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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

 
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy? - 3/18/2020 1:44:16 PM   
fondfoat

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ETF


quote:

ORIGINAL: bcgames


quote:

ORIGINAL: sIg3b

Didn´t buy it, because the AI is generally said no to be cut-throat. I am only interested in SP and want a terribly strong Computer opponent.


We got the message on this one; Slitherine coached us to exert a soft AI-hand over The Player. Our intent now is to deliver the opponent back to the Stone Age. Let's see what we can do to make single-player less soft-handed.


Really glad you put resources into other things than an AI. I know that will draw flack but lets face I have been CPU wargaming since 83 and I have NEVER seen an AI that is better than an intermediate player even maybe not even that good. Usually, it is only good for tutorials unless you want to play a cheating AI. Just my two cents. Surely in this day in age you can find a worthy similar opponent.


Surely in this day and age, an AI should be very challenging!!

(in reply to ETF)
Post #: 181
RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy? - 3/19/2020 6:53:07 PM   
Saint Ruth


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Yes, I hear you. The more complicated the game though, the harder the AI is to do. Still, will be making continuous improvements with the AI as with everything else!
/Brian

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Post #: 182
RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy? - 3/28/2020 2:02:58 AM   
bcgames


Posts: 2352
Joined: 6/2/2010
From: Bramble Rose Farm, KS
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: fondfoat


quote:

ORIGINAL: ETF


quote:

ORIGINAL: bcgames


quote:

ORIGINAL: sIg3b

Didn´t buy it, because the AI is generally said no to be cut-throat. I am only interested in SP and want a terribly strong Computer opponent.


We got the message on this one; Slitherine coached us to exert a soft AI-hand over The Player. Our intent now is to deliver the opponent back to the Stone Age. Let's see what we can do to make single-player less soft-handed.


Really glad you put resources into other things than an AI. I know that will draw flack but lets face I have been CPU wargaming since 83 and I have NEVER seen an AI that is better than an intermediate player even maybe not even that good. Usually, it is only good for tutorials unless you want to play a cheating AI. Just my two cents. Surely in this day in age you can find a worthy similar opponent.


Surely in this day and age, an AI should be very challenging!!

You'd think that--but it's not the case. The US Army still uses Decisive Action, Crucible of Command, and Follow Me as training platforms from West Point Cadet to Captains in the Advance Course to Majors in the Command and General Staff Officer Course. Though they have a rudimentary AI, these training engines are human-vs-human game platforms. Why? Cuz AIs suck.

_____________________________


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Post #: 183
RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy? - 3/30/2020 5:38:07 PM   
fondfoat

 

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Not really AI that sucks, but the effort and resources required. The fact that an AI can beat excellent chess players gives you a clue as to what AI could do if we all had beasts of PCs at home. :)

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Post #: 184
RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy? - 3/31/2020 6:17:32 AM   
bcgames


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From: Bramble Rose Farm, KS
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"A serious problem in planning against American doctrine is that the Americans do not read their manuals, nor do they feel any obligation to follow their doctrine."

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Post #: 185
RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy? - 3/31/2020 6:21:14 AM   
bcgames


Posts: 2352
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From: Bramble Rose Farm, KS
Status: offline
"The reason the American Army does so well in wartime, is that war is chaos, and the American Army practices it on a daily basis."

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Post #: 186
RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy? - 3/31/2020 6:55:55 AM   
bcgames


Posts: 2352
Joined: 6/2/2010
From: Bramble Rose Farm, KS
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AI uses rules. Often Leaders/Armies don't use their own rules. This could be that they don't know them. It could be they know them, and change them when they don't apply to the situation. On the other hand, an army might goose-step exactly through their countries stated doctrine. Depends on the day, the unit/organization, and the commander.

More often than not, real human action defies the idea of artificial intelligence. If you assume your opponent is a professional you will be surprised when he kicks your ass because/while being--he is an amateur; opponents are under no obligation to play by any doctrinal rules. Heck, they might not know what they are.

In my opinion, that's why people say AI's suck. An AI that attempts to portray a particular nation's doctrine is a tough task. Why? Because 80% of any army's leadership does not understand the task and purpose of any operation they are directing. They're pulling it out of their ass as each minute passes. Some are good at this, others are not.

Combat is not chess or checkers; it's bedlam. Sometimes you eat the bear, sometimes the bear eats you. The last one to make a mistake wins.

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Post #: 187
RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy? - 6/14/2020 3:52:04 PM   
Numdydar

 

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I bought it with my Anniversary coupon. Just to support. Have hardly played it at all since there is no campaign. That was a BIG downside for me. I was really hoping for a Campaign for North Africa game but alas this was not it.

(in reply to bcgames)
Post #: 188
RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy? - 6/15/2020 4:56:44 AM   
countrboy

 

Posts: 205
Joined: 9/26/2015
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: Numdydar

I bought it with my Anniversary coupon. Just to support. Have hardly played it at all since there is no campaign. That was a BIG downside for me. I was really hoping for a Campaign for North Africa game but alas this was not it.


The Operational Art of War IV has a CFNA scenario which is very very good. You can play the entire campaign from the Italian invasion through to Rommel's retreat back to the Mareth Line.

(in reply to Numdydar)
Post #: 189
RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy? - 6/18/2020 4:36:40 AM   
bcgames


Posts: 2352
Joined: 6/2/2010
From: Bramble Rose Farm, KS
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Numdydar

I bought it with my Anniversary coupon. Just to support. Have hardly played it at all since there is no campaign. That was a BIG downside for me. I was really hoping for a Campaign for North Africa game but alas this was not it.

Thanks for your support! Thinking about how to do the Campaign for North Africa once again. I think the game engine will be able to make the attempt once Monty's Front capabilities have been realized.

_____________________________


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Post #: 190
RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy? - 6/18/2020 4:39:56 AM   
countrboy

 

Posts: 205
Joined: 9/26/2015
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: bcgames

Thanks for your support! Thinking about how to do the Campaign for North Africa once again. I think the game engine will be able to make the attempt once Monty's Front capabilities have been realized.


That would be great. I too was sad to see no campaign game, but I do recall the explanation that it wasn't possible. If that changes it would be excellent.

(in reply to bcgames)
Post #: 191
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