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[Logged] AIM-54A Phoenix fired way out of range

 
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[Logged] AIM-54A Phoenix fired way out of range - 12/22/2019 2:24:33 PM   
stolowski

 

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I noticed several times during "Fire and Brimstone" scenario (Nothern Inferno) that my Tomcats fire off AIM-54As way of out their max range - as soon as ~130nm (max range as per DB is 100 nm), and it never reaches the target.

This can be observed with the attached save game and VF-14 Top Hatters #10 (Flight Apache76), by auto-engaging any of the Soviet aircraft around Banak airbase.

This seems to be happening only with the default WRA permitting maximum range.

Anyone else noticed this?

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< Message edited by apache85 -- 12/24/2019 1:15:27 AM >
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RE: AIM-54A Phoenix fired way out of range - 12/22/2019 6:33:09 PM   
actrade

 

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The first thing I do when playing a scenario is going into WRA and set all of my AA missiles to one below the max offered. In the case of the AIM-54 I set it to 90nm. I found my hit percentage went up a lot compared to the defaults in all scenarios.

(in reply to stolowski)
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RE: AIM-54A Phoenix fired way out of range - 12/22/2019 6:38:28 PM   
BDukes

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: stolowski

I noticed several times during "Fire and Brimstone" scenario (Nothern Inferno) that my Tomcats fire off AIM-54As way of out their max range - as soon as ~130nm (max range as per DB is 100 nm), and it never reaches the target.

This can be observed with the attached save game and VF-14 Top Hatters #10 (Flight Apache76), by auto-engaging any of the Soviet aircraft around Banak airbase.

This seems to be happening only with the default WRA permitting maximum range.

Anyone else noticed this?


Yes reset to WRA to your desired range. There are good reasons to fire at maximized range too like scattering groups etc. CMO gives option to do both. Read manual and websites. They explain some things.

(in reply to stolowski)
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RE: AIM-54A Phoenix fired way out of range - 12/23/2019 11:40:05 AM   
guanotwozero

 

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That's very true - sometimes hurling missiles from afar can discourage enemies from approaching, and at other times we want to leave it until they're closer to increase the PH.

However, more commonly we want to hit at BVR range, which still means a viable engagement envelope which isn't beyond the nominal max range. I suggest that's where the default should be.

(in reply to BDukes)
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RE: AIM-54A Phoenix fired way out of range - 12/23/2019 12:30:56 PM   
Sardaukar


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When game calculates missile launch with Max range WRA (and also with lesser range), it takes consideration the target course and speed. So if target is coming towards, launch is often outside range, since calculation is that target will be inside range if continuing same course.

In that case, if target chances course/speed during the missile flight, you are often SOL ($hit out of luck).

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"To meaningless French Idealism, Liberty, Fraternity and Equality...we answer with German Realism, Infantry, Cavalry and Artillery" -Prince von Bülov, 1870-


(in reply to guanotwozero)
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RE: AIM-54A Phoenix fired way out of range - 12/23/2019 12:44:59 PM   
guanotwozero

 

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That's something I'm not sure of:- if we use WRA defaults the game calculates an envelope based on factors like target approach speed. However if we set specific ranges, is that also a basis for such an envelope calculation or is it a simple distance trigger?

In any case there seems to be a problem that the calculated envelope is often unviable; in this thread there's a repeatable example of an AMRAAM firing at a slow turboprop (An-12 Cub) but still using extreme range resulting in range-adjusted PH of 5%. That clearly isn't because of a high approach speed.

(in reply to Sardaukar)
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RE: AIM-54A Phoenix fired way out of range - 12/23/2019 5:44:37 PM   
Sardaukar


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Setting 75% of max range as default does wonders. Max range is more of "hail mary"-shot often.

_____________________________

"To meaningless French Idealism, Liberty, Fraternity and Equality...we answer with German Realism, Infantry, Cavalry and Artillery" -Prince von Bülov, 1870-


(in reply to guanotwozero)
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RE: AIM-54A Phoenix fired way out of range - 12/24/2019 1:57:15 AM   
Rory Noonan

 

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Logged for investigation.

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RE: AIM-54A Phoenix fired way out of range - 4/19/2020 9:54:23 AM   
Dimitris


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I think this is no longer an issue witht he current build (B1142.2), can someone confirm ?

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