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How long is the AI Turn ?

 
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How long is the AI Turn ? - 5/17/2019 3:54:02 PM   
welk

 

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I play all my wargames Vs IA, never Vs human opponent : The length of AI turn is for me very important point. Length in Third Reich PC (Avallon Hill) and in Strategic Command 1 was good, but I noticed that it was longer in SC2, and more longer in Strategic Command 3 : It seems to be dominant tendency in "grand strategy scale" wargames, but a fast AI is more comfortable to play (I hate to have to wait a long time the AI turn)

What is the situation for Warplan, please ?
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RE: How long is the AI Turn ? - 5/17/2019 5:05:55 PM   
ringoblood


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I agree, In SC3 they needed a patch shortly after release to fix the long AI turn lag bc of complaints. Do you intend to address this before launch maybe test it in beta to see the speed of AI if you are modeling the SC endgin.

Josh

(in reply to welk)
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RE: How long is the AI Turn ? - 5/17/2019 5:30:14 PM   
Alvaro Sousa


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Joined: 7/29/2013
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Currently the Allied A.I. turn in 1943 during the summer is ~1m long in the Game Editor which has CPU overhead on an i7 3rd generation PC. You also see the action as it goes along if the Battle Camera is enabled.

The Application on a desktop would be faster.

_____________________________

Games worked on

Designer of the Strategic Command 2 products
- Brute Force (mod)
- Assault on Communism
- Assault on Democracy

Designer of the Strategic Command 3 products
- Map Image Importer

(in reply to ringoblood)
Post #: 3
RE: How long is the AI Turn ? - 5/17/2019 5:45:17 PM   
ringoblood


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Would be be to optimize that in beta so you don't run in the same issues as SC3 did and end up doing an emergency patch soon after release. 1 min is a bit laggy and gamers will be a little upset.especially laptop gamers like myself.

(in reply to Alvaro Sousa)
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RE: How long is the AI Turn ? - 5/18/2019 1:33:10 AM   
Alvaro Sousa


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1m was in the Editor. Outside the editor it is 15-25s. Some turns will be longer is navies are involved.

_____________________________

Games worked on

Designer of the Strategic Command 2 products
- Brute Force (mod)
- Assault on Communism
- Assault on Democracy

Designer of the Strategic Command 3 products
- Map Image Importer

(in reply to ringoblood)
Post #: 5
RE: How long is the AI Turn ? - 5/18/2019 7:38:20 AM   
welk

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: fuzzypup

1m was in the Editor. Outside the editor it is 15-25s. Some turns will be longer is navies are involved.


In my opinion, a good thing would be to have choice :

1°/ Normal way
2°/ Quick advance ("accelerated mod") : it was the system in Third Reich PC = Player could see what AI did, but all AI action were very fast (in particular, movements)
3°/ Instantaneously mod : AI action are not showed to player, program shows just the final result of AI actions

With this system, player could choice exactly "his" lenght

EDIT : To accelerate AI action movements (in the 2d mod), one solution (or option choiced by player) could also be that : AI highlight the hex were is the moving unit at start, AI do not show the movement itself, and AI highlight immediatly the hexagon of arrival


In addition, there is something I do not understand => you wrote :
1m was in the Editor. Outside the editor it is 15-25s.

What means please the AI turn in editor ? In game, I see what it is. But "in editor" ? Is it the needed time to save the editor work ?



< Message edited by welk -- 5/18/2019 7:44:55 AM >

(in reply to Alvaro Sousa)
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RE: How long is the AI Turn ? - 5/18/2019 10:10:25 AM   
ringoblood


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quote:

ORIGINAL: fuzzypup

1m was in the Editor. Outside the editor it is 15-25s. Some turns will be longer is navies are involved.


Okay good, thanks for the clarification.

(in reply to Alvaro Sousa)
Post #: 7
RE: How long is the AI Turn ? - 5/18/2019 12:27:25 PM   
budd


Posts: 2759
Joined: 7/4/2009
From: Tacoma
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Do people think 1m turn processing in 43 to long? I don't know, seems reasonable to me with the amount of units bound to be on the board in 43. I'm sure there's a balancing act in there, decent AI vs turn times. I imagine it's like chess, the more time you give the computer to figure, the better moves it will make. Tough call for developers.

_____________________________

Enjoy when you can, and endure when you must. ~Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

"Be Yourself; Everyone else is already taken" ~Oscar Wilde

*I'm in the Wargamer middle ground*
I don't buy all the wargames I want, I just buy more than I need.

(in reply to ringoblood)
Post #: 8
RE: How long is the AI Turn ? - 5/20/2019 12:23:41 AM   
Cohen_slith

 

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1 minute turn for 1943 seems excellent to me.
Heck usually strategy game turns take much longer.

Given - in general in Grand Strategy games the AI is always lacking and these games are better played vs human opponents.

(in reply to budd)
Post #: 9
RE: How long is the AI Turn ? - 5/20/2019 1:27:04 AM   
Titan

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Cohen_slith

1 minute turn for 1943 seems excellent to me.
Heck usually strategy game turns take much longer.

Given - in general in Grand Strategy games the AI is always lacking and these games are better played vs human opponents.


Gosh when i first played battle on of the Bulge on an old Amstrad or something back in the late 70's on tape drive you had to walk away for about 30 min or so for AI to complete turn

(in reply to Cohen_slith)
Post #: 10
RE: How long is the AI Turn ? - 5/20/2019 3:27:10 PM   
Alvaro Sousa


Posts: 3526
Joined: 7/29/2013
Status: online

What means please the AI turn in editor ? In game, I see what it is. But "in editor" ? Is it the needed time to save the editor work ?

Unity Engine has an editor in which you can run your game for testing. It consumes a lot of resources. The editor creates the build which is what you get when you install the game. That doesn't have the editor overhead.

WarPlan has a speed and battle camera, or battlecam in the game, settings.

Speed shows you how fast the A.I. thinks and moves. If you set it to 3s you can see every move they do. If you set it to the lowest setting the screen will zip by pausing only between length calculations

Battlecam follows the current action on the map. If set to off the camera will just sit there and players can move it to the location they want.

As for A.I. understand that a game of this scope and scale the A.I. will never be as good as a human player. Any other game I have played of this type, after reading the rules, I start on the normal settings and I can beat the A.I. easily in the 1st game. A game like Unity of Command is a limited battlefield with very clear objectives and no air or naval power. In that kind of game it is very easy to write a challenging A.I..

_____________________________

Games worked on

Designer of the Strategic Command 2 products
- Brute Force (mod)
- Assault on Communism
- Assault on Democracy

Designer of the Strategic Command 3 products
- Map Image Importer

(in reply to Titan)
Post #: 11
RE: How long is the AI Turn ? - 5/20/2019 4:48:09 PM   
welk

 

Posts: 857
Joined: 9/17/2006
From: France
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Ok, thanks for editor precision

quote:

ORIGINAL: fuzzypup
As for A.I. understand that a game of this scope and scale the A.I. will never be as good as a human player.

It's good for me : I am not Napoleon and during one year I lost all my games vs the AI of the old Strategic Command 1 after I bought it

Very impatient to discover, please work fast


< Message edited by welk -- 5/20/2019 4:52:15 PM >

(in reply to Alvaro Sousa)
Post #: 12
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