2020 1:36:51 AM   
Anachro


Posts: 2502
Joined: 11/23/2015
From: The Coastal Elite
Status: offline
I live my life as normally as possible. I even went to Universal Studios Orlando the week it reopened.

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 1049
RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version - 8/6/2020 1:37:35 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 8206
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline
More news from California on the SARS-2 corona virus first identified in Wuhan, China which then spread around the world:

California’s coronavirus test result data may be flawed, top health official says

quote:

A steep decline in California’s coronavirus infection rate announced this week by Gov. Gavin Newson may not be accurate, according to the state’s top public health official who said Tuesday that the state’s data system used to process COVID-19 test results is marred with technical issues.


https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-08-04/californias-coronavirus-test-result-data-may-be-flawed-says-top-health-official

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 1050
Page:   <<   < prev  32 33 34 [35] 36   next >   >>
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> RE: OT: Coronavirus 2, the No Politics Version Page: <<   < prev  32 33 34 [35] 36   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

0.221