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DDR SAM Project - 10/18/2019 3:09:33 AM   
vettim89


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From: Toledo, Ohio
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Following the thread regarding integration of tactical level SAM into the IAD in East Germany at the end of the Cold War, I have developed this template using some good sources I have. Copy attached

All units that are mobile are marked as "tactical" either as DDR or Soviet. The tactical units are 90% using their barracks locations. It is safe to assume these units would be moved closer to the border in a war or near war scenario.

There are two issues that have come up. I saw a comment suggesting that a S-300 facility existed near Madeburg. Does anyone have a reference for this. The second issue is that there is no mention of the SA-11/BUK system at all. References suggest the system was accepted for service in 1983. None of my references indicate there were any of this system in East Germany. That seems odd to me. It was supposed to replace the SA-8 and SA-6 systems but multiple references show the GSFG equipped with the older systems. Anybody have an explanation for this?

Lastly the permanent Soviet systems in the DDR obviously belonged to specific units. I have failed in my attempt to identify which units so it is a bit sloppy. The DDR units are all grouped by RGT

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by vettim89 -- 10/18/2019 3:10:03 AM >


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RE: DDR SAM Project - 10/18/2019 9:57:55 AM   
Dimitris


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Joined: 7/31/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: vettim89
There are two issues that have come up. I saw a comment suggesting that a S-300 facility existed near Madeburg. Does anyone have a reference for this.


Yes, a single S-300PM battery was installed in Retzow in 1988. There's a few references to NVA vet sites around the web, plus at least one book dedicated to this: https://www.amazon.de/Fla-Raketenkomplex-S-300PMU-NVA-Bernd-Biedermann/dp/394247722X

In addition, a SA-4 battery near Magdeburg migrated to SA-12 during 1987/88 (the battery received only SA-12A/9M83 Gladiator TELs and missiles, as the SA-12B/9M82 Giant missile was still having teething issues).

quote:


The second issue is that there is no mention of the SA-11/BUK system at all. References suggest the system was accepted for service in 1983. None of my references indicate there were any of this system in East Germany. That seems odd to me. It was supposed to replace the SA-8 and SA-6 systems but multiple references show the GSFG equipped with the older systems. Anybody have an explanation for this?


IIRC the SA-11s (and many of the first batches of SA-12s) were given to units in the Ukraine & Belorussian MDs that would rapidly transfer westward in a crisis or conflict in order to augment the GSFG. So while they were not there in peacetime, you would almost certainly see quite a few of them in any serious situation.

This might help if you haven't seen it already: http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/graveyard/26912082/images/1377961541351.pdf


< Message edited by Dimitris -- 10/18/2019 10:02:03 AM >


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(in reply to vettim89)
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RE: DDR SAM Project - 10/18/2019 1:22:49 PM   
vettim89


Posts: 3509
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Toledo, Ohio
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dimitris

quote:

ORIGINAL: vettim89
There are two issues that have come up. I saw a comment suggesting that a S-300 facility existed near Madeburg. Does anyone have a reference for this.


Yes, a single S-300PM battery was installed in Retzow in 1988. There's a few references to NVA vet sites around the web, plus at least one book dedicated to this: https://www.amazon.de/Fla-Raketenkomplex-S-300PMU-NVA-Bernd-Biedermann/dp/394247722X

In addition, a SA-4 battery near Magdeburg migrated to SA-12 during 1987/88 (the battery received only SA-12A/9M83 Gladiator TELs and missiles, as the SA-12B/9M82 Giant missile was still having teething issues).

quote:


The second issue is that there is no mention of the SA-11/BUK system at all. References suggest the system was accepted for service in 1983. None of my references indicate there were any of this system in East Germany. That seems odd to me. It was supposed to replace the SA-8 and SA-6 systems but multiple references show the GSFG equipped with the older systems. Anybody have an explanation for this?


IIRC the SA-11s (and many of the first batches of SA-12s) were given to units in the Ukraine & Belorussian MDs that would rapidly transfer westward in a crisis or conflict in order to augment the GSFG. So while they were not there in peacetime, you would almost certainly see quite a few of them in any serious situation.

This might help if you haven't seen it already: http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/graveyard/26912082/images/1377961541351.pdf



Thanks Dimitris. The reference you linked is the primary one I used for the positioning of the tactical SAMS.

One note: I did not include regimental level short ranged SAM (SA-9,SA-13, MANPADS). That would have been a nightmare and made the map ridiculously cluttered.

_____________________________

"We have met the enemy and they are ours" - Commodore O.H. Perry

(in reply to Dimitris)
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