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"Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR

 
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"Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 7/30/2018 10:27:00 PM   
dasboot1960


Posts: 339
Joined: 8/2/2009
From: St Augustine, Florida
Status: online 		I think I've figured out I'd rather see repliesto my myriad and sundry questions in one place.. I'm sure someone will tell me if I'm offbase. Another question...

Is 'combat' the best mode for engineers repairing damage to a captured facility? and, I don't suppose there is some way to have them focus on airbase repairs?

Yes, its Khota Baru, I wasn't sure how to best take it, so I shelled (with both CA and BB TFs that start nearby) and I got 'er boy, I guess that makes me the winner?

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RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 7/31/2018 12:35:47 AM   
rockmedic109

 

Posts: 2284
Joined: 5/17/2005
From: Citrus Heights, CA
Status: offline 		Yep. Combat mode for using engineers to repair things. Strategic and everything is all packed and everyone is standing in lines awaiting the next planeload of bombs coming it. Rest/training and they are all on lawn chairs sipping adult beverages with umbrellas in them.

And yep, you're the winner. Just remember she gets older and meaner every day.

(in reply to dasboot1960)
Post #: 2
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 7/31/2018 12:47:39 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 5188
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline 		Don't forget any bombers, it all adds to fatigue and disruption.

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RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 7/31/2018 1:20:09 AM   
geofflambert


Posts: 14205
Joined: 12/23/2010
From: St. Louis
Status: offline 		In case you don't know, if the enemy bombs your airbase or your port, your engineers will work to repair those regardless of anything you might wish, such as fortifying. You could put the in strategic mode but they still won't work on fortifying.

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Post #: 4
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 7/31/2018 8:03:28 AM   
Chris21wen

 

Posts: 5740
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quote:

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

In case you don't know, if the enemy bombs your airbase or your port, your engineers will work to repair those regardless of anything you might wish, such as fortifying. You could put the in strategic mode but they still won't work on fortifying.


Only way to stop fortifications from being built/repaired is to keep the base damaged.

(in reply to geofflambert)
Post #: 5
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 7/31/2018 5:49:33 PM   
rustysi


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From: LI, NY
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quote:

I don't suppose there is some way to have them focus on airbase repairs?


It is what is repaired first. The sequence goes: airstrip, airbase facilities, port.

quote:

Yes, its Khota Baru, I wasn't sure how to best take it, so I shelled (with both CA and BB TFs that start nearby) and I got 'er boy


Just an FYI. Its not that necessary to bombard most bases early in the game. The Allies are so weak you can just roll over them for the most part. Bombardment will just damage facilities that you will need to stage to for your further advancement, and that takes time that you don't have.

In addition to that it can also damage things that you really want undamaged, such as resource centers and oil fields/refineries. Damage these and it costs you 1000 supply per point of damage should you wish to repair.

_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to Chris21wen)
Post #: 6
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 7/31/2018 5:54:17 PM   
RangerJoe


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Status: offline 		That is why bombing the troops only would work better.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


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Post #: 7
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 7/31/2018 6:45:46 PM   
rustysi


Posts: 6039
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From: LI, NY
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quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

That is why bombing the troops only would work better.


A valid point, especially in the early game, but I was referring to naval bombardment above. Air bombardment in my experience doesn't damage facilities outside of the airfield if that is what they're set to do. However when it comes to a port attack they may damage ship yard facilities that may be in the port, as at Singers.


_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 8
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 7/31/2018 6:59:58 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 5188
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline 		I was referring to the invasion at Khota Baru and to any further invasions where there are not the resource, production, shipyards, and that might get damaged.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to rustysi)
Post #: 9
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 7/31/2018 7:14:30 PM   
rustysi


Posts: 6039
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From: LI, NY
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quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

I was referring to the invasion at Khota Baru and to any further invasions where there are not the resource, production, shipyards, and that might get damaged.


I get that, I was just stating for those who may not be aware of the possibilities or ramifications. My point about places like Kota Bharu is that Japanese LCU's may take these without having to damage the base itself with any type of attack. The only type of attack I would use is a ground bombardment from the air, if possible.


_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 10
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 7/31/2018 7:22:00 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 5188
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline 		I agree. We are both saying the same thing, just using different words.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to rustysi)
Post #: 11
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 7/31/2018 9:23:22 PM   
dasboot1960


Posts: 339
Joined: 8/2/2009
From: St Augustine, Florida
Status: online 		Thanks Rock! He's one of my all time favorites!

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Down like a CLOWN!

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Post #: 12
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 7/31/2018 9:25:36 PM   
dasboot1960


Posts: 339
Joined: 8/2/2009
From: St Augustine, Florida
Status: online 		Thanks all! I'll be more mindful of naval bombardment. That bullet hole in my toe kind of hurts

_____________________________

Down like a CLOWN!

(in reply to dasboot1960)
Post #: 13
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 7/31/2018 9:33:58 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 5188
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline 		You will need to include naval ships like BBs and cruisers if there are units with CD guns and/or Naval forts if you invade. They will provide counter battery fire and be a target - better that than a loaded transport.

Never load fuel on ships carrying troops. If it catches on fire, the troops with be BBQed.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to dasboot1960)
Post #: 14
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 8/1/2018 1:14:39 AM   
dasboot1960


Posts: 339
Joined: 8/2/2009
From: St Augustine, Florida
Status: online 		So. More etiquette. Should I pay pp for any Royal Thai force I want to cross out of Thailand (anywhere)? I have no idea of the historical uses of the forces.

_____________________________

Down like a CLOWN!

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Post #: 15
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 8/1/2018 1:38:03 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 5188
Joined: 11/16/2015
Status: offline 		Nope, let them be used in Burma for garrison and down into the Malay peninsula from what others have posted. I would also include Cambodia as well since they did have historical claims there as well.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to dasboot1960)
Post #: 16
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 8/1/2018 7:07:23 PM   
rustysi


Posts: 6039
Joined: 2/21/2012
From: LI, NY
Status: offline
quote:

Should I pay pp for any Royal Thai force I want to cross out of Thailand


Don't see a need for Burma, Malaya, Indochina. Again its up to your opponent and any other restrictions you may have about other theaters.

_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 17
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 8/5/2018 3:46:31 PM   
dasboot1960


Posts: 339
Joined: 8/2/2009
From: St Augustine, Florida
Status: online 		So - I just took Miri. The oil center button indicates (151)149. I assume this means all the wells are damaged? Even so, how 151 of 149?

_____________________________

Down like a CLOWN!

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Post #: 18
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 8/5/2018 3:50:43 PM   
dasboot1960


Posts: 339
Joined: 8/2/2009
From: St Augustine, Florida
Status: online 		ooooh! Trying to answer my own questions now... I managed to learn (Thank you industry screen) That Miri is producing 1490 oil points (a Day?) so I guess the 151 is damaged oil wells(centers)?

_____________________________

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Post #: 19
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 8/5/2018 4:00:01 PM   
btd64


Posts: 6854
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From: Mass. USA. now in OHIO
Status: online 		Yes....GP

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RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 8/5/2018 4:45:35 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 14426
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: dasboot1960

ooooh! Trying to answer my own questions now... I managed to learn (Thank you industry screen) That Miri is producing 1490 oil points (a Day?) so I guess the 151 is damaged oil wells(centers)?

Right. Miri and Brunei start with half their wells damaged to reflect oil fields under development. The Japanese player (and later the Allied one) needs to decide if he will hold the base long enough to make the investment of 1000 supply per well repaired pay off in oil produced. One well produces 10 oil per day.

< Message edited by BBfanboy -- 8/5/2018 4:46:02 PM >

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RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 8/5/2018 5:56:03 PM   
LargeSlowTarget


Posts: 4041
Joined: 9/23/2000
From: Hessen, Germany - now living in France
Status: offline 		Not oil fields under development, but oil fields sabotaged by the British as soon as the news of the PH attack was received. The British had established a "denial scheme" in early 1941, realizing they could not defend the area in case of war with Japan. They started reducing the oil output in August 41 so the Japanese would not find full oil tanks for the taking and prepared the demolition of the oil facilities.

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Post #: 22
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 8/5/2018 8:37:34 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 14426
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LargeSlowTarget

Not oil fields under development, but oil fields sabotaged by the British as soon as the news of the PH attack was received. The British had established a "denial scheme" in early 1941, realizing they could not defend the area in case of war with Japan. They started reducing the oil output in August 41 so the Japanese would not find full oil tanks for the taking and prepared the demolition of the oil facilities.

Ah-so! And they failed to sabotage the other half?

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

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RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 8/5/2018 8:53:03 PM   
dasboot1960


Posts: 339
Joined: 8/2/2009
From: St Augustine, Florida
Status: online 		I have read "Miri is a Problem". Presumably port size, am I correct to assume an IFFB consensus not to repair?

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RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 8/6/2018 6:29:51 AM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 14426
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
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quote:

ORIGINAL: dasboot1960

I have read "Miri is a Problem". Presumably port size, am I correct to assume an IFFB consensus not to repair?

It depends on your need for oil/fuel relative to your need for supply. Experienced JFBs say you always run out of supply at game end, but you also need a lot of fuel to move your ships and feed HI - which makes your most critical equipment. If you can capture supply somewhere, ship it to Miri to repair the oil.

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

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RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 8/6/2018 3:22:19 PM   
Yaab


Posts: 4080
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From: Poland
Status: offline 		BTW, "Continuing Chaos" sounds like the Taleban version of "Enduring Freedom".

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RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 8/6/2018 5:30:43 PM   
LargeSlowTarget


Posts: 4041
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From: Hessen, Germany - now living in France
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: LargeSlowTarget

Not oil fields under development, but oil fields sabotaged by the British as soon as the news of the PH attack was received. The British had established a "denial scheme" in early 1941, realizing they could not defend the area in case of war with Japan. They started reducing the oil output in August 41 so the Japanese would not find full oil tanks for the taking and prepared the demolition of the oil facilities.

Ah-so! And they failed to sabotage the other half?


It is probably difficult to destroy huge installations so completely that nothing at all remains behind to be repaired. The British evacuated essential equipment from Borneo to Singers - where Japan recaptured it - and blew-up some structures like the loading pipelines leading out to sea. But they could not destroy every single installation in the time remaining. This and the game mechanics of one repair point per day leads to the compromise we see in the game.


_____________________________


WitP AAR "Six Years of War"
AE Mod "Bottlenecks" UPDATED 04/2020

(in reply to BBfanboy)
Post #: 27
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 8/6/2018 7:34:47 PM   
rustysi


Posts: 6039
Joined: 2/21/2012
From: LI, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: dasboot1960

I have read "Miri is a Problem". Presumably port size, am I correct to assume an IFFB consensus not to repair?


Simple answer, you need oil, repair the facility. Don't repair the refinery. Here's how I do it. The port is rather small, so getting supply in and fuel/oil out can be slow. Therefore I land my supply at Brunei and take fuel/oil out of Miri. Miri will draw Brunei's excess oil, and Miri will draw supply from Brunei to accomplish its repair activities. You should be able to hold the base long enough to recover your 'expenses'.


_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to dasboot1960)
Post #: 28
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 8/6/2018 7:51:30 PM   
Lokasenna


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Status: offline 		You'll need to ship from both Miri and Brunei to handle the quantity of Oil/Fuel.

(in reply to rustysi)
Post #: 29
RE: "Continuing Chaos" - This is not an AAR - 8/6/2018 7:53:34 PM   
rustysi


Posts: 6039
Joined: 2/21/2012
From: LI, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

You'll need to ship from both Miri and Brunei to handle the quantity of Oil/Fuel.


Never had to yet, and I've no problem.


_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to Lokasenna)
Post #: 30
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