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Bug with HOTKEY! - 3/19/2019 1:44:30 AM   
Iamstrategygame

 

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The manual 6.1.2 clearly state Pressing (N) or (+) will select next unit that can act. But I tested this, it does not work, all it does is cycles through every unit. This is a terrible bug, because for large scenarios we need a way to find unit that have not been selected, hence idle unit button!!!!
Post #: 1
RE: Bug with HOTKEY! - 3/19/2019 4:05:55 AM   
larryfulkerson

 

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From: Tucson, AZ
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quote:

The manual 6.1.2 clearly state Pressing (N) or (+) will select next unit that can act. But I tested this, it does not work, all it does is cycles through every unit. This is a terrible bug, because for large scenarios we need a way to find unit that have not been selected, hence idle unit button!!!!

My workaround is to open the OOB and look for those units that still have MP's left and can therefore move. As soon as I don't have any units to move the turn is over.

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RE: Bug with HOTKEY! - 3/19/2019 4:28:57 AM   
Iamstrategygame

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

quote:

The manual 6.1.2 clearly state Pressing (N) or (+) will select next unit that can act. But I tested this, it does not work, all it does is cycles through every unit. This is a terrible bug, because for large scenarios we need a way to find unit that have not been selected, hence idle unit button!!!!

My workaround is to open the OOB and look for those units that still have MP's left and can therefore move. As soon as I don't have any units to move the turn is over.


what you suggested only works for very small or medium sized scenario, but if we are talking about 1000 or more counter scenarios this is not practical! I can't believe the operation art of war community is taking so much crap from the developers. We must demand a better UI!

(in reply to larryfulkerson)
Post #: 3
RE: Bug with HOTKEY! - 3/19/2019 4:34:16 AM   
larryfulkerson

 

Posts: 38380
Joined: 4/17/2005
From: Tucson, AZ
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quote:

I can't believe the operation art of war community is taking so much crap from the developers.

There's a back story that you're not aware of. The Beta Testing team, um....some of us are having health problems, heart attacks, etc. The output of the team isn't the greatest it's ever been. I could tell you more but then I'd have to kill you.

< Message edited by larryfulkerson -- 3/19/2019 4:35:30 AM >


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RE: Bug with HOTKEY! - 3/19/2019 12:16:36 PM   
Lobster


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Joined: 8/8/2013
From: Third rock from the Sun.
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamstrategygame


quote:

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

quote:

The manual 6.1.2 clearly state Pressing (N) or (+) will select next unit that can act. But I tested this, it does not work, all it does is cycles through every unit. This is a terrible bug, because for large scenarios we need a way to find unit that have not been selected, hence idle unit button!!!!

My workaround is to open the OOB and look for those units that still have MP's left and can therefore move. As soon as I don't have any units to move the turn is over.


what you suggested only works for very small or medium sized scenario, but if we are talking about 1000 or more counter scenarios this is not practical! I can't believe the operation art of war community is taking so much crap from the developers. We must demand a better UI!


It isn't 'developers'. It is developer, singular. Anyone else is an unpaid volunteer. They need to change the manual to say the next unit and leave out the 'that can act'. Then it would be fixed. There are other places in the manual where things are stated incorrectly. These are not bugs just places in the manual that have never been fixed since 1998.

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Post #: 5
RE: Bug with HOTKEY! - 3/19/2019 12:38:52 PM   
Shadrach


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From: Oslo, Norway
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I noticed this one too early on. Not a big issue but would be nice to actually have a difference between "next unit" and "next unit that can act".

I guess it's the problem with using only the old regulars for beta testing. They are so used to doing things one way, and so used to some things just being a certain way, they won't complain about things so it can be fixed before release.

And yes, the old grogs are usually of the "rivet-counters" variety, and not so much interested in UI and superficial improvements. Even when it can save a lot of time and might even save them from getting "mouse-arm"... but will create a massive fuss if the armour thickness on a PzkpfwIV is slightly wrong for the F2 variety made in December '43

(in reply to Lobster)
Post #: 6
RE: Bug with HOTKEY! - 3/19/2019 2:45:39 PM   
sPzAbt653


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From: east coast, usa
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quote:

would be nice to actually have a difference between "next unit" and "next unit that can act".

All units can always perform an act, so you would have to come up with parameters that can be handed to the code, and surely no one will agree on such parameters. And us old regulars on the Beta Team have the advantage of years of testings that you don't. This has taught us that for everything you change, one or more unintended things happen. This cannot be avoided when modifying a game from so years ago.
Also, several 'new' guys were added to the Beta Team in two batches well before the last official release. And further, us 'rivet-counters' would never bother Ralph with making some sort of technical change to an equipment. We use our own eqp files and make our own changes, for each scenario if so desired.

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Post #: 7
RE: Bug with HOTKEY! - 3/19/2019 3:43:06 PM   
Lobster


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From: Third rock from the Sun.
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Shadrach

I guess it's the problem with using only the old regulars for beta testing.


The old regulars have asked for changes in how the manual is worded. You see how much attention they paid.

It would be nice to have a way to dig in many units at once. I'm all for it. The problem arises when you try to determine how the game is supposed to know what the human wants done. It's easy to say I want I want I want. How would you do it?


< Message edited by Lobster -- 3/19/2019 3:45:18 PM >


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"Getting back to reality...I'll only go as a tourist!"

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Post #: 8
RE: Bug with HOTKEY! - 3/19/2019 4:55:32 PM   
sPzAbt653


Posts: 8880
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
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quote:

changes in how the manual is worded

I am trying to keep track of these, and one day when I am laid up for a period of time I plan on compiling the Manual into an easier to understand text file. So for this one I have :
6.1.2. Using the KeyBoard
'N – Selects the next unit that can act.'
CHANGE TO:
N – Selects the next unit in the OOB and currently on map.

Of course, I've 'planned' on doing this for several years, but it is a huge job and quite boring, so ...

(in reply to Lobster)
Post #: 9
RE: Bug with HOTKEY! - 3/19/2019 8:31:26 PM   
Lobster


Posts: 3238
Joined: 8/8/2013
From: Third rock from the Sun.
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sPzAbt653

quote:

changes in how the manual is worded

I am trying to keep track of these, and one day when I am laid up for a period of time I plan on compiling the Manual into an easier to understand text file. So for this one I have :
6.1.2. Using the KeyBoard
'N – Selects the next unit that can act.'
CHANGE TO:
N – Selects the next unit in the OOB and currently on map.

Of course, I've 'planned' on doing this for several years, but it is a huge job and quite boring, so ...


Don't do today that which can be put off till tomorrow. The procrastinators credo.

_____________________________

http://www.operationbarbarossa.net/

"Getting back to reality...I'll only go as a tourist!"

(in reply to sPzAbt653)
Post #: 10
RE: Bug with HOTKEY! - 3/20/2019 1:02:58 AM   
Iamstrategygame

 

Posts: 28
Joined: 3/2/2019
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Shadrach

I noticed this one too early on. Not a big issue but would be nice to actually have a difference between "next unit" and "next unit that can act".

I guess it's the problem with using only the old regulars for beta testing. They are so used to doing things one way, and so used to some things just being a certain way, they won't complain about things so it can be fixed before release.

And yes, the old grogs are usually of the "rivet-counters" variety, and not so much interested in UI and superficial improvements. Even when it can save a lot of time and might even save them from getting "mouse-arm"... but will create a massive fuss if the armour thickness on a PzkpfwIV is slightly wrong for the F2 variety made in December '43



exactly, with any other game, the community would be up in angry protest and roar over not having a move idle unit button. As a matter of fact, every triple A title, I have ever played has had a move idle unit button, such as civilization series and total war series.

< Message edited by Iamstrategygame -- 3/20/2019 1:08:13 AM >

(in reply to Shadrach)
Post #: 11
RE: Bug with HOTKEY! - 3/20/2019 1:06:57 AM   
Iamstrategygame

 

Posts: 28
Joined: 3/2/2019
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sPzAbt653

quote:

would be nice to actually have a difference between "next unit" and "next unit that can act".

All units can always perform an act, so you would have to come up with parameters that can be handed to the code, and surely no one will agree on such parameters. And us old regulars on the Beta Team have the advantage of years of testings that you don't. This has taught us that for everything you change, one or more unintended things happen. This cannot be avoided when modifying a game from so years ago.
Also, several 'new' guys were added to the Beta Team in two batches well before the last official release. And further, us 'rivet-counters' would never bother Ralph with making some sort of technical change to an equipment. We use our own eqp files and make our own changes, for each scenario if so desired.


No! the move idle unit button is easy. Also it won't interfere with timestamp aspect of the game. Lets just put it this way, if a unit made any kind of action such as, move, digging in or tactical reserve and I mean any kind of action then he is considered moved for the current time stamp. And on the next time stamp all unit that can do action is consider idle again. How, hard can this be? I suspect the developers spent like 5 hours on TOAW 4 and now is just JOF on our money. Horrible oversight and this game have so much great potential!

(in reply to sPzAbt653)
Post #: 12
RE: Bug with HOTKEY! - 3/20/2019 2:11:09 AM   
Lobster


Posts: 3238
Joined: 8/8/2013
From: Third rock from the Sun.
Status: offline
Exactly what do you mean by timestamp? That is something that is applied after a combat. I think you may be confused by what a timestamp is.

_____________________________

http://www.operationbarbarossa.net/

"Getting back to reality...I'll only go as a tourist!"

(in reply to Iamstrategygame)
Post #: 13
RE: Bug with HOTKEY! - 3/20/2019 2:32:58 AM   
sPzAbt653


Posts: 8880
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline
quote:

I suspect the developers spent like 5 hours on TOAW 4

Quite a few things you have said in several of your threads have damaged your credibility, but this statement tops it all off and ends my desire to help you.

< Message edited by sPzAbt653 -- 3/20/2019 2:37:04 AM >

(in reply to Iamstrategygame)
Post #: 14
RE: Bug with HOTKEY! - 3/20/2019 3:22:33 AM   
r6kunz


Posts: 1033
Joined: 7/4/2002
From: near Philadelphia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamstrategygame


quote:

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

quote:

The manual 6.1.2 clearly state Pressing (N) or (+) will select next unit that can act. But I tested this, it does not work, all it does is cycles through every unit. This is a terrible bug, because for large scenarios we need a way to find unit that have not been selected, hence idle unit button!!!!

My workaround is to open the OOB and look for those units that still have MP's left and can therefore move. As soon as I don't have any units to move the turn is over.


what you suggested only works for very small or medium sized scenario, but if we are talking about 1000 or more counter scenarios this is not practical! I can't believe the operation art of war community is taking so much crap from the developers. We must demand a better UI!

I use the [M] hotkey to cycle from combat strength to MP used/remaining. I can see at a glance those units that can move. And how far.

< Message edited by r6kunz -- 3/20/2019 3:26:50 AM >

(in reply to Iamstrategygame)
Post #: 15
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