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Battle of the Bismarck Sea Anniversary

 
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Battle of the Bismarck Sea Anniversary - 3/2/2020 12:31:27 PM   
Joe D.


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The Battle of the Bismarck Sea took place March 2-4, 1943 in the Southwest Pacific. Both the U.S. Fifth and Royal Australian Air Forces successfully attacked a Japanese convoy carrying troops and supplies to Lae, New Guinea.

Allied tactics included converting B-25 medium bombers into "commerce destroyers" by adding heavy machine guns to the planes' nose along with the use of "skip bombing" -- an anti-shipping technique already in use by the British and Germans.

Most of the task force was destroyed with heavy Japanese losses in both men and materiel, changing the course of the war.

However, the Allies were later criticized for strafing the survivors of sunken Imperial transports.


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RE: Battle of the Bismarck Sea Anniversary - 3/2/2020 3:57:36 PM   
BBfanboy


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Yes, they should have waited for the soldier survivors to get on the beach before strafing them!

I believe the tally was all eight transports and four of the eight destroyers, plus beaucoup of the Japanese fighters trying to defend the convoy. Some of these troops could have been the ones evacuated from Guadalcanal in January/February 1943. Things like this massacre can be bad for morale of the average Jojo from Tokyo (but now sitting on some Pacific Island).

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RE: Battle of the Bismarck Sea Anniversary - 3/2/2020 4:35:09 PM   
Joe D.


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

Yes, they should have waited for the soldier survivors to get on the beach before strafing them!

I believe the tally was all eight transports and four of the eight destroyers, plus beaucoup of the Japanese fighters trying to defend the convoy....


I like the B-25Js in the game; I set them at 100 ft. and turn them loose on IJN shipping.

However, the Hague Convention of 1907 banned the killing of shipwreck survivors under any circumstances, but that didn't stop the Germans at Dunkirk.

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RE: Battle of the Bismarck Sea Anniversary - 3/2/2020 5:31:09 PM   
spence

 

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quote:

However, the Hague Convention of 1907 banned the killing of shipwreck survivors under any circumstances, but that didn't stop the Germans at Dunkirk.


Check out 'The Laconis Incident' for a strange twist on the Hague Convention.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laconia_incident

< Message edited by spence -- 3/2/2020 5:32:09 PM >

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RE: Battle of the Bismarck Sea Anniversary - 3/2/2020 7:36:13 PM   
Joe D.


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quote:

ORIGINAL: spence

quote:

However, the Hague Convention of 1907 banned the killing of shipwreck survivors under any circumstances, but that didn't stop the Germans at Dunkirk.


Check out 'The Laconis Incident' for a strange twist on the Hague Convention.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laconia_incident


And a rescue attempt by multiple U-boats ends in unrestricted submarine warfare!

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RE: Battle of the Bismarck Sea Anniversary - 3/2/2020 8:26:50 PM   
Scott_USN

 

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Rules are forgotten by all sides. Just the way it is.

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RE: Battle of the Bismarck Sea Anniversary - 3/2/2020 9:48:43 PM   
BBfanboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Scott_USN

Rules are forgotten by all sides. Just the way it is.

I think if both sides follow the rule or see it as in their best interest, it can survive. But there were enough stories of Japanese fighters strafing Allied sailors in the water and the vicious way their army treated all "enemies" - including women and children - that there was little feelings of mercy for Japanese men in the water. War makes brutes of morally good men and women.

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RE: Battle of the Bismarck Sea Anniversary - 3/3/2020 12:36:02 AM   
RangerJoe


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I think that the Laconia carrying POWs should have been reported to the Axis and marked as such. It should then not been armed, nor carrying any contraband war material if it did carry any cargo. In fact, if there were any sick, ill, and/or wounded on board it may have been better marked as a hospital ship.

I remember reading about a Japanese fighter pilot who intercepted a Dutch transport aircraft going from the DEI to Australia. He looked inside and saw a woman with a blonde child whom I believed waved at him. He did not shoot the aircraft down.

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RE: Battle of the Bismarck Sea Anniversary - 3/3/2020 12:39:31 AM   
Scott_USN

 

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I always like those little stories Ranger, make you feel like can still have some faith in people. I read of the German fighter pilot that shot a B17 up so badly he finally gave up escorted them to English and channel so no one else would shoot them down and saluted them good bye.

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RE: Battle of the Bismarck Sea Anniversary - 3/3/2020 1:37:54 AM   
spence

 

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quote:

I think that the Laconia carrying POWs should have been reported to the Axis and marked as such. It should then not been armed, nor carrying any contraband war material if it did carry any cargo. In fact, if there were any sick, ill, and/or wounded on board it may have been better marked as a hospital ship.


There were some British soldiers on board as well as the Polish guards for the prisoners. It may or may not have had any contraband aboard. I think it was armed. Marking it as a hospital ship would have been against the laws of war such as they are.

S submarines sank a number of ships carrying US POWs captured in the Philippines in 1942

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RE: Battle of the Bismarck Sea Anniversary - 3/3/2020 5:26:36 AM   
JeffroK


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Plus USN subs sank the Montivedio Maru carrying Australian POW from Rabaul and another sank a Maru carrying Allied POW from Java including my Mothers cousin from 2/3 MG Battalion.

Such is war!

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RE: Battle of the Bismarck Sea Anniversary - 3/3/2020 6:55:08 AM   
alanschu

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Scott_USN

I always like those little stories Ranger, make you feel like can still have some faith in people. I read of the German fighter pilot that shot a B17 up so badly he finally gave up escorted them to English and channel so no one else would shoot them down and saluted them good bye.


This is one of my favourite WW2 stories. That they got to meet each other decades later was the cherry on that sundae.

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RE: Battle of the Bismarck Sea Anniversary - 3/3/2020 10:56:22 AM   
RangerJoe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: alanschu


quote:

ORIGINAL: Scott_USN

I always like those little stories Ranger, make you feel like can still have some faith in people. I read of the German fighter pilot that shot a B17 up so badly he finally gave up escorted them to English and channel so no one else would shoot them down and saluted them good bye.


This is one of my favourite WW2 stories. That they got to meet each other decades later was the cherry on that sundae.


I read about that as well. Another tidbit, the German fighter pilot had recently lost his brother. He was also a fighter pilot who had been killed the week before, I believe.

After the US and Filipino troops surrendered on Bataan, phone calls were made (possibly by a Japanese colonel) to various Japanese Army units to kill their prisoners. While a a few did, most did not. One even released 1000+ prisoners to fade into the jungle. At least one Japanese officer who was educated in the US even visited with a prisoner and was treated well while with that unit. He even wrestled with some Japanese soldiers.

In France, a US Army ambulance was lost - I mean, what do you expect from the medicos? It ended up at a German road block. The Germans gave directions to the Americans who returned to their lines. The next day, the ambulance returned - and delivered a case of American cigarettes to the Germans!

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


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