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Combat Model - 5/27/2019 3:58:11 AM   
Michael T


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Status: offline 		Any details on how ground, air and naval combat work in the game?

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RE: Combat Model - 5/27/2019 5:10:57 AM   
Hairog


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Status: offline 		I still haven't got an answer on if it's definitely crt and multi-hex attack or not.

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RE: Combat Model - 5/27/2019 10:12:37 AM   
sillyflower


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Michael T

Any details on how ground, air and naval combat work in the game?


As long as you don't get a +1 bonus by rubbing dirt on your mouse
Sorry my friend - sometimes a low blow is irresitable. Looking forward to the Ashes but without much optimism...............

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RE: Combat Model - 5/27/2019 12:50:45 PM   
Veloz


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RE: Combat Model - 5/27/2019 7:31:58 PM   
ncc1701e


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Status: offline 		Haven't seen anything like T34 or 21cm K 39, so I suppose this won't be based on these factors.

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RE: Combat Model - 5/27/2019 9:07:37 PM   
Michael T


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quote:

As long as you don't get a +1 bonus by rubbing dirt on your mouse
Sorry my friend - sometimes a low blow is irresitable. Looking forward to the Ashes but without much optimism


Well there is the small matter of the world cup first....



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RE: Combat Model - 5/27/2019 9:10:04 PM   
Michael T


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Status: offline 		It seems a little odd that Beta is about to start but we have no fundamental info on how combat will work.

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RE: Combat Model - 5/27/2019 11:48:37 PM   
AlvaroSousa


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Status: offline 		My apologies I must have missed the post. I have been working for 30 hours straight between 3 days on the developer blogs.

WarPlan is based on incomplete information. There is no traditional you see them or you don't model of fog of war. Data is given as generalized or partial most of the time, much like playing poker.

Attacking with land is multihex attack or single hex attack. Whichever you like. A popup will appear with the estimated odds so players know about where they are at. It gives it a wargame feel and saves time adding numbers. The odds are an estimation considering weather, terrain, and net factors between all units. Once an attack is initiated each side automatically calls in air support and escorts if available. The battle resolves. Land and air forces use operation points to move and attack. A player can attack the same hex multiple times.

All land units have different attributes that fire in sequence affecting combat.

Round 1 – Artillery.
Round 2 – Defender Guns.
Round 3 – Tanks (halved in rugged terrain).
Round 4 – Attacker Guns (halved attacking).
Round 5 – Firearms.

A defender's terrain, weather, and entrenchment determine it's casualty level.
A ration of attack tanks to defender tanks and guns determines retreat bonuses.
The Defender's experience resists retreating.
High odds attacks and the infiltrator specialty give bonuses to forcing a retreat.

Air units can attack as solo missions air striking targets for concentrated fire or players can just set them on full support so they help with land combat.

When it comes to navies there is a reconnaissance level in each hex. The closer you are to your shores the higher it is. The farther away you are from your shores the lower it is. So 2 fleets in the middle of the Atlantic have a very small chance of finding each other.

Fleets support invasions with supplies and off shore support.

The developer blog should give you better details.

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RE: Combat Model - 5/28/2019 12:18:35 AM   
Michael T


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Status: offline 		Thanks.

Where is developer blog?

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RE: Combat Model - 5/28/2019 3:05:37 AM   
Michael T


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Status: offline 		Do you have options for different types of attacks/defence. For example, retreat if attacked, hold at all costs OR recon in force, disregard losses etc.

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RE: Combat Model - 5/28/2019 3:55:24 AM   
AlvaroSousa


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Status: offline 		Blog - should be up soon.

Land Modes - Land units have 2 modes. Defend and Delay.
Defend - is just normal combat trying to hold the position.
Delay - you automatically retreat with any damage taken but both attack and defender take 50% less damage.

Air Modes -
Full Support - auto fly missions
Mission Only - manually fly missions

Naval Modes
Fleet - For attacking
Raid - Less chance to be spotted can only attack convoys

< Message edited by fuzzypup -- 5/29/2019 2:49:40 PM >

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Post #: 11
RE: Combat Model - 5/28/2019 4:10:18 AM   
Michael T


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Status: offline 		ok thanks.

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RE: Combat Model - 5/28/2019 5:09:39 AM   
Hairog


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quote:

When it comes to navies there is a reconnaissance level in each hex. The closer you are to your shores the higher it is. The farther away you are from your shores the lower it is. So 2 fleets in the middle of the Atlantic have a very small chance of finding each other.


I like this! Nice concept. Hopefully fleets that include aircraft add to the recon as well.

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RE: Combat Model - 5/28/2019 9:40:37 AM   
Michael T


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Status: offline 		Would 'Delay' only be possible for units with a certain experience level? Otherwise you might see this become the default setting for Soviet units in 1941.

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RE: Combat Model - 5/28/2019 12:58:01 PM   
AlvaroSousa


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Status: offline 		One thing I forgot to add, HQ generals also affect combat, retreat, and intensity of the battle.

No there is limitation on delay/defend mode. If the Soviets want to set all their units on delay what would happen is that the Germans would punch holes at will in a line, cut off, and destroy surrounded units.

As for naval searches I don't have a search button. I used to but I found the action redundant. So it is simply an integration into the system of attacking which places emphasis on sea control. This means sending in land based air to attack a fleet before sending in a fleet. This means advancing taking bases toward an objective to place land based air. This more applies to a Pacific Theater campaign.

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RE: Combat Model - 5/28/2019 4:14:28 PM   
Plainian

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Michael T

Would 'Delay' only be possible for units with a certain experience level? Otherwise you might see this become the default setting for Soviet units in 1941.


quote:

ORIGINAL: fuzzypup

One thing I forgot to add, HQ generals also affect combat, retreat, and intensity of the battle.

No there is limitation on delay/defend mode. If the Soviets want to set all their units on delay what would happen is that the Germans would punch holes at will in a line, cut off, and destroy surrounded units.



I thought Michael T's suggestion was a pretty nice historical idea. However lets see what the beta testers make of the different defensive options in the game which is actually an option I wish was in Panzer Campaigns.

By the way I assume you meant to say "There is NO limitation..."

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RE: Combat Model - 5/28/2019 4:19:11 PM   
Uxbridge


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Status: offline 		It seems very interesting, all of it.

Regarding the HQ's, are units connected to specific such, or is it simply a matter of being within the HQ's "range"?

If the former is true, how will this work with the system of merging and breaking-up of units?

I also wonder how designations of units (naming) work when you mend and break them. Do they have namnes or will they simply be a huge mass without designations at all?

< Message edited by Uxbridge -- 5/28/2019 4:27:26 PM >

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RE: Combat Model - 5/28/2019 6:52:26 PM   
AlvaroSousa


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quote:

I thought Michael T's suggestion was a pretty nice historical idea. However lets see what the beta testers make of the different defensive options in the game which is actually an option I wish was in Panzer Campaigns.


Yea Beta will test out some of the new ideas in the game. If something doesn't work well then it is changed. But most of the time it is just an adjustment.
quote:


Regarding the HQ's, are units connected to specific such, or is it simply a matter of being within the HQ's "range"?

If the former is true, how will this work with the system of merging and breaking-up of units?

I also wonder how designations of units (naming) work when you mend and break them. Do they have namnes or will they simply be a huge mass without designations at all?


Units grab the closest HQs to them within a 5 hex range. It is very likely the range will be reduced from some of my play testing I did. HQs are automatically managed. I don't think players want to keep track of what unit is part of which HQ.

There is a name pool within the game. When a unit is purchased, split, detached, or merged it pulls from the unit pool. Players may use a custom name, add a custom name, remove a custom name. Once you have a name on the map that name stays. So if the unit is destroyed the name goes back to the pool.

So if a player wants to name a Panzer Corps "Leroy Jenkins Panzer Corps" they can.

I put in all historical reasonable corps and army names with sufficient extras.

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Post #: 18
RE: Combat Model - 5/28/2019 9:33:54 PM   
Michael T


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From: Queensland, Australia.
Status: offline 		This all sounds very interesting. My fingers are crossed that maybe this time something excellent will be delivered.

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RE: Combat Model - 5/28/2019 10:27:26 PM   
Titan

 

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Status: offline 		Me too

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RE: Combat Model - 5/29/2019 3:28:35 AM   
Zovs


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quote:


I don't think players want to keep track of what unit is part of which HQ.


I do although I have been hardcore historical war gamer since ‘78. Units should be assigned to a HQ and it should cost something to transfer them to another HQ, in my opinion.

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RE: Combat Model - 5/29/2019 5:03:00 AM   
Simulacra53


Posts: 565
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Status: offline 		Besides naming is there a way to visually distinguish units, like Heer vs Waffen SS or SA vs Guards etc?

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RE: Combat Model - 5/29/2019 5:04:07 AM   
Simulacra53


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Zovs

quote:


I don't think players want to keep track of what unit is part of which HQ.


I do although I have been hardcore historical war gamer since ‘78. Units should be assigned to a HQ and it should cost something to transfer them to another HQ, in my opinion.


Auto switching is fine as an option, but on the border of two HQs automatic switching might lead to unwanted effects.

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Post #: 23
RE: Combat Model - 5/29/2019 1:42:02 PM   
wodin


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Status: offline 		So every time you delay the attacker also loses 50%?? No matter how big defending forces are?

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RE: Combat Model - 5/29/2019 2:03:50 PM   
AlvaroSousa


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quote:

ORIGINAL: wodin

So every time you delay the attacker also loses 50%?? No matter how big defending forces are?


You misread both sides take 50% less damage.

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RE: Combat Model - 5/29/2019 2:09:57 PM   
ringoblood


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Status: offline 		I really like this. Thanks Fuzzy.

edit: sorry for my absence had death in family.

< Message edited by ringoblood -- 5/29/2019 2:11:04 PM >

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RE: Combat Model - 5/29/2019 2:16:09 PM   
AlvaroSousa


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Status: offline 		You don't need to apologize for anything. My condolences for your loss.

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Post #: 27
RE: Combat Model - 5/29/2019 2:16:54 PM   
wodin


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Status: offline 		Aha!! That makes much more sense. I was wondering why no one else queried it😁

Maybe edit post and add "less"?
quote:

ORIGINAL: fuzzypup


quote:

ORIGINAL: wodin

So every time you delay the attacker also loses 50%?? No matter how big defending forces are?


You misread both sides take 50% less damage.



< Message edited by wodin -- 5/29/2019 2:18:57 PM >

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RE: Combat Model - 5/29/2019 2:49:54 PM   
AlvaroSousa


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Status: offline 		Thanks I corrected the post.

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Post #: 29
RE: Combat Model - 6/6/2019 12:17:06 AM   
Michael T


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Status: offline 		Anyone around who can divulge more details on how the combat model works?

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