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Help a guy pick a game? - 8/21/2019 7:27:39 PM   
zasgard

 

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Hello

So, while I'm not new to wargaming, I'm new to operational gaming. I've played the Panzer Corps, Battle Academy games, but nothing on the level of the grander operational/strategic level games.

I tried Hearts of Iron 4, but I quit after a couple weeks. I didn't feel like that was the game to jump into as I found it overly complicated and way too much micro management.

Other than the obvious need for me (something not too terribly complex) the 2 things that are must haves for me are graphics and the ability of the game to track losses (not just 40 tanks, but instead a more detailed breakdown...what types of tanks...PzIIIe, Pz IVh, etc..)

As for the graphics, I don't mean gorgeous crisp 3D hottness, but instead the ability to turn NATO counters to something 3d (via mods I suppose).

I've been looking at Strategic Command: World at War and The Operational Art of War IV.

Not asking anyone to give any more info than a simple "this is best for you in my opinion", but if someone wants to expand on that, please feel free to do so and it will be appreciated.

Also, is there a game that you think would be a better choice? (that still has the things I'm looking for).

Really appreciate any assistance here.

Thanks

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RE: Help a guy pick a game? - 8/21/2019 7:42:22 PM   
MrsWargamer


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Weeeeeeell, you did mention "the 2 things that are must haves for me are graphics and the ability of the game to track losses (not just 40 tanks, but instead a more detailed breakdown...what types of tanks...PzIIIe, Pz IVh, etc..)"

I think you want to check out Gary's War in the West or if you like BIG, then War in the East.

But you get more battles and more settings with TOAW IV. That's my suggestion.

Or you might wish to consider some of John Tiller's titles. Potentially more specific battles might be your thing.

< Message edited by MrsWargamer -- 8/21/2019 7:44:48 PM >


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RE: Help a guy pick a game? - 8/21/2019 8:03:49 PM   
Zovs


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TOAW IV is the best Operational game out warts and all. It has stood the test of time since 1998.

Check out the AAR pages.

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RE: Help a guy pick a game? - 8/21/2019 9:29:14 PM   
zasgard

 

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This could just be my ignorant search/reading skills, but I didn't really see any mods for non-NATO counters for TOAW IV

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RE: Help a guy pick a game? - 8/21/2019 10:09:25 PM   
Zovs


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Look here:

https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4562063

Personally I only use NATO symbols.

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RE: Help a guy pick a game? - 8/21/2019 10:10:59 PM   
Zovs


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And here:

http://toawstuff.000webhostapp.com/

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RE: Help a guy pick a game? - 8/21/2019 10:12:05 PM   
Zovs


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Especially the last link or this one:

http://toawstuff.000webhostapp.com/

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RE: Help a guy pick a game? - 8/22/2019 1:37:45 PM   
wodin


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Decisive Campaigns Barbarossa. Amazing game.

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RE: Help a guy pick a game? - 8/22/2019 1:44:51 PM   
DonCzirr


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Pride of Nations.

Uses graphical unit counters on stands.

Forces used in battle and losses in battle are very detailed.

Best grand strategy game ever (IMO).


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RE: Help a guy pick a game? - 8/22/2019 7:21:17 PM   
altipueri

 

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Pride of Nations ??? Since when did that have Panzers? I must have missed something - and I'm an Ageod fan.


I think that TOAW4 is the best for the thread starter. Even if it is later discarded for something else it remains almost a measure to compare with all other games.


Edit: I didn't really cover the 3D issue, but there is a point that operational games are almost by definition above the point where individual weapons matter.

John Tillers Campaign Series has 3D counters. Command Ops is excellent but no 3d again.

< Message edited by altipueri -- 8/22/2019 7:31:05 PM >

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RE: Help a guy pick a game? - 8/23/2019 12:41:40 AM   
DonCzirr


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quote:

ORIGINAL: altipueri

Pride of Nations ??? Since when did that have Panzers? I must have missed something - and I'm an Ageod fan.


I think that TOAW4 is the best for the thread starter. Even if it is later discarded for something else it remains almost a measure to compare with all other games.


Edit: I didn't really cover the 3D issue, but there is a point that operational games are almost by definition above the point where individual weapons matter.

John Tillers Campaign Series has 3D counters. Command Ops is excellent but no 3d again.



Well - he gave tanks as an example for tracking losses - not as core requirements.

And ... the game goes to 1920 ... so armor technically is available in the last few years

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RE: Help a guy pick a game? - 8/23/2019 1:47:27 PM   
zasgard

 

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Thank you all for the suggestions.

I think I'll narrow things down to TOAW and possibly War it the East or West.

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Post #: 12
RE: Help a guy pick a game? - 8/23/2019 2:03:58 PM   
Zovs


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Just some notes from a fellow that has all 3 of the games you narrowed it down too.

WitE/WitW are very immersive and detailed games. Sometimes your head will spin and or hurt with all the fantastic details. They are limited in scope to only 1943-45 for WitW and 1941-1945 for WitE and only for those fronts. The learning curve is pretty steppe (pun intended). They do reward you for the longevity of playing them, but you could get burnt out on them when over exposed. That all said they are fine games.

TOAW IV is something quite else, I have been playing TOAW when it was first released by TalonSoft in 1998, and there are only two games I have ever and always gone back to time after time year after year. And those are TOAW and Steel Panthers. TOAW really does have it all (warts and all) its by far the best and most complete and playable and enjoyable Operational level war game out there, hands down none come close to TOAW. Yes, it does have warts but its the best there is in this genre. It really does have it all, you want platoon sized action, no problem, you want army size no problem, half day turns, seasonal turns, combat from the Civil War and the American Revolution to WW1 and WW2 and beyond no problem. That said it shines in two areas:

1) Battalion and Regimental level combat with ranged artillery
2) The community, although there are a lot of grumpy men here, they are a fantastic bunch

My 3 cents...

Been playing board war games since 1976 and computer war games since 1994.

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War in the East/War in the East II - Alpha Test Teams
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Post #: 13
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