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RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obvert (A)

 
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RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 10:21:22 PM   
Lowpe


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Ok, the first turn is away, and it is a pretty standard one.

I am bombing Manila and Georgetown ports as our HR allow that. Never did that before. The Allies can change CAP percentage, but I am not sure if he can put planes from training to CAP. I guess we will find out shortly.

Pearl results are always disappointing, so I will be closely checking the damage done to see if I can make follow up strikes. I have a few ideas, and today I positioned the Iboat fleet there so that if I do stay, any Allied fleets will have to run the gauntlet to get to me.

Force Z is always a huge concern...but short of stripping the Pearl strike, there isn't much I can do about it but I did try two things.

Hopefully I will have a few surprises for this wiley Admiral I am facing. Here is hoping!


(in reply to Xargun)
Post #: 31
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 1:41:31 AM   
Bif1961


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Have looking forward to what comes of this contest.

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Post #: 32
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 1:15:24 PM   
Lowpe


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A look at the Pearl Strike...

First off, I brought the plane strength up by adding reserves. I would like the option of sticking around Pearl for subsequent days, and quite frankly the squadrons aren't full.

Secondly, strafing fighter really kills good pilots. Instead, I put several Sentai on Airfield strike at 9K, and I also put two Val Sentai's with the same settings.

Third: I changed a lot of commanders.

All the Kates are dropping bombs or torpedoes on the port or ships at 9K.

Not that I think it helps, as far as I can tell, but I put some Jakes on recon. I wonder if night recon would have flown too, now that I think about it.

We shall see shortly how it all works out.




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< Message edited by Lowpe -- 3/15/2017 1:36:03 PM >

(in reply to Bif1961)
Post #: 33
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 1:34:57 PM   
Andav

 

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I like the Vals on Airbase strike. If you really plan to stick around the airfield needs to be suppressed. Plus you might kill some of the PBYs. It will be interesting to see how the Zeros do bombing. Do they have any skill for that mission?

Wa

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 34
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 1:35:14 PM   
Lowpe


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House Rules:


Night bombing port/airfield:

50 planes/target for the entire war.

First turn:

No restrictions on port strikes for IJ
No new TFs for Allies but existing may move
No air groups changing location, but can change CAP settings (Allies)
No crazy deep *TF moves (Mersing) (Japan)

PP for borders:

Minus Thai and Burmese units


Both Obvert and I have been around the block, and we know ways to really take advantage of the game engine. He originally sent me a rather lengthy list of HR from his previous games telling me he was open to lots. No way would I remember them all, so we paired it down.

Originally there was restrictions on 4E bombing of ground troops; Sweep Altitudes; Night bombing by year; and a list of things I can't even begin to remember. I couldn't live with that.

HR add confusion. For example take this HR:

No air groups changing location, but can change CAP settings (Allies)

What exactly does changing CAP settings entail? I could care less, and will trust to my opponent to give me a good and challenging game without resulting to exploits.

So, if Obvert wants to train up some Navy 4E's at skip bombing...he can. Plaster my troops with low level 4E bombing -- what game would be complete without that, I ask you? If I want to skip a generation in plane research I can.

I have always picked up the HR present from the previous Japanese player and lived with them. For the first time, I have to worry about protecting Chinese industry in Japanese hands. This creates a whole new decision tree...and I love it!






(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 35
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 1:39:12 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Andav


I like the Vals on Airbase strike. If you really plan to stick around the airfield needs to be suppressed. Plus you might kill some of the PBYs. It will be interesting to see how the Zeros do bombing. Do they have any skill for that mission?

Wa



Average skill of 35 across those squadrons.

PBY are easy to damage, hard to kill.

Plane torpedoes in this mod take a bit of a nerfing. So I doubt any BB sink...

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 3/15/2017 1:40:03 PM >

(in reply to Andav)
Post #: 36
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 1:45:43 PM   
Lowpe


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Midget Subs:

I toyed around with the idea of sending some or all midgets to Lahania. I love my midgets, and quite frankly, penetrating Pearl is very difficult -- especially when only one midget commander is any good.

Ultimately, I decided to send them all in where they will all fail.

Can't have Dec 7th without a midget strike on Pearl. It's just not done.




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(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 37
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 1:50:51 PM   
Lowpe


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The game that could have been:

We looked at two different games: Scen 1 type game with PDU on; Scen 2 type game with PDU off.

If we would have played scen 2, pdu off, I told Obvert I wanted to go into the editor and allow for some squadron upgrades so the Norm, Myrt NF, Ki115a & b and a few other plane types could actually participate in the game.

But, Obvert felt that he wanted to face the Japanese in a PDU on environment so that is what we went with.

In a Scen 2, game, my strategy was to take New Zealand and Isolate Oz. The game that could have been.


(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 38
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 2:24:55 PM   
ny59giants


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In Scen 2 or DBB 30, I've always wondered if an 'all in' for India could work.

Mersing gambit leads to Singapore falling by 10 Jan.

Ceylon landing (northern base first) by end of Jan '42. Just enough to get a AF and keep maybe two divisions here for conquest.

Coastal India - by mid-Feb landing at bases between Bombay and Karachi with direct assault on Karachi. Player would need to take bases to isolate Aden. The emergency reinforcements would stay there until Suez is open in '43.

Just my thoughts here....

_____________________________


(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 39
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 2:29:16 PM   
Encircled


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My current game my opponent went all for Oz in Scenario Two.

I just don't think its possible as long as the allied player prepares for an attack on India or Oz.

If you could somehow feint him for about a month, so anything he has got spare is completely the wrong place it might work.

The big advantage of going for India is the utter rubbish of the starting Indian Army.

_____________________________


(in reply to ny59giants)
Post #: 40
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 2:35:52 PM   
Lowpe


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Operation TayTay:

A deviation from the opening programmed moves. Not without risk, since those destroyers provide a fair bit of ASW to the invasion at Khota Baru.

Japan is really hamstrung in the opening with the lack of AD, AKE.

This operation will get me a fully functioning size 1 runway with some aviation support on Dec 8. It will also be able to provide some level of destroyer re-supply and an empty merchants can provide fuel from their bunkers.








Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 3/15/2017 2:36:18 PM >

(in reply to Encircled)
Post #: 41
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 2:38:59 PM   
Lowpe


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I ruled out the full in to India because Obvert was just thru that with GreyJoy. Obvert proved a master in removing supply, oil and fuel before the Japanese could take it.

I don't think it is possible to take Karachi. I just don't see the path there. At least not against Obvert.

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 42
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 2:44:18 PM   
Lowpe


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PP expenditures turn 1:

I bought out a large transport sentai.

I changed many many leaders. Ship captains of warships. At least one HQa leader.

Command level prep beginning for Changsha and Singapore.


(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 43
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 2:51:37 PM   
Lowpe


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Turn two concerns:

In no particular order:

1. Dutch subs, S boats
2. Force Z, British DD at Hong Kong, American Cruisers and DD.
3. Torpedo planes: single engine from Singers; PBY and Dutch patrols everywhere.
4. Mines
5. Cap traps
6. Big sortie from Pearl aimed at the KB
7. Whither the Yank CVs go?
8. PT boats at Manila
9. Port strikes with B17s.

Of course, concerns also present opportunities, too.

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 44
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 3:42:10 PM   
Xargun

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

PP expenditures turn 1:

I bought out a large transport sentai.

I changed many many leaders. Ship captains of warships. At least one HQa leader.

Command level prep beginning for Changsha and Singapore.


Check the leaders for your Air HQs - a lot of them are terrible with air skills in the 30's. In my game I spent like 300+ PPs on turn 1 just replacing leaders. Lots of bad leaders everywhere.


(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 45
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 3:45:53 PM   
Xargun

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Turn two concerns:
9. Port strikes with B17s.


Careful with Saigon and CRB - easy port strikes from Singers. Takeo and Pescadores can be hit from Clark as well.

Also, Mr Kane put some P-40s at Wenchow in my game and hit shipping coming from Home Islands towards PI or Malaya. They caught one unescorted TF costing me a small LCU. So make sure you steer your TFs south of Okinawa to avoid Wenchow until you take the base.



(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 46
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 3:49:02 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Xargun


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

PP expenditures turn 1:

I bought out a large transport sentai.

I changed many many leaders. Ship captains of warships. At least one HQa leader.

Command level prep beginning for Changsha and Singapore.


Check the leaders for your Air HQs - a lot of them are terrible with air skills in the 30's. In my game I spent like 300+ PPs on turn 1 just replacing leaders. Lots of bad leaders everywhere.




In this mod, I only had to change out 1 I believe, maybe two.

(in reply to Xargun)
Post #: 47
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 3:50:58 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Xargun


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Turn two concerns:
9. Port strikes with B17s.


Careful with Saigon and CRB - easy port strikes from Singers. Takeo and Pescadores can be hit from Clark as well.

Also, Mr Kane put some P-40s at Wenchow in my game and hit shipping coming from Home Islands towards PI or Malaya. They caught one unescorted TF costing me a small LCU. So make sure you steer your TFs south of Okinawa to avoid Wenchow until you take the base.



I hope he does put them there. The P40s can be nasty, especially if given a few days training and new leaders. But I don't think he will. Flying P40s from Luzon to a besieged Chinese town isn't something I think the Allies will do in this game.

Wenchow will be getting a visit from the big girls very shortly.

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 3/15/2017 3:51:58 PM >

(in reply to Xargun)
Post #: 48
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 4:38:51 PM   
Aurorus

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Turn two concerns:

In no particular order:

1. Dutch subs, S boats
2. Force Z, British DD at Hong Kong, American Cruisers and DD.
3. Torpedo planes: single engine from Singers; PBY and Dutch patrols everywhere.
4. Mines
5. Cap traps
6. Big sortie from Pearl aimed at the KB
7. Whither the Yank CVs go?
8. PT boats at Manila
9. Port strikes with B17s.

Of course, concerns also present opportunities, too.



Don't forget the British DDs and PTs at Hong Kong. They can form themselves up and come in the "back door" to hit any Luzon landing, or even park themselves in the shipping lanes from Takao. I like to get the Vals off the Home island over there on turn 1 or 2 to give those DDs the whatfor.

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 49
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/15/2017 5:45:51 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aurorus


Don't forget the British DDs and PTs at Hong Kong. They can form themselves up and come in the "back door" to hit any Luzon landing, or even park themselves in the shipping lanes from Takao. I like to get the Vals off the Home island over there on turn 1 or 2 to give those DDs the whatfor.


I made provisions for them on turn 1.

(in reply to Aurorus)
Post #: 50
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/16/2017 12:21:40 PM   
Lowpe


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I went back and read some of the opening pages of the Elephant Vanishes. My goodness, Obvert and I think a lot alike....which is going to make for a really strange game.


(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 51
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/16/2017 12:47:58 PM   
Lowpe


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This is a simulation:

Here is a test run of the Pearl Strike with my settings. Normally, I only get around 24 torpedo hits and 100 PBY damage. This time, I put a Jake squadron on night recon of Pearl too.

Amazing number of torpedo hits...

Morning Air attack on Pearl Harbor , at 180,107

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid detected at 116 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 38 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 106
B5N2 Kate x 144
D3A1 Val x 131

Allied aircraft
no flights

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 1 destroyed by flak
B5N2 Kate: 18 damaged
B5N2 Kate: 4 destroyed by flak
D3A1 Val: 7 damaged

Allied aircraft losses
PBY-5 Catalina: 130 damaged
PBY-5 Catalina: 5 destroyed on ground
B-17E Fortress: 11 damaged
B-17D Fortress: 30 damaged
B-17D Fortress: 1 destroyed on ground
P-36A Mohawk: 11 damaged
P-36A Mohawk: 1 destroyed on ground
SBD-1 Dauntless: 23 damaged
SBD-1 Dauntless: 2 destroyed on ground
O-47A: 8 damaged
O-47A: 1 destroyed on ground
P-40B Warhawk: 26 damaged
P-40B Warhawk: 3 destroyed on ground
C-33: 2 damaged
B-18A Bolo: 41 damaged
B-18A Bolo: 1 destroyed on ground
A-20A Havoc: 29 damaged
A-20A Havoc: 1 destroyed on ground
F4F-3 Wildcat: 8 damaged
F4F-3 Wildcat: 1 destroyed on ground
R3D-2: 1 damaged
SOC-1 Seagull: 3 destroyed

Allied Ships
BB Oklahoma, Bomb hits 4, Torpedo hits 5, on fire, heavy damage
BB Arizona, Bomb hits 2, Torpedo hits 8, heavy damage
BB Pennsylvania, Bomb hits 9, Torpedo hits 5, on fire
BB Tennessee, Bomb hits 4, Torpedo hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
BB California, Torpedo hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
DMS Wasmuth, Torpedo hits 1, heavy damage
BB Nevada, Bomb hits 3, Torpedo hits 3, on fire, heavy damage
BB West Virginia, Bomb hits 2, Torpedo hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
SS Cachalot, Torpedo hits 1, heavy damage
CL Detroit, Bomb hits 1, Torpedo hits 1, on fire
DD Tucker, Bomb hits 1, on fire
BB Maryland, Bomb hits 2, Torpedo hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
DD Monaghan, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
DD Selfridge, Torpedo hits 1
CA San Francisco, Bomb hits 1, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
SS Narwhal, Bomb hits 1, heavy damage

Airbase hits 31
Airbase supply hits 2
Runway hits 79
Port hits 27
Port fuel hits 4
Port supply hits 2

Aircraft Attacking:
17 x A6M2 Zero bombing from 9000 feet
Airfield Attack: 2 x 60 kg GP Bomb
8 x D3A1 Val releasing from 1000'
Port Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb
27 x B5N2 Kate launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Port Attack: 1 x 45cm Type 91 Torp
18 x A6M2 Zero bombing from 9000 feet
Airfield Attack: 2 x 60 kg GP Bomb
5 x D3A1 Val releasing from 1000'
Port Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb
24 x B5N2 Kate launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Port Attack: 1 x 45cm Type 91 Torp
5 x D3A1 Val releasing from 2000'
Port Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb
16 x B5N2 Kate launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Port Attack: 1 x 45cm Type 91 Torp
18 x A6M2 Zero sweeping at 10000 feet
4 x D3A1 Val releasing from 2000'
Port Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb
18 x B5N2 Kate bombing from 9000 feet
Port Attack: 1 x 800 kg AP Bomb
18 x A6M2 Zero bombing from 9000 feet
Airfield Attack: 2 x 60 kg GP Bomb
27 x D3A1 Val bombing from 9000 feet
Airfield Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb
26 x B5N2 Kate launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Port Attack: 1 x 45cm Type 91 Torp
27 x D3A1 Val bombing from 9000 feet
Airfield Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb
27 x B5N2 Kate launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Port Attack: 1 x 45cm Type 91 Torp
2 x D3A1 Val releasing from 1000'
City Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb
11 x D3A1 Val releasing from 3000'
Port Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb
8 x D3A1 Val releasing from 3000'
Port Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb
8 x D3A1 Val releasing from 1000'
Port Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb
6 x D3A1 Val releasing from 2000'
Port Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb
3 x D3A1 Val releasing from 2000'
Port Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb
5 x D3A1 Val releasing from 3000'
Port Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb
4 x D3A1 Val releasing from 3000'
Port Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb
4 x D3A1 Val releasing from 1000'
Port Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb
4 x D3A1 Val releasing from 2000'
City Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb

Magazine explodes on CA San Francisco

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 52
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/16/2017 12:50:51 PM   
Lowpe


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However none of the 8 sink....to me this means you have to stick around Pearl to try and farm some VP. But the danger, the danger is there in Cruisers, Light Cruisers and plentiful destroyers.






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(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 53
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/16/2017 12:55:07 PM   
Lowpe


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Conclusion: Can't really make one after only running one simulation, but I would say it is definitely worth the clicks to assign two Jake squadrons to recon of Pearl. One at night and one during the day.

Another option would be to assign them an Airfield strike at 9000 feet.


(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 54
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/16/2017 1:35:48 PM   
Andav

 

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So most of the torpedo hits were FOW. 8 on Arizona and only 65 Float. Nice almost all the Kates carried torpedoes as well. It would be interesting to track this based on recon or no recon to see if detection level changed the number of groups carrying torpedoes. Go ahead and run another 100 tests each way for us and let us know the results! Thanks!

What was the real number for damaged PBYs?

quote:

Another option would be to assign them an Airfield strike at 9000 feet.


You are talking about Jakes here right? I think this might be a good idea at least for a part of the groups.

Wa

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 55
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/16/2017 1:46:05 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Andav


So most of the torpedo hits were FOW. 8 on Arizona and only 65 Float. Nice almost all the Kates carried torpedoes as well. It would be interesting to track this based on recon or no recon to see if detection level changed the number of groups carrying torpedoes. Go ahead and run another 100 tests each way for us and let us know the results! Thanks!

What was the real number for damaged PBYs?

quote:

Another option would be to assign them an Airfield strike at 9000 feet.


You are talking about Jakes here right? I think this might be a good idea at least for a part of the groups.

Wa



I always thought the 800kg bomb was leadership and nothing else, but I could see how recon might influence the roll.

Yes, I was talking about the Jakes...there are only 4 of them, but it is a chance to drop 16 more bombs and they will join the raid. However, they also have the best recon pilots available without pulling to reserve and re-assigning.

Each hit on a PBY counts, but I think only 10 or so were destroyed. There was still 100 Yank Fighters ready to fly on Dec 8, but the runway suffered 60% damage which is 20% higher than no night recon averaged.

Kates took it on the chin, with all the torpedo runs...losing 14. So there is something to be said for the 800KG.

I can find no evidence in game that there is a night recon phase at all. I do see the day recon flight, and when I did it with Petes, it was after the strike. I think it might be interesting to put all patrols on recon and see what happens...plus the Glens within range.





(in reply to Andav)
Post #: 56
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/16/2017 2:00:57 PM   
Lowpe


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Toka and Ki115a

Still looking at the Judy and Jill versus the Toka. Tracker is a little wonky on upgrade paths...



< Message edited by Lowpe -- 3/16/2017 2:03:34 PM >

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 57
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/16/2017 2:17:31 PM   
Lowpe


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The Japanese Economy at game start. I already spent almost 300,000 supply expanding vehicles and engines.

I want to expand Light Industry in this game. More details coming after turn 1.




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(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 58
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/16/2017 2:38:36 PM   
Xargun

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

The Japanese Economy at game start. I already spent almost 300,000 supply expanding vehicles and engines.

I want to expand Light Industry in this game. More details coming after turn 1.


Any ideas of where you would expand? Don't think expanding in the Home Islands would help that much as you just have to haul more resources home - thus use more fuel. But perhaps in southern China, Kwangtung or even Luzon might work. Provided you don't have to haul resources there.

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 59
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/16/2017 2:39:57 PM   
Xargun

 

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Interested in your Naval and merchant ship plans - what are you accelerating and stopping ?

(in reply to Xargun)
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