Matrix Games Forums

Forums  Register  Login  Photo Gallery  Member List  Search  Calendars  FAQ 

My Profile  Inbox  Address Book  My Subscription  My Forums  Log Out

HQ Support Units

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Gary Grigsby's War in the West >> HQ Support Units Page: [1]
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
HQ Support Units - 12/10/2017 2:24:29 PM   
BK6583

 

Posts: 411
Joined: 10/8/2002
Status: offline
I played WiTE for well over a year and am now playing WiTW. I'm still learning all the nuances of these excellent games. Something I never paid much attention to but now has got me rethinking things are the HQ support units (not the combat support units). If I understand the rules, these support units can be used to support combat units by 'converting' a certain portion to combat squads to support said combat units. The exception seems to be if the supporting HQ is 'locked'. Locking HQs has been my standard practice since WiTE to keep combat SUs from 'wandering' amongst other HQs. I don't feel like constantly micromanaging HQs in setting them to '0' or some other number. So my question is how much am I hurting myself in ground combat in using 'locked' and therefore preventing HQ support units from providing additional combat support to combat units?
Post #: 1
RE: HQ Support Units - 12/10/2017 3:25:43 PM   
loki100


Posts: 10683
Joined: 10/20/2012
From: Utlima Thule
Status: offline
Its worth picking this apart.

Support Squads are allocated by HQs and make up for missing support in the combat formations. To me these represent a range of things from logistics support to field hospitals to catering staff. If you look at a HQ (the detail screen), you'll see data on the number of support squads needed and used in that command, as:

Total Support: Total support used (organic plus HQ help) by units in the chain of command under this HQ during last log phase.
Total Support Need: Total support needed by units in the chain of command under this HQ during last log phase.
Organic Support: Total available support squads in units in the chain of command under this HQ during last log phase

Now if a combat unit lacks support squads it will try to access them from HQs within the command radius of the HQ (5 for corps, 15 for army, 45 for Army Group and 90 for high level HQs).

This is automatic (allocations happen in the logistics phase) and not connected with the HQ being locked.

Practically the 3 armies across WiTE/W are very different. The Soviets have major gaps at the divisional level and are utterly reliant on HQ support squads to function, the W Allies are fairly well equipped at divisional level and the Germans sit between the two. The Western Allies pay a price in that their divisions demand much more supply etc than a Soviet or German formation.

Support Units are artillery/engineers etc etc etc. If you lock your commands, these must be allocated manually and don't wander up and down the command chain.

_____________________________


(in reply to BK6583)
Post #: 2
RE: HQ Support Units - 12/11/2017 12:15:47 AM   
Lovenought

 

Posts: 187
Joined: 8/21/2017
Status: offline

quote:

Support Units are artillery/engineers etc etc etc. If you lock your commands, these must be allocated manually and don't wander up and down the command chain.


If a Corps HQ is locked, will it still automatically send it's Combat Units to support divisions in combat? Is Artillery different than other Combat SUs?

(in reply to loki100)
Post #: 3
RE: HQ Support Units - 12/11/2017 3:59:53 AM   
RealChuckB


Posts: 284
Joined: 9/29/2003
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: loki100

Its worth picking this apart.

Support Squads are allocated by HQs and make up for missing support in the combat formations. To me these represent a range of things from logistics support to field hospitals to catering staff. If you look at a HQ (the detail screen), you'll see data on the number of support squads needed and used in that command, as:

Total Support: Total support used (organic plus HQ help) by units in the chain of command under this HQ during last log phase.
Total Support Need: Total support needed by units in the chain of command under this HQ during last log phase.
Organic Support: Total available support squads in units in the chain of command under this HQ during last log phase

Now if a combat unit lacks support squads it will try to access them from HQs within the command radius of the HQ (5 for corps, 15 for army, 45 for Army Group and 90 for high level HQs).

This is automatic (allocations happen in the logistics phase) and not connected with the HQ being locked.

Practically the 3 armies across WiTE/W are very different. The Soviets have major gaps at the divisional level and are utterly reliant on HQ support squads to function, the W Allies are fairly well equipped at divisional level and the Germans sit between the two. The Western Allies pay a price in that their divisions demand much more supply etc than a Soviet or German formation.

Support Units are artillery/engineers etc etc etc. If you lock your commands, these must be allocated manually and don't wander up and down the command chain.


Hi loki100

Does it matter for the automatic allocation of support units if the HQs to whom these SUs are assigned moved in the same turn or not? It was my understanding that it does and that the chances of a successful allocation is lower if the HQ has moved. For that reason, I always thought that it made sense early in the WitE campaign as the Germans to assign all SUs to the to actual division that are spreading out so fast to ensure they become active, as you'll likely have (a) the HQ move with the divisions to stay close enough (in which case the HQ will have (likely) moved when the divisions fight) or (b) the HQ lag behind, mostly of out of range.


(in reply to loki100)
Post #: 4
RE: HQ Support Units - 12/11/2017 6:11:17 AM   
loki100


Posts: 10683
Joined: 10/20/2012
From: Utlima Thule
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lovenought


quote:

Support Units are artillery/engineers etc etc etc. If you lock your commands, these must be allocated manually and don't wander up and down the command chain.


If a Corps HQ is locked, will it still automatically send it's Combat Units to support divisions in combat? Is Artillery different than other Combat SUs?


Yes, locking the HQ simply means you have decided to take manual command over the allocation of Support Units. It has no impact on the allocation by the HQ to support combat/engineering operations. Artillery is the same as others, key difference is they cannot be assigned directly to combat units so must stay at the HQ level

quote:

ORIGINAL: RealChuckB


...

Hi loki100

Does it matter for the automatic allocation of support units if the HQs to whom these SUs are assigned moved in the same turn or not? It was my understanding that it does and that the chances of a successful allocation is lower if the HQ has moved. For that reason, I always thought that it made sense early in the WitE campaign as the Germans to assign all SUs to the to actual division that are spreading out so fast to ensure they become active, as you'll likely have (a) the HQ move with the divisions to stay close enough (in which case the HQ will have (likely) moved when the divisions fight) or (b) the HQ lag behind, mostly of out of range.




There are two specific rules for HQ movement and SU commitment:

quote:

HQ units that have not moved during the current player-turn have an increased chance of committing support units to battle. If the attack is a hasty attack then only HQs which have not moved can commit Support Units.


So in that sense, yes it is better to either have static HQs or direct to unit attachment. But I don't think this is the only way to frame the issue.

As a start, if the corps HQ is more than 5 hexes away you lose the various command bonuses as well as any chance of SU assignment. So, I'd tend to keep the HQs in range, even at the risk of lower SU allocation. Not least in this sort of situation, I'd assume the front is very mobile and you are not fighting to breakthrough but to dislodge a particular enemy unit that is in the way?

Clearly if you are planning a set piece offensive against a well defended position then you'll have your HQs already in range so as to maximise assignment etc.

As to the wider issue of corps assignment vs unit assignment. I change my mind every time I play one of these games. The advantage is clear and if its the sort of unit that is going to be in combat most turns then I will probably directly assign some useful Support Units. But even so, a well led corps will pass the assignment checks most of the time so you can trust the auto-system (and you will have your best combat units under your best commanders).

On the other hand, SUs in Combat Units are in addition to the cap on SU assignment from HQ, so a mix of the two can be very useful to maximise combat power.



< Message edited by loki100 -- 12/11/2017 6:12:30 AM >


_____________________________


(in reply to RealChuckB)
Post #: 5
Page:   [1]
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Gary Grigsby's War in the West >> HQ Support Units Page: [1]
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

0.195