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Task Organization of 12th Panzerdivision as of 1989

 
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Task Organization of 12th Panzerdivision as of 1989 - 3/30/2020 9:38:30 PM   
calgar


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Joined: 1/5/2012
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Hi,

I posted this over at FPC as well, thought folks might appreciate this here too. Task Org of 12th Panzer as of 1989.



Cheers

< Message edited by calgar -- 3/30/2020 9:40:52 PM >
Post #: 1
RE: Task Organization of 12th Panzerdivision as of 1989 - 3/31/2020 12:18:45 PM   
varangy


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Divisional level is too big for this game.

(in reply to calgar)
Post #: 2
RE: Task Organization of 12th Panzerdivision as of 1989 - 3/31/2020 12:54:08 PM   
22sec

 

Posts: 836
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From: Jackson, MS
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quote:

ORIGINAL: varangy

Divisional level is too big for this game.


I somewhat disagree. Sure we needed bigger maps and more units, and some form of resupply, but AB excels running large battles. Nothing beats commanding multiple battalions. My most favorite battle I ever conducted was two slightly under strength Soviet tank regiments assaulting a British brigade.

_____________________________


(in reply to varangy)
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RE: Task Organization of 12th Panzerdivision as of 1989 - 3/31/2020 2:27:39 PM   
varangy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: 22sec


quote:

ORIGINAL: varangy

Divisional level is too big for this game.

Nothing beats commanding multiple battalions.


And here we see multiple Brigades, not battalions.

Just the MBTs are 308 in this formation. (according to wikipedia)

APCs and IFVs 358, artillery pieces 140, ATGM carriers 36, Mobile AA 36.

Thats 878, plus at least 358 infantry cause we have that amount of APC and IFV so a total of 1236 units (which is not the total BTW). And its missing MPs and engineer units and also other stuff. Aaand this is only for one side.

Whats the amount the game engine can handle? 325.

< Message edited by varangy -- 3/31/2020 2:42:16 PM >

(in reply to 22sec)
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RE: Task Organization of 12th Panzerdivision as of 1989 - 4/1/2020 4:48:44 AM   
calgar


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Luckily, other ColdWar Enthusiasts might just appreciate having am actual tactical-level Task Org, because they know how hard they are to come by, especially for the German side.

I said nothing about how this is immediately applicable to Armored Brigade. Although we can see the Brigade Attachments as well.



(in reply to varangy)
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RE: Task Organization of 12th Panzerdivision as of 1989 - 4/2/2020 8:30:36 AM   
mmacguinness

 

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It is unfortunate that AB does not include the capacity to create an OOB to creat a hieratchy of units.

Also, for the larger battles, since (so far as I can see) units cannot be renamed, it is very difficult to keep track of which units the player would like to consider form a particular company, team, battalion, task force, etc.

While I like the game, there are many issues such as this that huge micro-mamagement

(in reply to calgar)
Post #: 6
RE: Task Organization of 12th Panzerdivision as of 1989 - 4/2/2020 12:07:47 PM   
22sec

 

Posts: 836
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From: Jackson, MS
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You can rename units.

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(in reply to mmacguinness)
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RE: Task Organization of 12th Panzerdivision as of 1989 - 4/2/2020 2:42:57 PM   
kevinkins


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And you don't need to put the entire division on the map at once. OOBs are just good starting points.

_____________________________

“The study of history lies at the foundation of all sound military conclusions and practice.”
― Alfred Thayer Mahan


(in reply to 22sec)
Post #: 8
RE: Task Organization of 12th Panzerdivision as of 1989 - 4/2/2020 5:50:32 PM   
mmacguinness

 

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Wow! NOW renaming works for me. Thanks 22sec.

The name of the game is Armored Brigade. That's just 1 level down from Division. Understanding Brigade, Battalion, Regimental and Company OOB's is very helpful in designing user scenarios.
And the Division OOB isn't very helpful unless you understand the OOB's of lower level units.

Calgar helpfully put up a Divisional OOB. I think some of the comments are maybe a little bit dismissive. Now, if anyone wants to, they can develop multiple scenarios using various elements of 12th Panzer as it was organized in 1989. What's wrong with that?


(in reply to kevinkins)
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RE: Task Organization of 12th Panzerdivision as of 1989 - 4/2/2020 10:30:25 PM   
calgar


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This one is easier to come by, but in case you are interested in a potential Task Org of a German Battalion during the 80s. This one is courtesy of the archives of the German Command & General Staff College in Hamburg and published in a Magazine. The text is German, but Task Org should be understandable. I kept the OPLAN for context. Bn in question is performing a defence.



since the Division Task Org was much harder to come by, I was only happy to share. It would have been the actual Task Org of the Division in Wartime. I only got my hands on it, because I did a lot of outreach to be put in touch with the former MP Company CO of shown MP Company and later Brigade G3 during that time period. Luckily, he kept fantastic records of lots of documents from the time. Such documents are near impossible to come by, also because Germany does not digitize old FMs for example or keep old copies around. they get destroyed and usually if at all, one copy survives for the federal military archive in Freiburg.



Cheers

(in reply to mmacguinness)
Post #: 10
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