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Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always a w... - 6/8/2019 6:22:28 PM

MrsWargamer

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Just saying, I bought a couple of titles during the D-Day sale (many thanks), that started at 12 bucks and ended up like 7 bucks (Canadian).

Battle of the Bulge and Drive on Moscow are great little games.
I gave both an install and proceeded to clumsily play a few minutes of each.
I think they are potentially a lot of fun.

Compare them with some powerhouses of our hobby, such as Gary's War in the East and War in the West, and well, yeah, you get massively detailed, brutally complex, highly involved massive doses of time investment. Some serious manuals to read, and quite the printouts too.

I won't say they are not worth the money to anyone wanting them.
But, if I could undo my purchases, and I have made quite a few impulsive purchases too, I'd gladly say "nah, what was I thinking? I don't have the time factors needed any more than I have the table space required for my monster sized board game wargames.

War in the East is about as sizable a 'doable' challenge, as setting up the physical product Fire in the East.

I paid some serious cash to end up with War in the East just the base game purchase.
That game cost me more than Battle of the Bulge, Drive on Moscow, TOAW IV, and Kursk Battle at Prochorovka.

I've pondered Order of Battle DLCs (nice prices). But, it seems too similar in game style to my Panzer Corps collection.

Frankly, I think my money was better used on the smaller, more manageable/playable, more completable designs regardless of whether they might be lighter on hyper levels of detail and simulation.

I have War in the East and War in the West, as well as World in Flames, installed on my system.
To be honest though, the thoughts in my head to the effect "oh I'm going to get around to them eventually" sound like the same bullshyte I hear in my head when thinking of my large board game wargames.

I like the Panzer Corps design for the ease of getting into them.
I like the Battle Academy design, for the ease of getting into them as well.
I can sit down, and play the game, and likely have the current activity conclude with a completed game session.

When I first got into wargames in the 70s, a wargame wasn't something that used an entire day to play a turn.

I want more of what Battle of the Bulge or Kursk Battle at Prochorovka is offering.

I'm currently waiting on Steel Tigers. I'm worried that it's going to try and beat Steel Panthers a design that was polished for 20 years, on its opening release.
I'm not sure of the opening price, likely in the 60 buck range.
To be honest, I'd rather buy it the way Order of Battle is sold. A free base game, and a whole lot of DLC goodies for 10 bucks or so.

I'm beginning to shy away from the 80 dollar mega games.
I'm even getting shy with the 45 dollar games on sale for 35 bucks.
I'm getting tired I suppose, of mega designs that require mega time, and mega commitment just to begin playing them.

I've got more than a few titles I'd gladly sell if it was even possible.
But we all know, once registered, it's yours for good.

Part of me wants to throw out the printed manuals/books and delete the installers, and just pretend I never bought them.

Ive bought a number of the tablet-based wargames from Joni Nuutinen. The only real downside is once you get over the thrill of having handheld wargames, you realize, it's just no fun looking at a screen less than 10 inches in size. And carrying around a 10"+ sized tablet is a lot of weight in a purse.

Are you designers listening out there?
Stop pretending your wargame needs to be the most complete, most detailed mega experience.
I'd rather you made 5 decent sized simpler titles you could conceivably use a common software basis for, and charge 15 bucks for, than just one title trying to be perfect for 50 bucks. And it's basic math, 5x15 is more money too.

There are a LOT of good battles to choose from. I'd be getting Desert Fox from Shenandoah if not for the fact it's only an iOS title. I might grab Korsun from Yobo even though the battle isn't one of my favourites routinely.

I'm planning to start insisting on both Shenandoah and Yobo to release more content.
I'm going to see if Joni Nuutinen might do something to make his titles into a PC release.

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RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/8/2019 6:30:58 PM

Kuokkanen

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Yeah, I expected Gary's monster games to be like that and therefore I haven't bought them.

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RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/8/2019 6:34:00 PM

MrsWargamer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kuokkanen

Yeah, I expected Gary's monster games to be like that and therefore I haven't bought them.

Thanks dear, I like your opinions routinely, so I'm glad to hear I'm not just ranting :)

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Build models 20% of the time
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RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/8/2019 6:43:33 PM

Orm

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I would like something in between. I liked War in Russia, and Pacific War a lot. And in theory I should love the improved versions. But I fail to see that a commander of an theatre should involve himself, or herself, with individual pilots training schedule. And so on. Some of it should be delegated. And perhaps even forcibly delegated.

Anyway. Since my favourite game of all time is World in Flames, and the computer version of it, I suppose that I fall into the big and complicated group.

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RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/8/2019 6:54:16 PM

Orm

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Now that I think of it I like many of the games that are easy to get into as well. Like Panzer Korps.

And, currently, I am not all that eager to get into games that are hard to learn and begins with a very important first turn.

Therefore I mostly play games that I already know the rules for. So at the moment I play MWIF, Bombing the Reich, and UFO: Enemy Unknown.

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RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/8/2019 7:06:02 PM

MrsWargamer

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I'm looking forward to the upcoming release in the west from the Unity of Command series.

It's not complicated, but requires a player at least really try.

They're called GAMES and should never feel like WORK :)

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Build models 20% of the time
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RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/8/2019 8:08:34 PM

AndySfromVA

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I'm still looking for a turn-based American Civil War game that strikes the right balance between realism and playability.

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Post #: 7

RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/8/2019 9:03:16 PM

MrsWargamer

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You might wantg to check out the titles by Joni Nuutinen then.

This is a list of titles I have and want.

D-Day 1944
Eastern Front 41-45
Panzer Missions
Battle of the Bulge 1944
Demyansk Pocket 1942
Fall of Normandy 1944
Kursk the Biggest Tank Battle
Operation Barbarossa 1941
Rommel and Afrika Korps
Iwo Jima
Operation Market Garden

options to get
Korean War 1950
German Ardennes Offensive 1944
Falaise Pocket 1944 Allied
Invasion of Poland 1939
Invasion of France 1940
Battle of Berlin 1945
Fall of Stalingrad
Axis Balkan Campaign 1941
Battle of Peleliu 1944
Battle of Moscow 1941
Allied Landing at Anzio, and Battle of Monte Cassino
Battle of Leyte Island 1944
Battle of Okinawa 1945
Battle of Guadalcanal 1942
Third Battle of Kharkov 1943
Battle of Luzon 1945
Allied Invasion of Sicily 1943
Axis Crimean Campaign 1941-1942
Case Blue Panzers to Caucasus
Panzers to Lenningrad 1941
Finnish Defense 1944
Invasion of Norway 1940
British Offensive Second Battle of El Alamein
Crete 1941
Winter War Suomussalmi Battle
Battle of Guam 1944
Battle of Saipan 1944

Not bad eh,
He has some WW1 and Civil War and Spanish Civil war titles as well.
And he has free versions (20 turn durations), of everything he has I think too.
So it's not like your money is at risk for looking :)

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Play with Barbies 05% of the time.
Play with Legos 10% of the time.
Build models 20% of the time
Shopping 60% of the time.
Exlains why I buy em more than I play em.

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RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/8/2019 9:05:37 PM

Zovs

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One mans garbage is another mans gold.

I personally like complicated games, in fact I once played the board version of GDWs FitE/SE, granted it was solo and I took me 2 real years to go from June 41 to July 43, but it was a blast. I also have played both the board and computerized versions of SPIs WIE (DGs CWIE2) and have been a play tester for both GG WITE games and I love TOAW IV and Steel Panthers. The only board war game I still own is ASL.

I like challenges and hard ones not easy one off no brainers.

One mans garbage is another mans gold.

< Message edited by Zovs -- 6/8/2019 9:10:35 PM >

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Post #: 9

RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/8/2019 9:29:36 PM

ncc1701e

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrsWargamer

I'm looking forward to the upcoming release in the west from the Unity of Command series.

It's not complicated, but requires a player at least really try.

They're called GAMES and should never feel like WORK :)

Me too, looking forward to Unity of Command 2. In fact, I like to switch between complexity and fun to play. Alas, this is not always simple to combine them.

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RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/8/2019 9:44:25 PM

wodin

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Well I want super detailed. Not sure why you have a problem you mentioned way more lighter games than heavy duty so it seems you're catered for way more than those who want but and complex.

I say stop making all those lighter games and Panzer Joe is imitators and make some more in-depth wargames.

< Message edited by wodin -- 6/8/2019 9:46:27 PM >

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RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/8/2019 9:48:17 PM

TulliusDetritus

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I would say it's us who like "complex" games (and I don't think that's even true, I mean the complex thing) that should be complaining. Very few games like this, that's the truth.

And there are still tons and tons of non "complex" games. So I don't get it.

Why I don't believe the complex thing.

Scenario A, WitE. You push your counters (let's say the five divisions of 16th Army). Scenario B, you push the counters of companies, battalions, regiments, sappers, HQs... To me it's the same thing (in fact, tactical games are complex to me hehe).

Orm, re the pilot training thing in WitP, you're doing something wrong, because to me it's easy and quick: I mass produce what I need and want and only pay attention to the programme twice in a month. Only problem is the bloody mouse clicks.

< Message edited by TulliusDetritus -- 6/8/2019 9:50:13 PM >

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RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/8/2019 9:59:36 PM

MrsWargamer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: wodin

Well I want super detailed. Not sure why you have a problem you mentioned way more lighter games than heavy duty so it seems you're catered for way more than those who want but and complex.

I say stop making all those lighter games and Panzer Joe is imitators and make some more in-depth wargames.

Missed the Panzer Joe thing.

I don't think there is any shortage of complex in-depth titles out there.
The thing is, Gary's War in the East is the entire Russian Front start to finish to a point. How many times though, does the market need that sort of product. Gary essentially eliminated much of any reason to try.

Meanwhile, the Russian front is just a massive sum of potential important battles.
I think there's lots of room for a lot of lesser complexity product.

And the sad truth, is I'd have never seen the hobby grow out of the 70s if everything began as with Fire in the East level of magnitude. I began with Tactics II, not Fire in the East :)

We need more product aimed at the potentially casual wargamer, who might later become the hardcore War in the East type.

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Wargame, 05% of the time.
Play with Barbies 05% of the time.
Play with Legos 10% of the time.
Build models 20% of the time
Shopping 60% of the time.
Exlains why I buy em more than I play em.

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RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/9/2019 12:39:33 AM

Commanderski

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I like the complicated ones. It makes you think, sort of like chess. In the games War in the East and War in the West.the decisions you make on moving one division may have an affect 2 or 3 moves later that you didn't see and could collapse your whole front or provide an avenue to attack and penetrate your opponents front.

In these game you can make them as complicated as you want or simply push the counters around without really thinking too much.

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RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/9/2019 1:16:24 AM

IslandInland

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrsWargamer

Just saying, I bought a couple of titles during the D-Day sale (many thanks), that started at 12 bucks and ended up like 7 bucks (Canadian).

Battle of the Bulge and Drive on Moscow are great little games.
I gave both an install and proceeded to clumsily play a few minutes of each.
I think they are potentially a lot of fun.

Compare them with some powerhouses of our hobby, such as Gary's War in the East and War in the West, and well, yeah, you get massively detailed, brutally complex, highly involved massive doses of time investment. Some serious manuals to read, and quite the printouts too.

I won't say they are not worth the money to anyone wanting them.
But, if I could undo my purchases, and I have made quite a few impulsive purchases too, I'd gladly say "nah, what was I thinking? I don't have the time factors needed any more than I have the table space required for my monster sized board game wargames.

War in the East is about as sizable a 'doable' challenge, as setting up the physical product Fire in the East.

I paid some serious cash to end up with War in the East just the base game purchase.
That game cost me more than Battle of the Bulge, Drive on Moscow, TOAW IV, and Kursk Battle at Prochorovka.

I've pondered Order of Battle DLCs (nice prices). But, it seems too similar in game style to my Panzer Corps collection.

Frankly, I think my money was better used on the smaller, more manageable/playable, more completable designs regardless of whether they might be lighter on hyper levels of detail and simulation.

I have War in the East and War in the West, as well as World in Flames, installed on my system.
To be honest though, the thoughts in my head to the effect "oh I'm going to get around to them eventually" sound like the same bullshyte I hear in my head when thinking of my large board game wargames.

I like the Panzer Corps design for the ease of getting into them.
I like the Battle Academy design, for the ease of getting into them as well.
I can sit down, and play the game, and likely have the current activity conclude with a completed game session.

When I first got into wargames in the 70s, a wargame wasn't something that used an entire day to play a turn.

I want more of what Battle of the Bulge or Kursk Battle at Prochorovka is offering.

I'm currently waiting on Steel Tigers. I'm worried that it's going to try and beat Steel Panthers a design that was polished for 20 years, on its opening release.
I'm not sure of the opening price, likely in the 60 buck range.
To be honest, I'd rather buy it the way Order of Battle is sold. A free base game, and a whole lot of DLC goodies for 10 bucks or so.

I'm beginning to shy away from the 80 dollar mega games.
I'm even getting shy with the 45 dollar games on sale for 35 bucks.
I'm getting tired I suppose, of mega designs that require mega time, and mega commitment just to begin playing them.

I've got more than a few titles I'd gladly sell if it was even possible.
But we all know, once registered, it's yours for good.

Part of me wants to throw out the printed manuals/books and delete the installers, and just pretend I never bought them.

Ive bought a number of the tablet-based wargames from Joni Nuutinen. The only real downside is once you get over the thrill of having handheld wargames, you realize, it's just no fun looking at a screen less than 10 inches in size. And carrying around a 10"+ sized tablet is a lot of weight in a purse.

Are you designers listening out there?
Stop pretending your wargame needs to be the most complete, most detailed mega experience.
I'd rather you made 5 decent sized simpler titles you could conceivably use a common software basis for, and charge 15 bucks for, than just one title trying to be perfect for 50 bucks. And it's basic math, 5x15 is more money too.

There are a LOT of good battles to choose from. I'd be getting Desert Fox from Shenandoah if not for the fact it's only an iOS title. I might grab Korsun from Yobo even though the battle isn't one of my favourites routinely.

I'm planning to start insisting on both Shenandoah and Yobo to release more content.
I'm going to see if Joni Nuutinen might do something to make his titles into a PC release.

More drama.

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RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/9/2019 1:21:35 AM

MrsWargamer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: IslandInland

More drama.

Really, you came on the thread, to say that? Is your day really that dull?

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Wargame, 05% of the time.
Play with Barbies 05% of the time.
Play with Legos 10% of the time.
Build models 20% of the time
Shopping 60% of the time.
Exlains why I buy em more than I play em.

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RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/9/2019 1:27:24 AM

wodin

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Still don't get why you feel hard done by. Again way more wargames released on the light side than vice versa.

Really those who want more "complex" games aren't catered for rather than the other way round.

I wish we had as many games to choose from or look forward to as you do.

Sit down and write a list. One listing the complex games and another the lighter games. I know which will have way more games than the other

You should be overjoyed with how well your tastes are satisfied.

Honestly I'm sure your complaint has wound people up and I can see why.

There is no valid reason why you can possibly feel the way you do.

There is one thing though if you are correct. Can you point me to all these complex games being released or in the pipework. I'm obviously missing out on a whole heap of fun.

I count 6 legitimate hard-core wargames on main game forum (GGWITE, GGWITW, Command, TOAW IV, WITPAE and WiF) compared to 30+ on lighter side. Also as far as I'm aware about 2 complex games being developed. Countless light wargames though, check Steam.

< Message edited by wodin -- 6/9/2019 1:51:30 AM >

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RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/9/2019 2:07:51 AM

MrsWargamer

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Maybe it's the term 'wargame'.

I call it a wargame if it looks like a board game wargame.
Thus, to me, Call of Duty is just an arcade game. Lots of mindless shooting and hopping around.

As I said, once you achieve a War in the East grade of game, who really wants to see another mega Russian Front design at all? Well not me at least. Hey, if Gary's game isn't good enough, good luck beating it with some other person's design.

Not sure I know of all these myriad designs out there. Well WW2 designs I suppose in my case.

I also prefer turn based hex using, or close to it (areas are ok). If it's 3d and or real time, it's too close to an arcade game, and not close enough to a classic board game wargame. Close Combat is about my limit for not turn based.

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Wargame, 05% of the time.
Play with Barbies 05% of the time.
Play with Legos 10% of the time.
Build models 20% of the time
Shopping 60% of the time.
Exlains why I buy em more than I play em.

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Post #: 18

RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/9/2019 2:08:33 AM

Infierno

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrsWargamer

Gary's War in the East is the entire Russian Front start to finish to a point. How many times though, does the market need that sort of product. Gary essentially eliminated much of any reason to try.

You say that, yet WitE2 is one of the most highly anticipated wargame titles in development. There's nothing wrong with preferring lighter games, but I gotta agree that there's already a huge selection of light, introductory/intermediate wargames. I would like to see more hardcore wargames that cover lesser known conflicts in great detail. For every WitE, there's 15 different Strategic Commands, Order of Battles, and Unity of Commands, to the point that they feel pretty much interchangeable aside from art style and scale.

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Post #: 19

RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/9/2019 2:32:33 AM

Gilmer

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Well... to me it's like do you like steak or do you like chicken, or whatever. It's just peoples' tastes. I have played through War in the East once fully and played many of the smaller scenarios and have enjoyed them all. I have not played through War in the West or WITPAE all the way through but I expect I will at some point. I've been pretty close with WiTW.

I need to do a little more learning for WITPAE, but I like learning how to do things.

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RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/9/2019 3:21:25 AM

Rosseau

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Just took a vacation today from WitE Fall Blau German Solo. But I'll be back. I pretty much use the editors to drill down and customize the experience. I've never played a stock scenario and never played MP.

Simpler games can be quite good. But as you mention HexWar, they don't generally support their games after release. They published a Field of Glory I type game on Steam that would have been great if they just issued a simple patch to solve a simple problem. But no. And I have one Yobo game, and sorry, one playthrough is all you get until they release an editor for them.

Here's the trick with Order of Battle (not that anyone cares). Just open the editor and every unit and nation from every DLC is available. Just change the year of battle back and forth. Scripting is so easy and you can make a nice scenario for yourself, but no campaign.

I am no where near through with Panzer Corps series and Battle Academy and BAII. These are simpler games but at their core (pardon the pun) are a lot alike. So PC2 is not on my list.

I really hope they can pull off Warplan and then support it.

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Post #: 21

RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/9/2019 3:48:31 AM

MrsWargamer

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Hmm well I suppose I can say that WitE2 is the same as PC2.
Not really a 'new game', just an opportunity to pay a bunch for a few desired tweaks.

Not sure I ever mentioned Hexwar (I know of them though).

I've not experienced Order of Battle yet. I have the free to use limited usage option to check out. But it seems a bit too much like PC.

The steak or chicken analogy isn't really accurate. Steak can be a great 20 dollar t-bone done to perfection by a skilled chef, served with an awesome baked potato and a cold glass of beer along with musical accompaniment or dinner theatre. Or just a typical mediocre 4 oz steak in a mundane restaraunt. I'm lucky, my fiance is a trained chef. I can have that awesome dinner as often as I want :) But eventually even it gets a bit much. Sometimes all you need is a Big Mac and fries and a drink of coke :)

And I don't need to mention, more people want the Big Mac than the 20 dollar T-Bone dinner :)

But, I asked Joni Nuutinen in an email about coming to PC, and he essentially said small wargames go bankrupt almost immediately.
So I'm left to wonder, how does say Shenandoah Studios do it?
Well, for that matter, how does Gary and company manage it?
I personally wonder how wargames publishers manage at all?
I'm aware of the real story behind the merger with Matrix Games and Slitherine. It was Slitherine coming to the rescue of Matrix Games (if you were not aware of this).
War in the East is a heck of a lot of work I'm sure. And War in the West, and the add ons (which I have bought for some reason :) ).
Those games are not cheap. But even still, it's not like they are selling millions of units. I'm not even going to try to ask how many units have sold. We all know, we are not a very large population of gamers.

It's amazing we have as many wargames available of any sort to browse through.
I doubt any of our game making types are living the high life :)

I value titles that remain well supported though. That's one thing to the credit of a lot of our titles.

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Wargame, 05% of the time.
Play with Barbies 05% of the time.
Play with Legos 10% of the time.
Build models 20% of the time
Shopping 60% of the time.
Exlains why I buy em more than I play em.

(in reply to Rosseau)

Post #: 22

RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/9/2019 3:55:53 AM

Infierno

Posts: 99
Joined: 4/30/2017
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrsWargamer

Hmm well I suppose I can say that WitE2 is the same as PC2.
Not really a 'new game', just an opportunity to pay a bunch for a few desired tweaks.

Disagreed there, the air system from WiTW is a HUGE new layer that they're adding to the game. "a few desired tweaks" is definitely short-selling the work the devs are putting into the new game.

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If the rule you followed brought you to this, of what use was the rule?

(in reply to MrsWargamer)

Post #: 23

RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/9/2019 4:07:28 AM

wodin

Posts: 10349
Joined: 4/20/2003
From: England
Status: offline

Really no idea what Call of Duty has to do with this!!?? Confusing.

A war game is a war game I have exactly same idea what a war game is as you do.

Surely no one sit OK eyesight can be that blind they can't look at Matrix games forum and see the endless amount of medium to light wargames and the few hard-core ones.

Please write me out this big list of hard-core wargames out of due out as I can't wait to see it.

Sorry on this you sound like you're from an alternate universe where everything is the other way round

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(in reply to Infierno)

Post #: 24

RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/9/2019 4:22:39 AM

wodin

Posts: 10349
Joined: 4/20/2003
From: England
Status: offline

Aha!

Just realised you obviously know what you said was controversial and would wind people up so you did it to watch people bite! You don't really have any issues. Just like posting controversial stuff.

Hehe naughty girl you

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My website

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(in reply to wodin)

Post #: 25

RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/9/2019 5:05:44 AM

rico21

Posts: 2770
Joined: 3/11/2016
Status: offline

Please, less drama. I bought Korsun Battle because its a visual blast and it deceived me by boring turns. So if the Big Mac had for name Complicated Mac, would it an international celebrity? And this celebrity actor who ask him why he turns in navet films and who answers:"I hope to play more others!"

(in reply to MrsWargamer)

Post #: 26

RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/9/2019 5:37:40 AM

MrsWargamer

Posts: 1122
Joined: 6/18/2014
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Infierno

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrsWargamer

Hmm well I suppose I can say that WitE2 is the same as PC2.
Not really a 'new game', just an opportunity to pay a bunch for a few desired tweaks.

Disagreed there, the air system from WiTW is a HUGE new layer that they're adding to the game. "a few desired tweaks" is definitely short-selling the work the devs are putting into the new game.

It's called tit for tat. It's an expression, look it up :)

It's like calling Battle Academy silly because it uses comic looking graphics in the pre-game launch.
Meet me on the battlefield, and then demonstrate how 'easy' it is :) Chess isn't a light game it's just possible to play several games in an afternoon.

As I said, a GAME shouldn't be 'work'.

_____________________________

Wargame, 05% of the time.
Play with Barbies 05% of the time.
Play with Legos 10% of the time.
Build models 20% of the time
Shopping 60% of the time.
Exlains why I buy em more than I play em.

(in reply to Infierno)

Post #: 27

RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/9/2019 5:44:48 AM

MrsWargamer

Posts: 1122
Joined: 6/18/2014
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: wodin

Really no idea what Call of Duty has to do with this!!?? Confusing.

A war game is a war game I have exactly same idea what a war game is as you do.

Surely no one sit OK eyesight can be that blind they can't look at Matrix games forum and see the endless amount of medium to light wargames and the few hard-core ones.

Please write me out this big list of hard-core wargames out of due out as I can't wait to see it.

Sorry on this you sound like you're from an alternate universe where everything is the other way round

Call of Duty was me suggesting, it takes more than a military theme, to be a 'wargame' in some manners of definition.

Some games can offer a full range of simulation, and not require the gamer spend days instead of minutes to execute a turn. I think a turn in Strategic Command can cover a lot of decision making, but not require a thousand mouse clicks. The amount of individual units doesn't automatically translate into a superior experience.

I think some of you guys likely enjoy doing income taxes :)

Big list dear? not sure precisely what you are aiming at.
Here at Matrix Games, well yeah, they have the short and sweet, they have the major league hardcore, but they have plenty that are really neither. I'd guess half the list though is not even up for consideration. I'm talking mainly WW2 and board game looking as well.

_____________________________

Wargame, 05% of the time.
Play with Barbies 05% of the time.
Play with Legos 10% of the time.
Build models 20% of the time
Shopping 60% of the time.
Exlains why I buy em more than I play em.

(in reply to wodin)

Post #: 28

RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/9/2019 5:46:23 AM

MrsWargamer

Posts: 1122
Joined: 6/18/2014
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rico21

Please, less drama. I bought Korsun Battle because its a visual blast and it deceived me by boring turns. So if the Big Mac had for name Complicated Mac, would it an international celebrity? And this celebrity actor who ask him why he turns in navet films and who answers:"I hope to play more others!"

I'm wondering precisely has been an example of 'drama'. Is it just you think a woman has to be all about drama? Hey, I write romance novels. None of this thread has been 'drama' though.

_____________________________

Wargame, 05% of the time.
Play with Barbies 05% of the time.
Play with Legos 10% of the time.
Build models 20% of the time
Shopping 60% of the time.
Exlains why I buy em more than I play em.

(in reply to rico21)

Post #: 29

RE: Big and complicated and super detailed isn't always... - 6/9/2019 6:52:07 AM

rico21

Posts: 2770
Joined: 3/11/2016
Status: offline

Too complicated == too time eater-----\
--------------------------------------------->>>>>>>Drama

Not enough complicated == boring -----/

The fact you are a woman(cheers) does no enter in the equation!

< Message edited by rico21 -- 6/9/2019 6:53:30 AM >

(in reply to MrsWargamer)

Post #: 30

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