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Radar detector device? - 2/21/2018 12:53:35 AM   
Dili

 

Posts: 4647
Joined: 9/10/2004
Status: offline 		How does it work? what setting i should fill?

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RE: Radar detector device? - 2/22/2018 2:58:36 PM   
el cid again

 

Posts: 16859
Joined: 10/10/2005
Status: offline 		It is somewhat unclear and not documented in the manual. IF it works, the
values should be two digit numbers. These approximate % effectiveness. It
looks like it works in the crudest sense. Not in the detail sense I as
an ECM guy would prefer to see. Remember - "radar" is just a detection idea
with two variations - surface target and aircraft target. There is no
"frequency" or other technical specification. But there is RANGE! The
radar detector is similar. Its "range" should be just slightly greater than
the kind of radar you want to let it detect. Radar bends slightly and passive
detection ranges are greater than the two way echo location range of a radar, but
not by much unless you are in an airplane with your detector.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dili

How does it work? what setting i should fill?


(in reply to Dili)
Post #: 2
RE: Radar detector device? - 2/22/2018 4:23:06 PM   
spence

 

Posts: 5319
Joined: 4/20/2003
From: Vancouver, Washington
Status: offline 		This topic prompted a bit of quick research on the topic of radar detectors. It seems that the Germans and Brits waged an electronic war in WW2 that waxed and waned for each side. The introduction of radar for ASW aircraft initially resulted in lots of German subs getting attacked without warning while transiting the Bay of Biscay (late 1941). Then the Germans introduced the Metox radar detector which could detect the meter length wavelength of the ASV2 radar (early 42) so the Brits found that their targets dove as the plane approached. Meanwhile the Brit techies developed the magnetron X band 10 cm radar ASV3 (early 43) which meant the Uboats started getting attacked in transit again. Then the Germans developed the Naxos detector which deployed in late 43 so again the subs could detect an attacking plane before the plane could attack. Then the Allies deployed an even shorter wavelength radar in the ASV6 (3 cm - early 44) that the Germans couldn't detect so the Naxos became obsolete too. With everything going to heck the Germans never developed a replacement for the NAXOS (but they did finally produce some real submarines that could stay underwater where the ASV6 couldn't touch them).

< Message edited by spence -- 2/22/2018 4:24:04 PM >

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RE: Radar detector device? - 2/22/2018 5:43:16 PM   
Dili

 

Posts: 4647
Joined: 9/10/2004
Status: offline 		Yes the idea is to put Metox/Naxos in German and some late Italian submarines.

There were also some detectors in Allied patrol aircraft.

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Post #: 4
RE: Radar detector device? - 2/22/2018 8:03:09 PM   
US87891

 

Posts: 422
Joined: 1/2/2011
Status: offline 		No, it doesn't work. The code was never implemented. Forget it.

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RE: Radar detector device? - 2/22/2018 9:16:16 PM   
Dili

 

Posts: 4647
Joined: 9/10/2004
Status: offline 		Thanks US87891.

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RE: Radar detector device? - 2/27/2018 4:25:34 AM   
el cid again

 

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Joined: 10/10/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: US87891

No, it doesn't work. The code was never implemented. Forget it.


While this is also my understanding, at least the devices do not crash the game.
I see nothing wrong with creating correct devices for "flavor" that would work if
the hooks were implemented. Sooner or later someone may implement this "hook."

In any case, there is another way to get the job done. Japan discovered late in the
war that radar was better left in passive mode. For one thing, their transmitter tubes
and magnetrons (they independently invented them and built thousands of them) did not
last very long. But also by then the Allies were using a LOT of radar - so there were
LOTS of signals to intercept, direction find and identify. I simulate this by using
the radar device, setting the range to the typical detection range of the set in passive
mode, for certain types often used in this way.



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RE: Radar detector device? - 2/28/2018 8:23:05 AM   
Barb


Posts: 2503
Joined: 2/27/2007
From: Bratislava, Slovakia
Status: offline 		Actually the things were working both ways in Jap vs US radars.
In 1943 (maybe even late 1942?) the Japanese had detectors of radar emissions installed on some ships - so they new Americans were tracking them well before the US radars got their response back. It was also possible to track the enemy radar emissions relative bearing so the enemy course could be estimated.

Later these detectors and radars got also on ground and escort ships - and US subs didn't have their radars turned on at all time - they used short sweeps when on patrol (say two full circles every 15 minutes or so). Another tactic used was to sweep only a limited area of 360deg circle - if you know the convoy was there, you did one or two sweeps of the section to get the picture, and compare it with previous records - to get the zig-plan, general course, speed, etc. No need to alert every enemy ship and ground station in double the range of your radar that you are there...

If the radar sweeps were short enough, they could escape being noticed by enemy operators/equipment. However this goes mostly for Search mode of the radars. When on target tracking/range detection then you want your radar locked on target and keep it. Not much need to hide when you are firing on the enemy...

< Message edited by Barb -- 2/28/2018 8:25:00 AM >

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RE: Radar detector device? - 3/5/2018 7:51:38 PM   
el cid again

 

Posts: 16859
Joined: 10/10/2005
Status: offline 		There is a great deal to radar tactics. There also was little expertise in WW2, and a lot of misconceptions.
Savo Island, occurring very early, is a case of total failure to exploit radar successfully. Even when it worked,
the equipment was not trusted to give useful information by senior officers.

The range of detection of a radar is not really twice the radar's range. For a surface sensor, the range is
typically only about 10% better, and theoretically about 20% better. [For an aircraft sensor, it could be
about 200% though] These values assume EQUAL signal sensitivity, but that would not really often be true. Japanese
equipment rarely used the latest ideas, and were not very sensitive. As well, Allied radars would generally be more
powerful. So it gets complicated fast: the more powerful radars could be heard farther away. But the less sensitive
receiver equipment would not detect as far away. For a surface vs surface case, however, things simplify: usually
the horizon limits you, not power or sensitivity. So a passive ECM intercept is in practical terms 110% the practical
detection range of the radar - just as it remains today.

FYI

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Post #: 9
RE: Radar detector device? - 3/10/2018 9:37:29 PM   
Aawulf

 

Posts: 115
Joined: 7/14/2005
Status: offline 		Is also that searchlights and lookouts are just flavor and have no practical use in the game?

Thanks in advance.

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Post #: 10
RE: Radar detector device? - 3/11/2018 3:09:00 PM   
Dili

 

Posts: 4647
Joined: 9/10/2004
Status: offline 		Searchlights are load cost only, lookouts as in observor? they are classed as radar with shorter range so they have a function

(in reply to Aawulf)
Post #: 11
RE: Radar detector device? - 3/12/2018 6:31:38 PM   
Aawulf

 

Posts: 115
Joined: 7/14/2005
Status: offline 		Thanks for response, Dili. But I am confused. Above, there are several comments sharing that the code for radar was never implemented. Or I am reading it wrong.

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Never ever ever ever let a day pass without remembering that we are fighting a war for our survival. God bless our troops.

(in reply to Dili)
Post #: 12
RE: Radar detector device? - 3/12/2018 7:48:45 PM   
Dili

 

Posts: 4647
Joined: 9/10/2004
Status: offline 		The code for radar detector(detection of radar sources) is not implemented but the code for radar is.

(in reply to Aawulf)
Post #: 13
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