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"Sudden Death" - Axis Major Victory 28 September 1942

 
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"Sudden Death" - Axis Major Victory 28 Septem... - 12/6/2016 8:56:32 PM   
Hotschi


Posts: 548
Joined: 1/18/2010
From: Austria
Status: offline

My full 1939 campaign as Allies suddenly ended 28 September 1942 with an Axis Major Victory, while my situation in Egypt stabilized and the U.S. was shipping it's Armies to occupy Algeria. I left the USSR to the AI. Leningrad and Stalingrad were swept clear by Germany and occupied with limited resistance. Only at Moscow, the USSR AI did offer some resistance. The game ended when Moscow was occupied by the Axis (err, it was, of all things, an Italian Tank Corps) and on the next turn the USSR failed to liberate it - in fact it didn't even try but attacked surrounding hexes, but NOT Moscow...

Here's the manual;

quote:


Winning the War – Victory Conditions

The Allies will win an Allied Decisive Victory if at any point they control Berlin, Rome,
Warsaw, Paris, London, Moscow and Washington D.C.

For an Axis Decisive Victory, the Axis need to capture Paris, Warsaw, Cairo, London,
Moscow, Leningrad and Stalingrad, while also retaining Berlin and Rome.

Conditions where the Allies can offer terms to end the war:

. When the USA is Allied but France and the USSR have surrendered and London is in
Axis hands, and there are no Allied units within 6 hexes of Paris or Nantes.
. When the USA is Allied but France, the USSR and Egypt have surrendered, and there
are no Allied units within 6 hexes of Paris or Nantes.
. When Moscow, Leningrad and Stalingrad are in Axis hands and France has
surrendered, and there are no Allied units within 6 hexes of Paris or Nantes.

Germany will then be able to consider accepting peace, and if they do then the result will
be an Axis Major Victory.


Tip! If you wish to play on even when the above Victory Conditions have been met, turn
off all Victory scripts by going to Options -> Advanced -> Scripts.


As I understand it, when condition 3 applies - as in my case - I, as Allies, can offer to quit, but this was not the case, the game simply ended. Is this intended?

Anyway, I've learned a lesson; don't let Russia be played by the AI, for multiple reasons; it doesn't seem to upgrade its units, it doesn't seem to attempt to build up a frontline, and it doesn't care about holding its three most important cities.

Lesson #2 is to search for the script responsible for this "mess" about a sudden Major Axis Victory; I wanted to fight on as Britain and US...

_____________________________

"A big butcher's bill is not necessarily evidence of good tactics"

- Wavell's reply to Churchill, after the latter complained about faint-heartedness, as he discovered that British casualties in the evacuation from Somaliland had been only 260 men.
Post #: 1
RE: "Sudden Death" - Axis Major Victory 28 Se... - 12/6/2016 9:19:11 PM   
Goodmongo

 

Posts: 346
Joined: 9/22/2011
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You the allies don't get the option. Only the Axis. See this:

. When Moscow, Leningrad and Stalingrad are in Axis hands and France has
surrendered, and there are no Allied units within 6 hexes of Paris or Nantes.

Germany will then be able to consider accepting peace, and if they do then the result will
be an Axis Major Victory.

So Germany got the choice and selected the victory.

You need to do more to help the SU. Do some more in NA. Land the US forces in France if it looks like Germany will take all 3 cities.

(in reply to Hotschi)
Post #: 2
RE: "Sudden Death" - Axis Major Victory 28 Se... - 12/6/2016 9:30:24 PM   
crispy131313


Posts: 2046
Joined: 11/30/2013
Status: offline
You can upload your most recent turn before this and go to options and turn off the decision event.

(in reply to Goodmongo)
Post #: 3
RE: "Sudden Death" - Axis Major Victory 28 Se... - 12/6/2016 9:39:06 PM   
Hotschi


Posts: 548
Joined: 1/18/2010
From: Austria
Status: offline
Thanks Goodmongo, that clears it up. Crispy, I was thinking about it already, but I won't do it, for 2 reasons; as it is, whenever you lose the game, the map is automatically revealed. So if I'd continue this game I would know each and every position of all Axis forces. And the second reason is, that the situation in Russia was already such a mess that it wouldn't help a lot.

I forgot to add, the Russian AI failed to destroy a single Axis unit, yes, not even one. It inflicts damage but doesn't destroy anything - maybe because its units were too weak for lack of applied upgrades.

I think I'd better play all Allies myself - if that helps

_____________________________

"A big butcher's bill is not necessarily evidence of good tactics"

- Wavell's reply to Churchill, after the latter complained about faint-heartedness, as he discovered that British casualties in the evacuation from Somaliland had been only 260 men.

(in reply to crispy131313)
Post #: 4
RE: "Sudden Death" - Axis Major Victory 28 Se... - 12/6/2016 10:03:20 PM   
Hartmann

 

Posts: 888
Joined: 11/28/2000
Status: offline
Seems I've been lucky so far as I've played this scenario thrice with Poland, France and Soviets AI controlled - me playing UK and US. I always won and the Germans NEVER took even one of the three towns (Leningrad, Stalingrad, Moscow).

Or maybe I gave them so much hell at sea and in Africa that they simply didn't have the resources to steamroll the Soviets like that. I also massively supported the Soviets with convoys until I felt they could hold their own without the UK convoy at least.

< Message edited by Hartmann -- 12/6/2016 10:06:05 PM >

(in reply to Hotschi)
Post #: 5
RE: "Sudden Death" - Axis Major Victory 28 Se... - 12/6/2016 11:29:31 PM   
Ohf

 

Posts: 29
Joined: 11/22/2016
Status: offline
You can go into the settings and uncheck the Victory scripts. That way they won't fire and you can keep playing.

(in reply to Hartmann)
Post #: 6
RE: "Sudden Death" - Axis Major Victory 28 Se... - 12/8/2016 5:05:54 PM   
BillRunacre

 

Posts: 4873
Joined: 7/22/2013
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hotschi


My full 1939 campaign as Allies suddenly ended 28 September 1942 with an Axis Major Victory, while my situation in Egypt stabilized and the U.S. was shipping it's Armies to occupy Algeria. I left the USSR to the AI. Leningrad and Stalingrad were swept clear by Germany and occupied with limited resistance. Only at Moscow, the USSR AI did offer some resistance. The game ended when Moscow was occupied by the Axis (err, it was, of all things, an Italian Tank Corps) and on the next turn the USSR failed to liberate it - in fact it didn't even try but attacked surrounding hexes, but NOT Moscow...

Here's the manual;

quote:


Winning the War – Victory Conditions

The Allies will win an Allied Decisive Victory if at any point they control Berlin, Rome,
Warsaw, Paris, London, Moscow and Washington D.C.

For an Axis Decisive Victory, the Axis need to capture Paris, Warsaw, Cairo, London,
Moscow, Leningrad and Stalingrad, while also retaining Berlin and Rome.

Conditions where the Allies can offer terms to end the war:

. When the USA is Allied but France and the USSR have surrendered and London is in
Axis hands, and there are no Allied units within 6 hexes of Paris or Nantes.
. When the USA is Allied but France, the USSR and Egypt have surrendered, and there
are no Allied units within 6 hexes of Paris or Nantes.
. When Moscow, Leningrad and Stalingrad are in Axis hands and France has
surrendered, and there are no Allied units within 6 hexes of Paris or Nantes.

Germany will then be able to consider accepting peace, and if they do then the result will
be an Axis Major Victory.


Tip! If you wish to play on even when the above Victory Conditions have been met, turn
off all Victory scripts by going to Options -> Advanced -> Scripts.


As I understand it, when condition 3 applies - as in my case - I, as Allies, can offer to quit, but this was not the case, the game simply ended. Is this intended?

Anyway, I've learned a lesson; don't let Russia be played by the AI, for multiple reasons; it doesn't seem to upgrade its units, it doesn't seem to attempt to build up a frontline, and it doesn't care about holding its three most important cities.

Lesson #2 is to search for the script responsible for this "mess" about a sudden Major Axis Victory; I wanted to fight on as Britain and US...


Hi Hotschi

What's happened is that both the Axis and Allies have a Decision Event, one to offer terms and the other to accept them or reject them.

The AI is set to always say yes, so that when playing the computer only the human player gets to make the decision.

However, in this instance, as cities in the USSR have been captured, the Allied power presented with the Decision is the USSR, and as it's been set to be controlled by the AI, it has of course accepted the terms.

There is no actual way to prevent this in games where the relevant Major being asked to offer/accept/reject terms is set to be AI controlled, so I recommend turning off the Major Victory scripts in this instance when playing.

Or switching to manually controlling the relevant Major when you can see that one of the conditions has been met. The first two conditions lead to the USA being asked whether or not to accept them, while the third is offered to the USSR as they are the ones who are in the front line and would have to make the decision on whether or not to continue the fight.

Bill

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(in reply to Hotschi)
Post #: 7
RE: "Sudden Death" - Axis Major Victory 28 Se... - 12/8/2016 9:00:54 PM   
mavraamides


Posts: 447
Joined: 4/1/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hotschi

I think I'd better play all Allies myself - if that helps


You can let the AI play Poland, lol!

(in reply to Hotschi)
Post #: 8
RE: "Sudden Death" - Axis Major Victory 28 Se... - 12/8/2016 9:02:51 PM   
Goodmongo

 

Posts: 346
Joined: 9/22/2011
Status: offline
AI Poland in my current game as UK/US still held out till November 1939. AI Germany sometimes has real problems on the attack.

(in reply to mavraamides)
Post #: 9
RE: "Sudden Death" - Axis Major Victory 28 Se... - 12/9/2016 9:50:27 AM   
Hartmann

 

Posts: 888
Joined: 11/28/2000
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Goodmongo

AI Poland in my current game as UK/US still held out till November 1939. AI Germany sometimes has real problems on the attack.


Another reason to not play France human controlled. In my very first try as the Allies I had to abort my game because the German AI didn't get anything off the ground. When I chose to instead just play UK/US on my next try, I had a very fun and challenging game where I was not sure I'd win until about fall/winter 1942.

(in reply to Goodmongo)
Post #: 10
RE: "Sudden Death" - Axis Major Victory 28 Se... - 12/9/2016 10:38:37 PM   
Mantis


Posts: 127
Joined: 9/10/2000
From: Edmonton, Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hartmann

I also massively supported the Soviets with convoys until I felt they could hold their own without the UK convoy at least.


OK that is something I've never been quite clear on. Aside from the decision events to start (or not) the convoys, am I missing something? From context in this and other messages, it sounds like you guys are increasing/decreasing/or outright stopping and starting the convoys ala ToF. I thought there was a DE and that was it?

(in reply to Hartmann)
Post #: 11
RE: "Sudden Death" - Axis Major Victory 28 Se... - 12/9/2016 11:13:05 PM   
Hartmann

 

Posts: 888
Joined: 11/28/2000
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mantis


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hartmann

I also massively supported the Soviets with convoys until I felt they could hold their own without the UK convoy at least.


OK that is something I've never been quite clear on. Aside from the decision events to start (or not) the convoys, am I missing something? From context in this and other messages, it sounds like you guys are increasing/decreasing/or outright stopping and starting the convoys ala ToF. I thought there was a DE and that was it?


You can change the amount of MPPs you send them on the convoy screen!

(in reply to Mantis)
Post #: 12
RE: "Sudden Death" - Axis Major Victory 28 Se... - 12/10/2016 7:21:24 PM   
Hotschi


Posts: 548
Joined: 1/18/2010
From: Austria
Status: offline
Okay, contrary to my first decision I carried on, deactivated DE's 616, 641 and 646 and played until July 44. The Eastern Front stabilized for a while, but it ended in complete disaster. Watch the south, watch the south...

Other things I learned;
.) Level 2 ASW doesn't help when the U-Boats are already at Lvl 4
.) Plan invasions early, as it takes a while to sail east over the great pond...
.) It doesn't help yourself when you stuff southern Italy full with troops as you hinder your own movement...

And finally;

I LOVE this game!

_____________________________

"A big butcher's bill is not necessarily evidence of good tactics"

- Wavell's reply to Churchill, after the latter complained about faint-heartedness, as he discovered that British casualties in the evacuation from Somaliland had been only 260 men.

(in reply to Hartmann)
Post #: 13
RE: "Sudden Death" - Axis Major Victory 28 Se... - 12/10/2016 8:31:42 PM   
Hartmann

 

Posts: 888
Joined: 11/28/2000
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hotschi

Okay, contrary to my first decision I carried on, deactivated DE's 616, 641 and 646 and played until July 44. The Eastern Front stabilized for a while, but it ended in complete disaster. Watch the south, watch the south...

Other things I learned;
.) Level 2 ASW doesn't help when the U-Boats are already at Lvl 4
.) Plan invasions early, as it takes a while to sail east over the great pond...
.) It doesn't help yourself when you stuff southern Italy full with troops as you hinder your own movement...

And finally;

I LOVE this game!


These were all important lessons!

Regarding invasions: I found that the UK does Overlord well enough without the US. So what I do is I ship the US troops with normal transports to the five hexes South of the East Coast which brings them to the Red Sea (in 4 turns). From Egypt you can invade Italy and/or Greece to your heart's content.

(in reply to Hotschi)
Post #: 14
RE: "Sudden Death" - Axis Major Victory 28 Se... - 12/11/2016 12:30:44 AM   
Mantis


Posts: 127
Joined: 9/10/2000
From: Edmonton, Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hartmann

You can change the amount of MPPs you send them on the convoy screen!


How did I miss this?!!? Thank you!

(in reply to Hartmann)
Post #: 15
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