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Is setting Start of game Frozen units to REFIT a good idea?

 
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Is setting Start of game Frozen units to REFIT a good i... - 5/5/2019 11:10:59 PM   
Saulust

 

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In many scenarios and especially in the Grand Campaign there are a few to quite a number of Divisions & Brigades that start off as Frozen. Some are set just for another turn or two, or for a short/medium/long term period or even until the end of game, such as the static German training divisions. Now while you generally can't change the Max TOE percentage setting, which would have been good if you wanted to save men & equipment replacements by reducing that to as low as 50% for HQs and to 20% on Divs/Bgds for example, but since you can not re-set Max TOE percentage on Frozen units you just can't do that. However I am wondering if you can try and go in the other direction in a manner of speaking, since you can actually change on these Frozen units their READY status to REFIT.

I wonder about the benefit to the more sooner to be unfrozen Frozen Divs/Bgds by changing their status from READY to REFIT for them, apart from just prioritising them on the list for replacements over the rest of your vanilla READY combat units.

If you consider the Grand Campaigne as the AXIS, the Germans, apart from the static training Divs, have 1 Panzer Korps (XIV) with a PzD & SS-Mot Div & there are another 3x Mot Inf Divs also two plain Corps Frozen in Poland, the XXXIV & XXXV with 6 IDs in total & the Lehr Bgd plus the 3 Corps 11th Army with 7 IDs in Romania, as well as the whole of the AXIS minor allies Armies completely. (Except for most of the Rumanian Airforce!)

Most of these German mobile & IDs are starting at or nearly 100% of Max TOE, except the 239th ID at 89%, so I am wondering if setting them from READY status to REFIT does much over the one turn or two that they are Frozen for, other than placing them at the top of the 'request for replacements' list by resulting in a slight increase to their Experience or Morale, or mean that they demand the best of the actual replacement or something? That 239th ID is only at 70% in Experience & Morale... should setting it to REFIT for a turn or two while it is Frozen at 3 Hexes range away from Soviet ground units achieve much of a gain in more than just numbers of men & equipment such as also a rise in its experience & morale?

Does setting the further back from the front Rumanian, Hungarian & Italian ground units from READY to REFIT status provide better results in improved experience & morale if you do that with Divisions that will unfreeze and arrive at the front in reasonable time frames rather than not changing the setting?

If it is yes, and it is so that setting these further back Divs/Bgds to REFIT is a good idea in terms of not just ensuring they will eventually arrive at the front at full strength, but also with raised or improved Experience & Morale, how about all the rest of the Germans 11th Army & Rumanian 3rd & 4th Armies and all the Finns that start Frozen on the border next to the Soviets ground units, especially since the Finns will remain Frozen for a few turns, not one to two. Can REFIT on all them situated next to the Russian border forces work to their benefit too in a similar result?

Also, what about all those Soviet units similarly Frozen against the Finns in the North and in the Odessa Military District against the Romanians for a turn or two, would switching from READY to REFIT status on them provide a slight Experience & Morale uplift benefit for them, apart from just replacements?

How about all the Soviet units in the Caucasus region on the map, but Frozen at the start of the Grand Campaigne, most of these Divisions unfreeze during the 1st Winter when the Russians will really need them, but does changing their setting from READY to REFIT mean they will have developed even better levels of Experienced & Morale and thereby higher CV when they are free?

I doubt it is a good idea to REFIT any Frozen until end of game units for the most part, but all or especially any that will soon unfreeze during the game I think it might be a good idea to set to REFIT which I have just started doing recently anyway, but I hope it has more of a beneficial effect other than just prioritising replacement for them... any thoughts?

< Message edited by Saulust -- 5/6/2019 6:27:00 AM >
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RE: Is setting Start of game Frozen units to REFIT a go... - 5/6/2019 1:38:56 PM   
Telemecus


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Saulust
Does setting the further back from the front Rumanian, Hungarian & Italian ground units from READY to REFIT status provide better results in improved experience & morale if you do that with Divisions that will unfreeze and arrive at the front in reasonable time frames rather than not changing the setting?

...

I doubt it is a good idea to REFIT any Frozen until end of game units for the most part, but all or especially any that will soon unfreeze during the game I think it might be a good idea to set to REFIT which I have just started doing recently anyway, but I hope it has more of a beneficial effect other than just prioritising replacement for them... any thoughts?


If they are more than 10 hexes back from the front lines - then refit provides an accelerated gain in morale towards national morale. So there is another benefit.

I think they key distinction is whether they are unfreezing soon or not. If they are the motorised in Poland, Rumanian units unfreezing in a few turns, or those Russians next to Finland - treat them in the same way as you would unfrozen units. If they are frozen for a long time the accelerated morale gain is not useful as they will get to National Morale by the time they unfreeze anyway. And you do not want the best new equipment to go to them.

Indeed for the Hungarians and Italians, who have almost all their troops for a long time frozen I put all their few unfrozen troops on refit permanently. This is a kind of reverse refit for the frozen troops. Even if the frontline Italians and Hungarians do not need refit otherwise, this makes sure the newest equipment does not go to the units frozen.

(in reply to Saulust)
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RE: Is setting Start of game Frozen units to REFIT a go... - 5/6/2019 5:23:01 PM   
Saulust

 

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Thanks Telemecus, so for 10 hexes back plus of the soon to be unfrozen only makes sense, so for the frozen Romanians and the German XXXV Infantry Korps (3 of its 4 IDs have only 70 Morale), possibly for the the 1SS MOT Bgd (70 Morale) too for a turn may be, but not for all the near border units in Romania and Finland.

Oh, that's a really good tip to keep your 'in the field' Axis Divisions on REFIT permanently to prioritise them for replacement men and equipment, I forgot that, but I have it is on my list of things to always do!

I think the Caucasus units already have high enough morale though for REFIT to boost theirs, only a few very long term Frozen Soviet Divs have less than 45 Morale down there.

(in reply to Telemecus)
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RE: Is setting Start of game Frozen units to REFIT a go... - 5/6/2019 5:29:00 PM   
morvael


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REFIT on the frontlines doesn't work for human player. Also, too many units on refit (way above your replacement capability) means each unit will still receive just a trickle of replacements, defeating the purpose of refit. I think there are also penalties to construction value for units on refit. It should be really used to rebuild a handful (compared to your replacement capability) of units a few hexes beyond frontlines.

(in reply to Saulust)
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RE: Is setting Start of game Frozen units to REFIT a go... - 5/6/2019 5:41:00 PM   
Saulust

 

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I thought REFIT just cut out at too close a range to enemy for Morale boosting training purposes, like how RESERVED ground combat units cut out when in contact but that in any regards REFIT still indicated that you want the units prioritise for replacements even though they are on the front line.

I wasn't aware the REFIT reduce digging in, but it makes sense, but while your AXIS allies in the field are advancing they don't need to dig in anyway really, so once you want to use them to dig in for defence in the Winter you can just READY them for the time and switch them back to REFIT once in contact or are to move going on the offensive.

BTW I have set Soviet Construction Bgds/Btlns to REFIT and they still effectively repaired RR.

< Message edited by Saulust -- 5/8/2019 2:21:11 AM >

(in reply to morvael)
Post #: 5
RE: Is setting Start of game Frozen units to REFIT a go... - 5/7/2019 7:26:34 AM   
56ajax


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A good Axis player may be able to isolate some units before they become unfrozen so be careful.

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(in reply to Saulust)
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