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Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch

 
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Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 7/5/2018 5:52:31 PM   
Dili

 

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In normal range.

In Dali's Husky he is testing the use of weapon filters for aircraft but for Naval search and ASW normal range weapons do not appear only extended range weapons appear as you can see in default load.


Anyone already faced this issue?




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< Message edited by Dili -- 7/5/2018 5:53:01 PM >


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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 7/5/2018 5:54:22 PM   
Dili

 

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Here is the weapon setup in editor. The only change is more or less number of bombs. Bomb type is the same.




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< Message edited by Dili -- 7/5/2018 5:55:29 PM >


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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 7/5/2018 7:04:43 PM   
btd64


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I have. In RHS. Could you post the first page showing the default load....GP

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 7/5/2018 8:36:41 PM   
inqistor


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Probably because planes in ASW, and Search missions, only use extended range bombloads.

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 7/6/2018 8:23:06 AM   
LargeSlowTarget


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Yes, inqistor is correct - not an issue, normal bombload is not being used for ASW / search, only reduced load.

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 7/6/2018 11:12:13 AM   
Dili

 

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I am testing it so i have not reached a conclusion yet but Dali's feedback says no weapons employed in that 2 missions.
As i think was asked by btd64




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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 7/28/2018 4:06:54 PM   
Dali101

 

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Again I thoroughly test and write the result. Dali

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 7/29/2018 12:24:14 PM   
Admiral DadMan


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Noticed something odd: I did not know that Naples was a city in Asia...

Seriously though, the filter value 4 (*n = Alt Naval) should not be used except for torpedo carrying aircraft, so Wpn 4's value should be just 2, not 6.

Also, as stated above, ASW missions only use ordinance specified for Extended Range missions, which I infer is your Wpn 17. Additionally, remember that ASW missions are limited to 1/2 the distance of Extended Range. In this case, Extended Range is 22 hexes, so your group will fly ASW out to 11 hexes.

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 7/30/2018 3:08:54 AM   
Dili

 

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Admiral DadMan the issue is that the aircraft does not use any weapons when not in extended range in ASW and Nv Search

When not using filters the field DEFAULT LOAD still have a weapon there for ASW and Nv Search. When using weapon filters there is nothing listed there.


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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 7/30/2018 9:01:31 AM   
el cid again

 

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This is correct. That is, it was posted years ago that was the intended way these routines work.

I guess the idea is that to achieve long range, one must carry a very limited load. Also, ASW is
very search intensive and range inefficient.

This means that the actual ASW load is the extended range load. I do not like it - but we cannot write
the code. If they wanted to cut range in half, they could have done that for normal range as well. But they
didn't.

So - even if an aircraft has NO extended range load - give it the ASW weapons at extended range anyway.

And understand that the normal ASW load is cosmetic - a record of the truth perhaps - but not functional
in game terms.

Search is similar but a bit more strange. Even an UNARMED search plane will score bomb hits occasionally! Or at least
lie and say it did.

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 7/30/2018 2:10:56 PM   
Dili

 

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Please read what i wrote el cid. How do explain a different behavior with no weapon filters and with weapon filters?
Why you can put an aircraft in normal range and do not hit anything with weapon filters in nv search and asw missions but you can without weapon filters?

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 7/30/2018 9:56:48 PM   
inqistor


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Heh, I just noticed something really weird. You have 4 bombs defined for ASW work, in both ranges, but first screen shows only TWO bombs in use. I'm pretty sure there is no build-in half bombload in code, so...

Is airbase big enough for this plane to fly with standard load? Do you have ALt Device set for 100kg GP Bomb? Maybe they have different weight, and it gets weirdly rounded? Do you observe same behaviour for other planes?

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 7/30/2018 10:30:21 PM   
Admiral DadMan


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dili

Admiral DadMan the issue is that the aircraft does not use any weapons when not in extended range in ASW and Nv Search

When not using filters the field DEFAULT LOAD still have a weapon there for ASW and Nv Search. When using weapon filters there is nothing listed there.



1. When you set your mission as ASW, then ONLY the weapons in your ASW filter will be displayed.
2. ASW missions are ONLY performed with Extended Range weapons, and are limited to 1/2 the Extended Range, in this case 11 Hexes.

Both screen shots you have posted tell me that you have set it up properly. You're not going to hit subs that you cannot see.

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 7/31/2018 8:52:34 AM   
LargeSlowTarget


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A screenshot of the weapons slots 11 - 20 might be helpful.

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 7/31/2018 9:14:14 AM   
witpqs


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Admiral DadMan


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dili

Admiral DadMan the issue is that the aircraft does not use any weapons when not in extended range in ASW and Nv Search

When not using filters the field DEFAULT LOAD still have a weapon there for ASW and Nv Search. When using weapon filters there is nothing listed there.



1. When you set your mission as ASW, then ONLY the weapons in your ASW filter will be displayed.
2. ASW missions are ONLY performed with Extended Range weapons, and are limited to 1/2 the Extended Range, in this case 11 Hexes.

Both screen shots you have posted tell me that you have set it up properly. You're not going to hit subs that you cannot see.

Good catch!

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 7/31/2018 9:14:47 PM   
Dili

 

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Explain why the aircraft data screen without filters shows up a weapon in default load in ASW and Nv Search?

You can check any aircraft that can do those missions in any game. Check a Dauntless a Catalina, an H6K, a Jake any bomber, all of them have default weapon in ASW or Nv Search mission. Click aircraft data, it is there the default load.

But when you employ weapon filters the default load is blank.

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 7/31/2018 10:16:51 PM   
Admiral DadMan


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dili

Explain why the aircraft data screen without filters shows up a weapon in default load in ASW and Nv Search?

You can check any aircraft that can do those missions in any game. Check a Dauntless a Catalina, an H6K, a Jake any bomber, all of them have default weapon in ASW or Nv Search mission. Click aircraft data, it is there the default load.

But when you employ weapon filters the default load is blank.


I can only guess that what you showed in the first screen shot is the Training/Rest mode which will show all weapons. The weapons shown for ASW under DEFAULT load are irrelevant. I don't know why they are listed.


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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 8/1/2018 4:25:08 AM   
Dili

 

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See all with configuration in post #2
Notice that also recon and transport show no bombs with weapon filters but that is not an issue obviously.




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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 8/1/2018 4:29:28 AM   
Dili

 

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In training shows all configs like shown in post #6

If it has Naval Attack and Port Attack as alternate mission it shows both configs.

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 8/1/2018 12:28:13 PM   
adarbrauner

 

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-

< Message edited by adarbrauner -- 8/1/2018 12:40:02 PM >

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 8/1/2018 2:59:06 PM   
Admiral DadMan


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dili

See all with configuration in post #2
Notice that also recon and transport show no bombs with weapon filters but that is not an issue obviously.



Not an issue because those missions don't use bombs.

All the panels of missions you posted look correct.

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 8/1/2018 5:39:20 PM   
Dili

 

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I have been making testing and they still did not dropped a bomb either in ASW or Nv Search , but further time is necessary to be sure.

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 8/1/2018 7:57:09 PM   
adarbrauner

 

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Dili, unfortunately I made same test for same results, but I don't think this is due to mission filter but rather to failed/very rare detection;

in any case counterprove can be provided by testing with default bombload (i.e. no filters) instead;

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 8/1/2018 8:29:46 PM   
Admiral DadMan


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dili

I have been making testing and they still did not dropped a bomb either in ASW or Nv Search , but further time is necessary to be sure.


Dropping a bomb is dependent on how well the target is spotted, i.e. its detection level (DL). Your NavSearch or ASW won't drop bombs on TF's/ships that aren't well detected. The problem (from what I can see) is not that your bombers aren't dropping bombs, but that they can't find targets to drop them on.

Low pilot skill/experience levels also will prevent attacks.

< Message edited by Admiral DadMan -- 8/1/2018 8:30:11 PM >


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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 8/1/2018 9:12:52 PM   
Dili

 

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My setup is that squadron and a Stuka sqd also with filters. I have put a couple stopped merchants(1 hex patrol) about 3 hexes from airbase - also submarines but those are more diffcult. They are detected but none was hit, but like i said i need to test more.

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 8/3/2018 8:23:28 AM   
Dali101

 

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That the filters do not work on the ASW mission and Naval search is mentioned in an earlier discussion.

I tried it two years ago. Missing primary aircraft equipment and no interventions. Try it out easily. You are deploying many boats and submarines around the airport, and you enter ASW and Naval search. In the original game, attacks and hits are immediately launched. (Most interventions do not have much effect, but that's another matter).
In a game with filters no interference... (we played about 30 turns, I think that's enough)

That's reality.


This is the main reason why I did not use filters in my mode. (with regret...)

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 8/5/2018 8:01:05 PM   
LargeSlowTarget


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I have made a test. Created two groups of Jakes with 48 a/c each and put them on Pescadores. One group flies standard Jake armed with 60kg GP bombs and no weapon filters. The other group is equipped with a Jake variant that is armed with type 99 depth bombs - pure chrome, it is the 60kg bomb renamed - and weapons filter 64 for ASW. Both groups are set to fly ASW at range 10 and 2k altitude. Then I switched to the Allies and sent the Manila subs to patrol around Formosa. Set the the turn cycle to "continous" and let the game run for two game months. Checked the US subs and found six subs in Manila with float damage. Three show "last hit by a 60kg GP bomb", the other three show "last hit by a type 99 depth bomb".

Conclusion: When filters and weapons are set-up correctly, the filters do work for ASW.

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 8/5/2018 10:44:03 PM   
Dili

 

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Thanks LST, ASW range you set is extended range 10, can you do the test with range 8 (default range) or less?

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 8/6/2018 3:28:18 AM   
witpqs


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dili

Thanks LST, ASW range you set is extended range 10, can you do the test with range 8 (default range) or less?

Why? ASW range is always halved.

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RE: Aircraft weapon filters not working for ASW/NvSearch - 8/6/2018 8:22:10 AM   
Dili

 

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yes but the fact that no weapons show in default load might mean they not have weapons if the user does not set the extended range. Anyway i also rebuild my test set and employing like LST continuous test, later today or tomorrow will have some results.

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