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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> The Operational Art of War IV >> Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW

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Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW - 6/29/2019 8:39:07 PM

Lobster

Posts: 4175
Joined: 8/8/2013
From: Third rock from the Sun.
Status: offline

"There is no download for this product! As long as you have an up-to-date installation you already have 100% of the files you need. Check the Base Game's page to see if you're up to date. Your are allowed to have two activations at one time for one or both operating systems."

Price: $35.00

That much for some maps and scenarios that you can make yourself.

_____________________________

http://www.operationbarbarossa.net/

"There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy."

Post #: 1

RE: Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW - 6/29/2019 8:50:32 PM

76mm

Posts: 4382
Joined: 5/2/2004
From: Washington, DC
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster
"There is no download for this product! As long as you have an up-to-date installation you already have 100% of the files you need. Check the Base Game's page to see if you're up to date. Your are allowed to have two activations at one time for one or both operating systems."

Price: $35.00

That much for some maps and scenarios that you can make yourself.

I recognize that blurb as coming from the upcoming module for one of Battlefront's games. Actually, the module does not just include maps and scenarios "that you can make yourself", but includes quite a few new units and vehicles, for instance:

MAJOR FORMATIONS
German
Gebirgsjager Battalion
Grenadier Battalion 45
Aufklarung Battalion (Gebirgs)
Bunker � Antitank
Panzergrenadier Battalion 44 "B" (motorized)
Regimental Cannon Company (Pzg Mot)
Panzergrenadier Battalion (Dismounted)
Aufklarung Battalion (Morotized)
Pioneer Battalion (Gebirgs)
Pz Div Escort Company 44
Regimental Pioneer Company (Motorized)
Sturmgeschutz Battalion 44 (45 StuG)
Self-Propelled Flak Battery (Medium)
Self-Propelled Flak Battery
German Luftwafte Field Division
Flakpanzer Company (Light)
Panzergrenadier Battalion 44 "B" Motorized
Jaeger Battalion "L"
Fusilier Battalion "L"
Pioneer Battalion
Panzerjager Battalion (Mixed)
Flak Battery Heavy
Flak Company Medium
Flak Battery Light
Self-Propelled Howitzer Battery (Heavy)
German Waffen SS
Aufklarung Battalion (Motorized)
Panzergrenadier Battalion (Dismounted)
Regimental Pioneer Company (Motorized)
Sturmgeschutz Battalion 44,45 StuG
Regimental Cannon Company (Pzg Motorized)
Pioneer Battalion (Motorized)
Flak Battery (Heavy)
Flak Company (Light)
Pz Division Escort Company 44
Self Propelled Flak Battery (Medium)
Self Propelled Flak Battery
Grenadier Battalion 43 "A"
Gebirgsjager Battalion
Panzerjager Company
Panzerjager Company (Armored)
Pioneer Company
Allied (United States, India, Free France, Brazil, and South Africa)
Note: Formation types available will vary with nationality. Organizational and equipment differences between the Commonwealth nations are also simulated.

Indian Army
Infantry Battalion (lorried)
Infantry Battalion
Infantry Battalion (Reinforced)
Recce Regiment
Air Landing Battalion
Recce Regiment
Machinegun Battalion
Support Group
Engineer Company (field)
Antitank Battery
Antiaircraft Battery
Antiaircraft Battery (self propelled)
Infantry Batlion Reinforced Armoured
Bunker � 6pdr
South African Army
Motor Battalion
Infantry Battalion (lorried)
Support Group
Engineer Squadron (field)
Antitank Battery
Antiaircraft Battery
Self_propelled Artilllery Section
Brazilian Army
Engineer Battalion 44
Infantry Battalion 44(lorried)
Regimental Antitank Company 44
Antiaircraft Battery(field)
Cavalry Troop
Bunker- M1 57mm
Free French Army
Infantry Battalion 44
Engineer Battalion 44
Chasseurs Regiment
Spahis Regiment
Regimental Antitank Company 43
Antiaircraft Battery
Bunker- M1 57mm
United States Army
Mountain Infantry Battalion
Mountain Engineer Battalion
Pack Howitzer Battery
Bunker � M1 57mm
British Army
Flail Squadron
Crocodile Squadron
Assault Troop
Armoured Regiment 44 "A" 5 Troop
Armoured Regiment 44 "B" 5 Troop
Anti-Aircraft Battery Self Propelled
Armoured Personanel Squadron
Recce Regiment (Late)
Anti-Aircraft Battery
Canadian Army
Anti-Aircraft Battery Self Propelled

TANKS, TANK DESTROYERS, AND SPGS
German
Brummbar (late)
Brummbar (mid)
StuG IIIG (late)
StuG IV (early)
StuH 42 (late)
StuH 42 (latest)
Wespe
Hummel
Panther A (late)
Panzer IIIM (flame)
Pz IV J (early)
Tiger I (latest)
Hetzer (late)
JPz IV (late)
Allied (United States, India, Free France, Brazil, and South Africa)
Note: Equipment available will vary with nationality.

M7B1 Priest
M24 Chaffee
M4(105) (early)
M4(105) (mid)
M4A3(76)W (early)
M4A3(76)W (improved)
M10 GMC (late)
M18 GMC
Bofors 40mm SP
Kangaroo (Priest)
Kangaroo (Sherman III)
Churchill Mk V
Churchill Mk VII
Churchill Mk VII Crocodile
Churchill NA75
Churchill AVRE
Sherman IB
Sherman IC Firefly
Sherman IC Firefly Hybrid
Sherman IIA
Sherman VC Firefly
M4 Sherman Crab
Achilles
Archer

HALFTRACKS
German
Sdkfz 10/5
SPW 250/1 Neu
SPW 250/10 Neu
SPW 250/3 Neu
SPW 250/7 Neu
SPW 250/9 Neu
SPW 251/2 Ausf. C
SPW 251/2 Ausf. D
SPW 251/16 Ausf. D
SPW 251/17 Ausf. D
SPW 251/21 Ausf. D
Allied (United States, India, Free France, Brazil, and South Africa)
Universal Carrier (Wasp Mk II)
Universal Carrier (Wasp Mk IIC)
AEC Mk II
AEC Mk III

Presumably they included all of the necessary files in a recent (free patch) that they distributed, dunno, so you just need a license key.

(in reply to Lobster)

Post #: 2

RE: Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW - 6/29/2019 10:19:41 PM

Shadrach

Posts: 722
Joined: 10/16/2001
From: Oslo, Norway
Status: offline

So the long-awaited Rome to Victory module is *finally* coming, nice. What's it been since they announced it, 3 years?

Still on the fence about it, it is a steep price for two campaigns and a handful of missions. But one thing I love about the CM games is the selection of weird/rare hardware to play around with.

I still play purely against the computer though, and in real time no less (heresy I know!), but have been thinking of challenging some human opponents. Though I suspect I will be badly crushed from guys having played the game almost exclusively for 20 years...

(in reply to 76mm)

Post #: 3

RE: Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW - 6/29/2019 11:17:06 PM

76mm

Posts: 4382
Joined: 5/2/2004
From: Washington, DC
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shadrach
So the long-awaited Rome to Victory module is *finally* coming, nice. What's it been since they announced it, 3 years?

The ever-lengthening development cycle for wargames is becoming a real turn-off for me. We're still waiting for Battlefront's first expansion for its East Front game, what, four-five years after the game came out?

But it is hardly only Battlefront...basically all games now launch with a very narrow focus and expand ever so slowly from there. Here at Matrix I really enjoyed the Flashpoint and Campaign series games and am eagerly awaiting fresh content, but has been years now... Not even going to mention titles such as *ahem* Steel Tigers.

I really don't mind paying for the extra content but waiting for it for five-six years is really frustrating.

(in reply to Shadrach)

Post #: 4

RE: Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW - 6/30/2019 12:07:27 AM

Bamilus

Posts: 480
Joined: 4/30/2010
From: The Old Northwest
Status: offline

Charging for patches or glorified patches is a no-no in my back

_____________________________

Paradox Interactive Forum Refugee

(in reply to 76mm)

Post #: 5

RE: Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW - 6/30/2019 1:04:15 AM

Lobster

Posts: 4175
Joined: 8/8/2013
From: Third rock from the Sun.
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: 76mm

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster
"There is no download for this product! As long as you have an up-to-date installation you already have 100% of the files you need. Check the Base Game's page to see if you're up to date. Your are allowed to have two activations at one time for one or both operating systems."

Price: $35.00

That much for some maps and scenarios that you can make yourself.

I recognize that blurb as coming from the upcoming module for one of Battlefront's games. Actually, the module does not just include maps and scenarios "that you can make yourself", but includes quite a few new units and vehicles, for instance:

Presumably they included all of the necessary files in a recent (free patch) that they distributed, dunno, so you just need a license key.

For something you have already paid for that's a lot to charge. Like they said, it's already there. You already paid for it. You don't have to mod anything because you already paid for it. Their words, not mine. "You already have 100% of the files"

If it's already there then all you are getting are some maps and scenarios. If that were not true then you wouldn't "already have 100% of the files".

_____________________________

http://www.operationbarbarossa.net/

"There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy."

(in reply to 76mm)

Post #: 6

RE: Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW - 6/30/2019 2:44:36 AM

sPzAbt653

Posts: 9285
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bamilus
Charging for patches or glorified patches is a no-no in my back

It seems like all the games need to go that way, doesn't it? It takes developers too long to get stuff done because they can only spend their spare time on it. For TOAW, in reality all patches, updates, scenarios and 'mods' are free and have been since TOAW I [I think, I've only been here since CoW so I'm not sure about that]. How non-business-like is that? No wonder they make no money.

(in reply to Bamilus)

Post #: 7

RE: Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW - 6/30/2019 2:52:50 AM

Rosseau

Posts: 2545
Joined: 9/13/2009
Status: offline

It is a shame, and after seeing AH, Microprose and others being ruined after going to large companies like Hasbro and EA, that doesn't seem to be a solution either. Then again, even Paradox seems a bit slow in releasing their endless DLCs; and they are the biggest I would guess.

(in reply to sPzAbt653)

Post #: 8

RE: Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW - 6/30/2019 3:14:56 AM

Lobster

Posts: 4175
Joined: 8/8/2013
From: Third rock from the Sun.
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rosseau

It is a shame, and after seeing AH, Microprose and others being ruined after going to large companies like Hasbro and EA, that doesn't seem to be a solution either. Then again, even Paradox seems a bit slow in releasing their endless DLCs; and they are the biggest I would guess.

Aye, the endless DLC for Europa Universalis IV. I think they have 61 DLC modules of one kind or another now.

_____________________________

http://www.operationbarbarossa.net/

"There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy."

(in reply to Rosseau)

Post #: 9

RE: Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW - 6/30/2019 3:54:27 AM

76mm

Posts: 4382
Joined: 5/2/2004
From: Washington, DC
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bamilus
Charging for patches or glorified patches is a no-no in my back

Sure, OK, but that is not what Battlefront is doing...this is new content.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster
For something you have already paid for that's a lot to charge. Like they said, it's already there. You already paid for it. You don't have to mod anything because you already paid for it. Their words, not mine. "You already have 100% of the files"

Well, this is new content that you have not already paid for. They didn't say that you have already paid for it, have they? They say that you already have the files, presumably distributed with their recent (free) patch. They are charging you for a license to use the new content.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster
If it's already there then all you are getting are some maps and scenarios. If that were not true then you wouldn't "already have 100% of the files".

I've already shown that this is incorrect. They are providing a substantial amount of new content. I've already explained about the files.

(in reply to Lobster)

Post #: 10

RE: Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW - 6/30/2019 6:04:36 AM

cathar1244

Posts: 797
Joined: 9/5/2009
Status: offline

quote:

Free French Army
Infantry Battalion 44
Engineer Battalion 44
Chasseurs Regiment
Spahis Regiment

One wonders if those developing that product realize the "Free French Army" no longer existed by 1944. Details matter.

Cheers

(in reply to 76mm)

Post #: 11

RE: Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW - 6/30/2019 2:04:50 PM

Lobster

Posts: 4175
Joined: 8/8/2013
From: Third rock from the Sun.
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: 76mm

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bamilus
Charging for patches or glorified patches is a no-no in my back

Sure, OK, but that is not what Battlefront is doing...this is new content.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster
For something you have already paid for that's a lot to charge. Like they said, it's already there. You already paid for it. You don't have to mod anything because you already paid for it. Their words, not mine. "You already have 100% of the files"

Well, this is new content that you have not already paid for. They didn't say that you have already paid for it, have they? They say that you already have the files, presumably distributed with their recent (free) patch. They are charging you for a license to use the new content.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster
If it's already there then all you are getting are some maps and scenarios. If that were not true then you wouldn't "already have 100% of the files".

I've already shown that this is incorrect. They are providing a substantial amount of new content. I've already explained about the files.

Well you go ahead and pay for a previously paid for product. Your money, not mine. I have every WW2 version of this game since the first ones. I've given them enough money. I suspect this is something Paradox is doing also, they just don't admit it.

BTW $35 is over half the price of the base game. WTF.

< Message edited by Lobster -- 6/30/2019 2:09:56 PM >

_____________________________

http://www.operationbarbarossa.net/

"There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy."

(in reply to 76mm)

Post #: 12

RE: Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW - 6/30/2019 2:21:38 PM

76mm

Posts: 4382
Joined: 5/2/2004
From: Washington, DC
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster
Well you go ahead and pay for a previously paid for product. Your money, not mine. I have every WW2 version of this game since the first ones. I've given them enough money...BTW $35 is over half the price of the base game. WTF.

I am wondering about your definition of a "previously paid for product"? This is new content...I don't see what is so complicated about that? It seems like you would complain about having to pay for a full license after using a demo version of software "because you already have all the files"?

If you don't think the new content is worth the price, that's fine, but that doesn't mean it isn't new content. I won't get this module because I'm not interested in the theater, but will certainly pick up the East Front module when/if it comes out.

(in reply to Lobster)

Post #: 13

RE: Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW - 6/30/2019 2:36:33 PM

Bamilus

Posts: 480
Joined: 4/30/2010
From: The Old Northwest
Status: offline

The issue is it's not even close to being worth $35 of new content. Its like Paradox when they release 10 skins for $10. Garbage patch/DLC policies from both companies.

_____________________________

Paradox Interactive Forum Refugee

(in reply to 76mm)

Post #: 14

RE: Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW - 6/30/2019 3:25:02 PM

76mm

Posts: 4382
Joined: 5/2/2004
From: Washington, DC
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bamilus
The issue is it's not even close to being worth $35 of new content.

Yeah, OK, I can certainly understand that sentiment, especially since much (but far from all) of the new content being added to CMFI has essentially been recycled from the other WWII titles.

Personally I don't really care what they charge; it is their business decision and if I think the content is worth it, I'll buy it, if not I won't... But for the life of me I can't figure out why it takes them several years to crank this stuff out?

(in reply to Bamilus)

Post #: 15

RE: Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW - 6/30/2019 3:35:05 PM

Lobster

Posts: 4175
Joined: 8/8/2013
From: Third rock from the Sun.
Status: offline

I envy them. At least their devs care about their game.

Luckily we have Bob trying his best. Otherwise we would have nothing at all going on.

_____________________________

http://www.operationbarbarossa.net/

"There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy."

(in reply to 76mm)

Post #: 16

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Something That Makes Me Thankful For TOAW