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[Resolved] 5P-42 Filin Laser-Dazzler is excessively effective

 
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[Resolved] 5P-42 Filin Laser-Dazzler is excessively eff... - 2/7/2020 4:15:04 AM   
Rawlinson

 

Posts: 4
Joined: 2/1/2020
Status: offline
I removed all weapon mounts with the exception of the 5P-42 from the Admiral Sergry Gorshkov. Fired 72 Tomahawks, 52 harpoons, and 8 NSMs simultaneously, and all incoming missiles were defeated in short order. During my due diligence research, I found nothing suggesting that the 5P-42 is anywhere near this effective, something isn't right with the mount performance model. I do enjoy the game, my compliments the development team.

Best regards

SIDE: US
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
8x Naval Strike Missile (NSM)
72x RGM-109I Tomahawk Blk IV MMT [Multi-Mission]
8x RGM-84D Harpoon IC
8x RGM-84G Harpoon ICR
36x RGM-84L Harpoon II



SIDE: Russia
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
152x 5P-42 Filin laser-dazzler




< Message edited by apache85 -- 2/7/2020 8:11:52 PM >
Post #: 1
RE: [Logged] 5P-42 Filin Laser-Dazzler is excessively e... - 2/7/2020 6:25:58 AM   
apache85

 

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Logged for investigation.

0013620

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RE: [Logged] 5P-42 Filin Laser-Dazzler is excessively e... - 2/7/2020 1:11:07 PM   
stilesw


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quote:

I found nothing suggesting that the 5P-42 is anywhere near this effective

David,

Valid point.

The weapon was developed to dazzle and incapacitate surface attackers thus the real result would be to lower a crew’s proficiency level. Unfortunately, currently there is no provision for having a weapon do this. Instead it will be modified to work on surface vessels only (as designed) and it will do only 0.01dp – no more wiping out swarms of incoming missiles.

Thanks for catching this.

-Wayne


< Message edited by stilesw -- 2/7/2020 1:12:31 PM >


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“There is no limit to what a man can do so long as he does not care a straw who gets the credit for it.”

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~Disenchantment, ch. 15 (1922)

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RE: [Logged] 5P-42 Filin Laser-Dazzler is excessively e... - 2/7/2020 7:41:59 PM   
michaelm75au


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Joined: 5/5/2001
From: Melbourne, Australia
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I thought it was also designed to interfere with optical guidance systems in missiles and aircraft? Or was that just an extra benefit?

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Michael

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RE: [Logged] 5P-42 Filin Laser-Dazzler is excessively e... - 2/7/2020 8:42:53 PM   
stilesw


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quote:

I thought it was also designed to interfere with optical guidance systems in missiles and aircraft? Or was that just an extra benefit?

Michael,

You are probably correct but I'm not sure how to accommodate that within DB3K without actually destroying the missile. I suppose it could be argued that screwing up the guidance is as effective as an outright kill. Perhaps a lower PoK rate would work. Currently set at 80% but a lower level could simulate potential loss of effectiveness for incoming weapon.

Open to thoughts.

-Wayne

_____________________________

“There is no limit to what a man can do so long as he does not care a straw who gets the credit for it.”

Charles Edward Montague, English novelist and essayist
~Disenchantment, ch. 15 (1922)

(in reply to michaelm75au)
Post #: 5
RE: [Logged] 5P-42 Filin Laser-Dazzler is excessively e... - 2/7/2020 9:09:56 PM   
michaelm75au


Posts: 12991
Joined: 5/5/2001
From: Melbourne, Australia
Status: online
Yea. In a sense, it would be acting like a 'counter-measure' by degrading the missile performance/guidance.

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Michael

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RE: [Logged] 5P-42 Filin Laser-Dazzler is excessively e... - 2/7/2020 10:10:05 PM   
Tailhook

 

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I would just count it as a countermeasure for optical seekers.

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RE: [Logged] 5P-42 Filin Laser-Dazzler is excessively e... - 2/8/2020 12:40:05 AM   
Scorpion86

 

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Joined: 2/26/2017
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quote:

ORIGINAL: stilesw

quote:

I thought it was also designed to interfere with optical guidance systems in missiles and aircraft? Or was that just an extra benefit?

Michael,

You are probably correct but I'm not sure how to accommodate that within DB3K without actually destroying the missile. I suppose it could be argued that screwing up the guidance is as effective as an outright kill. Perhaps a lower PoK rate would work. Currently set at 80% but a lower level could simulate potential loss of effectiveness for incoming weapon.

Open to thoughts.

-Wayne


Just my 2 cents: aren't dazzlers designed to blind enemy sensors? In a sense, aren't dazzlers a sort of optical jammers/countermeasures?
Perhaps they could act like radar jammers and DECM pods, only for optical sensors: giving a zone of uncertainty for units detected with optical/IR/laser sensors, and degrading the Hit Percentage of laser-/IR-/optically-guided weapons! (Basically what jammers or DECM pods do to radars.)

(in reply to stilesw)
Post #: 8
RE: [Logged] 5P-42 Filin Laser-Dazzler is excessively e... - 2/8/2020 12:46:09 AM   
Scorpion86

 

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On the other hand, dazzlers are also capable of damaging delicate imaging hardware: think of all those lenses, mirrors and prisms painstakingly designed to focus light on very delicate sensors. Now pump a laser through them in reverse. Sun and magnifying glass, anyone?
So, a sort of weapon that only damages imaging sensors? A sort of visual ARM?

(in reply to Scorpion86)
Post #: 9
RE: [Logged] 5P-42 Filin Laser-Dazzler is excessively e... - 2/8/2020 4:29:54 PM   
stilesw


Posts: 1344
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From: Hansville, WA, USA
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Some good comments above. Everything I found shows that the 5P-42 Filin laser-dazzler was developed as an offensive weapon to disorient, confuse and reduce the efficiency of the crews on surface vessels. However it does stand to reason that it could also be used to disrupt the optics/electronics of incoming aircraft and weapons.

So, for the next database implementation, it will have the following characteristics:

Surface ship (large relatively slow object), 80% PoK and 0.5 damage points.

Airborne units (small much faster objects), 10% PoK also with 0.5 dp.

This should eliminate the mass destruction of incoming missiles while still allowing for their degradation of performance via a kill. Also allows for a simulation of shipboard personnel effectiveness through slight damage to the ship itself.

Not a perfect solution but a little better than the present parameters in the database.

-WS


_____________________________

“There is no limit to what a man can do so long as he does not care a straw who gets the credit for it.”

Charles Edward Montague, English novelist and essayist
~Disenchantment, ch. 15 (1922)

(in reply to Scorpion86)
Post #: 10
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